The technology for electronic drums has hit a milestone in performance and realism.

I have been a drummer most of my life, and have owned some of the best acoustic kits made. In that timeframe, I occasionally dabbled with electronic drums, and purchased a few Roland kits that were nice... but just not playable in gigs because of realism and reliability issues.

That was then. After auditioning a set of Roland TD-25KV's , the next day I just went out and bought them. I have never, ever, experienced such playability and realism in an electronic set, and I am still astounded with the advance in this technology which finally rivals a true, professional acoustic kit. The kit not only plays like their acoustic counterparts, but the hundreds of super realistic sounds that you can assign to them just blows me away. It is like owning 100 drum kits.

I just wanted to point this revelation out to those that play drums, and have been turned off in the past with the limmitations that they had over the years. I gig with a pair of powered JBL 615 Eon's with a JBL subwoofer attached to each. Incredible, and now the ability to easily and effectively mix with the rest of the band, has made all of the difference in the world to me.

I would be interested in any other percussion people here on ATS with this experience, or any questions you might have.

Thanks!

a reply to: charlyv

I was impressed when I first got the TD-10EX but, I only sequence so getting players to feel comfortable has been difficult because of the delay.

I'll check it out, it's high praise for a drummer to recommend an electronic kit.

My house mate who was doing a Music degree while we were at uni built his own electric kit for about a quarter the price of the decent ones going, if you know a little electronics they're pretty easy to make with some pads, piezo's and a MIDI interface to convert the incoming piezo signal into a MIDI signal for your DAW.

As an example



There's load of info on the web to build your own kit, when it comes to the kits it's more about the samples you have than the kit itself

a reply to: charlyv

In my day, big part of live concert performance was the drummer. Not just the sound, but the overall skill display of ferocity banging all the 'surfaces', what a show. The drum solo was almost as good the lead guitar solo, in some cases stole the show. Led Zep comes to mind. Grateful Dead, Early Genesis and Santana, among others, runners up. Practice, performance, polish, display.

What does your electronic 'kit' look like?

Edit:

a reply to: Discotech

Thanks Discotech, thats the bomb. Whats a setup like that cost?

originally posted by: Discotech
My house mate who was doing a Music degree while we were at uni built his own electric kit for about a quarter the price of the decent ones going, if you know a little electronics they're pretty easy to make with some pads, piezo's and a MIDI interface to convert the incoming piezo signal into a MIDI signal for your DAW.

As an example

There's load of info on the web to build your own kit, when it comes to the kits it's more about the samples you have than the kit itself

The difference here is night and day. You could make some great sounds, but the delays and unrealistic patches, coupled with the non-mesh heads and tin sounding cymbals made it only acceptable for simple studio work. Go audition one of these new Roland sets to see what I mean, it just has to be experienced.

BTW: Nice Riff and nice DIY work!

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: charlyv

In my day, big part of live concert performance was the drummer. Not just the sound, but the overall skill display of ferocity banging all the 'surfaces', what a show. The drum solo was almost as good the lead guitar solo, in some cases stole the show. Led Zep comes to mind. Grateful Dead, Early Genesis and Santana, among others, runners up. Practice, performance, polish, display.

What does your electronic 'kit' look like?

Edit:

a reply to: Discotech

Thanks Discotech, thats the bomb. Whats a setup like that cost?

This is the kit.



It is not my intention to have this thread be an advertisement for Roland. (Saying that, probably a damned good one they don't have to pay for!) Seriously, This is completely impartial. They just happen to make this incredible instrument and the purpose here is just let everyone know how different it really is.

a reply to: intrptr

I think it cost about around £300 when my housemate built his but he already had stands and some pads

I'm not a drummer myself but it seemed like a fun and interesting project and it sounded great with no delay on hitting the pads, we were all music related degree students in the house, my pet project was building a bass synthesiser based on Rolands 303

@Discotech It's a combination of the kit AND samples. You need a pad that can trigger many samples depending on the velocity. i.e. if you tap the pad or whack it, it doesn't play the same sample quietly or loudly. It plays a sample based on the velocity of the stick. Some kits change the sample depending where you hit the pad such as the edge, or the middle. Sample quality is important and it seems as if Roland have nailed both. I've been a Roland user since the 80s when I bought a DR-110. Still love the Clap on that machine!

originally posted by: uktorah
@Discotech It's a combination of the kit AND samples. You need a pad that can trigger many samples depending on the velocity. i.e. if you tap the pad or whack it, it doesn't play the same sample quietly or loudly. It plays a sample based on the velocity of the stick. Some kits change the sample depending where you hit the pad such as the edge, or the middle. Sample quality is important and it seems as if Roland have nailed both. I've been a Roland user since the 80s when I bought a DR-110. Still love the Clap on that machine!

To me, the big difference was consistency. When you have been playing in a band with acoustics, changing it out can change the overall presence of the group. I was able to call up a copy of my acoustic kit (Gretsch Reknown/legacy), and with minor tweaking in sensitivity and cymbals.. we were all amazed. The technology in the double and tripple triggers and the sound module are responsible for this capability.

a reply to: Discotech

my pet project was building a bass synthesiser based on Rolands 303

Hmm, did you ever complete that project? The Roland 303 is bad ass. One of the guys in our group tried to get it to sound like the incredible bass lines in Royksopp's "Eple (Black Strobe Remix)" and "Vision One") It is so close....

Spending time with that puppy could probably produce or augment some of the best bass lines done.

a reply to: charlyv

Thanks, it certainly 'looks' different, i mean the same. If at all, how often do you replace components like acoustic drummers replace? Drum heads, for instance?

Not at all? Sorry for being ignorant, lots of others are too, I'm sure.

Edit:

2600 US, for the basics (whistles)

a reply to: charlyv
I'm glad you're pleased with the purchase but I think a real kit still has more stage presence.
No offense at all, but most electronic kits look like they're an Xbox addon

originally posted by: uktorah
a reply to: charlyv
I'm glad you're pleased with the purchase but I think a real kit still has more stage presence.
No offense at all, but most electronic kits look like they're an Xbox addon

No offence taken. The flagship Roland TD-30 line , in which my kit is one down and modelled after, is much flashier in the depth of the shells, colors.. etc. , they can run $7 to 8k. Oddly enough there is virtually no difference in the play ability or the sound between the two. A personal experience with one is the only way to tell.

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: charlyv

Thanks, it certainly 'looks' different, i mean the same. If at all, how often do you replace components like acoustic drummers replace? Drum heads, for instance?

Not at all? Sorry for being ignorant, lots of others are too, I'm sure.

Edit:

2600 US, for the basics (whistles)

First, drum sticks. You will rarely ever break one. Huge savings if you gig.
The web mesh pads are very resilient and I would think gigged, 3 to four years. They are replaceable just like a regular drum head and tuneable for response (not sound, that is all handled by the trons)
I had a TD-9 set 7 years ago that was mesh, and they were not like a skin, but big improvements have been made.

To a drummer the ability to make the snare sound completely realistic in the way it is played and the sounds is paramount.
Long sustained, low volume fast rolls are possible now, with a different sound anywhere inside the pad and on the rims. Using brushes sound like using brushes. That you gotta see as well.

a reply to: charlyv

Yep I did, it was only thanks to a reverse engineering open source project called xoxbox that I managed to build it as they sold kits with all the parts, PCB and housing but you had to build it yourself, works pretty well to be honest and sounds as close to the real 303 as you'll ever get, even better when you run it through a decent distortion pedal. And then I just use a DAW to draw the midi notes as I'm not a fan of the manual sequencer it has. Cost me £200 for the kit, but you can buy them ready built off ebay for around £300/400 and miles cheaper than paying over £1,000 for an original 303 as they've become a kind of new age antique

Would you drummers advise a beginner to start with electric or not?

Does it make a difference when starting out?

a reply to: Discotech

Excellent. I love it when retro stuff gets emulated and gets a new life. Some of it was so unique, and had such characteristics that you do not find today, except in VST's of them and the like. Cool stuff and keep improving it!

a reply to: Bluesma

I would recommend starting out with a cheaper acoustic kit, low end lines in the big boys like Yamaha and Gretsch.
The cheaper digital sets do not have the feel you need to develop initially, and basically you will decide after a few years if you want to go on... then consider a kit like what I am talking about, since you will know exactly how to play it, and appreciate what it is doing.

originally posted by: charlyv
a reply to: Bluesma

I would recommend starting out with a cheaper acoustic kit, low end lines in the big boys like Yamaha and Gretsch.
The cheaper digital sets do not have the feel you need to develop initially, and basically you will decide after a few years if you want to go on... then consider a kit like what I am talking about, since you will know exactly how to play it, and appreciate what it is doing.

Thank you! That is kind of what I was wondering. I have a five piece Pearl to start with, I just thought I should develop a feel for this at first- though digital looks like it might have some advantages later on.

Well soon they will be playing themselves (I am sure they already do)

But are they artistic?

And when the power goes out...