So, this is how a Milennial sees a solution to the "Living Wage" issue....

a reply to: CoBaZ

A minimum wage is not the same thing as a basic income.

Basic income is a guaranteed amount to establish what the poverty line is, then people actually work to bring in an income.

A minimum wage increase is just that, raising the minimum people can pay you to work.

The basic income is a substitute for expensive government programs and bureaucracy.

-FBB

wow that much difference between the work ethic of millennials and gen X

originally posted by: FriedBabelBroccoli

I don't want to be rude so don't answer if it makes you uncomfortable, but were you making 35,000 in 1980?

Looking back at 1980 I was making 400 per month so lets go with 1986 where I was an E5 in the AF on flight pay making about 120 for flight pay, 1100 base pay, 165 food and 400 housing (CA was not cheap) so about 1700 per month, or 43,000 based on your calculator.

Also you forgot mandatory healthcare which at 35k will run you several hundred dollars a month (more if you have a child or children).

A car and insurance with gas and maintenance if you live in an area with poor public transportation.

Did you include utilities in your rent or the expendables?

How much are you planning on saving for a rainy day fund?

-FBB

I guess that is my point what does it cost to live today, I'm not trying to debate you on this...hehe

a reply to: nullafides

Doesn't the top percentage of top earners pay the majority of all tax monies in the USA.

How can we expect them to pay more?

a reply to: Xtrozero

you numbers are high??
right now I am sharing a two bedroom trailer with two of my sons (can't see us being able to afford a three....for reason I don't want to get into. )

$600 for rent
electricity which well, in the winter could run close to 200
two cars, insurance for them, and gas of course
internet/phone...no cable, don't need it really.
and food, which at the moment, I am making sure the kids have something to eat everyday but having a fend for yourselves every other day and well, don't think they've caught on yet that I am back to eating every other day.
all in all, I think we can make it with something around $1100 .....
which you'd think we'd be doing great but well, it seems that the two sons just can't seem to have an income at the same time, and there's a possibility that we might have a stretch with neither of them having much of an income. I am getting SSI at the present time, and well, they don't give much...
thus the eating every other day....

a reply to: CoBaZ

How the hell do you live on 60 per week for food? hehe

That is my point in all this as we look at living cost. When one person says they need 35k to live on I say prove it, and if they do then so be it, but when I add up the basics as you have done I see a different number. I guess my days of living in an apartment with a roommate, no phone, just a bed, couch, kitchen table and everything else was boards and cinder blocks. A motorcycle as transportation is all old school these days.

I remember times where I had a 5 dollar bill and 3 days to pay day and I had to decide do I keep it for gas or what..hehe

a reply to: Xtrozero

It certainly costs less to be single with room mates, but far more if you have a family.

I am not one for the hard liberal progressive utopian ideal, but I view the massive disparity of income and wealth in this country as evidence of its failure to meet its founder's goals. Honestly the income inequality is reaching levels only found in monarchies and despotic regimes.

A basic income would act as a barrier to keep large portions of the country from seeing riots like back in the old days. It would reduce the time poor people waste having to go wait in lines at government depots for benefits ( and thus have more time to find jobs) and support local economies with little liquid capital (ie cash) to expand. All without the need for such a large government workforce that just checks IDs, tell people to have a seat, and watch porn on their taxpayer provided computers.

The idea that it is a free ride comes from the interpretation of the fools that work at Gawker.

The nations that are testing the basic income are not providing an amount greater than to house and feed the person. Outside of that the recipient has to go and find a job.

-FBB

a reply to: Xtrozero

I only need that much (35k) to support a fam of 5 (not kids mind you, but active adults)...and 2 dogs.

I live within my means though.

a reply to: Xtrozero

I buy sausages for about $1 for a day's worth, and well rice isn't that expensive really.... we eat that about two to three times a week. of course, you can't really care much about your health but I could do it... I could do better at it if I trusted my well water more but I really don't want to drink it without boiling it first so I use it to clean with and cook food with but won't drink it straight from the tap.

a reply to: LesMisanthrope

I would.

...and it is an economic nightmare.

a reply to: Xtrozero

The 60 a week is easy,

There are little prepackaged pasta meals for about a buck a piece, takes two to make a good meal, we buy about 10.

then tuna runs about 1.20 a big can 2 of them that uses up about 4 of the packages above

Bread 95 cents a loaf for the cheep stuff.

Milk is a Harder bite at 3.50 a gallon

Eggs 1.25 a dozen

Chicken packages of Thigh Quarters 6.50 a bag (divides up into about 3 chicken meals from the above)

that is the basics, then you throw in hot dogs 99 a package, 1.25 for the buns.

Kectup 1.50 a bottle that lasts 3 weeks.

Mustard 1.50 again 3 weeks

mayo 1.79 (spring for Mircle whip in the glass jar)

The Ouch is the Folders coffee at 5.23

Sugar in the raw at .99 a box of 25 packs x3

Great Value Tea Bags at 2.50

Occasionally a Tube of Beef at around 5.80

Package of noodles at .99 cents

Ragu sauce at 3.00

Bag generic breakfast flakes 3.50 a bag

Comes out to about 55.62 before any coupons if we get lucky...

Occasionally go nuts and get soda pops at 1.00 a 2 litter.

That is how we do it under 60 a week, been doing it for 10 years now.

CoBaZ

originally posted by: dawnstar
a reply to: Xtrozero

you numbers are high??
right now I am sharing a two bedroom trailer with two of my sons (can't see us being able to afford a three....for reason I don't want to get into. )

$600 for rent
electricity which well, in the winter could run close to 200
two cars, insurance for them, and gas of course
internet/phone...no cable, don't need it really.
and food, which at the moment, I am making sure the kids have something to eat everyday but having a fend for yourselves every other day and well, don't think they've caught on yet that I am back to eating every other day.
all in all, I think we can make it with something around $1100 .....
which you'd think we'd be doing great but well, it seems that the two sons just can't seem to have an income at the same time, and there's a possibility that we might have a stretch with neither of them having much of an income. I am getting SSI at the present time, and well, they don't give much...
thus the eating every other day....

I'm sorry for your struggles, 1100 is no where near great, hell I would not say 50k is great for a full family. Your lifestyle is much like that prior to 1990s in terms of expenses. Do you eat rice? My wife is Asian and rice is with almost every meal. You can do a lot with it mixing many different ways with meats beans veggies. Go to an Asian food market and get 50 pound bag for 25 to 30 dollars that comes out to 400 cooked rice servings and if each of you ate two services per day that would come out to over 2 months. Get a cheap rice cooker there too and enjoy since there is nothing like having hot rice ready 24/7

originally posted by: FriedBabelBroccoli
The nations that are testing the basic income are not providing an amount greater than to house and feed the person. Outside of that the recipient has to go and find a job.

-FBB

I do think minimum needs to go up, and when I say up I would put it at about 10 per hour. I just do not see a burger flipper a BK making a living wage ever, so I do not know what this means as we look into the future.Do we all downsize? I do not know.

a reply to: Xtrozero
my husband passed away in febuary of this year. about a month or two before that, we bought a rather large bag of rice, which well, that along with a package of sausage which is costing me about a buck a day and about a third package of frozen vegetables, I can make a pretty decent meal.... chicken is rather cheap also, and works well... cheap pizzas are 3/$7, ect.... like as said...as long as you don't worry about your health....

a reply to: CoBaZ
The 60 a week is easy,

My hat off to you..hehe

In another post I suggested rice. At 400 serving in a 50 pound bag that cost 25 to 30 bucks that is a lot of food at 7 cents a serving. Asian markets have a lot of cheap noddles and other stuff too that you would be surprised at the low cost.

I knew I was going to read a bunch of bull# about picking yourself up by your bootstraps from a bunch of people who grew up taking advantages of Americas best economy during the 80,90, and very early 2000's.

Go ahead and try it now and see what the real issues are instead of claiming a bunch of bull# from your ivory towers, you know nothing all you have is a personal experience unrelated able with no facts to back it up.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: FriedBabelBroccoli
The nations that are testing the basic income are not providing an amount greater than to house and feed the person. Outside of that the recipient has to go and find a job.

-FBB

I do think minimum needs to go up, and when I say up I would put it at about 10 per hour. I just do not see a burger flipper a BK making a living wage ever, so I do not know what this means as we look into the future.Do we all downsize? I do not know.

That is why I view the basic income concept favourably. Technology is going to eliminate much of the work that people do today and new jobs will generally require a great deal of education and training beyond what many people seem capable of today.

I see it in contrast to the ideal many profess in the justice system 'X would rather see a guilty man go free then wrongly punish an innocent man.' Except in this case it is 'X would rather help an abuser of the system then refuse to help an honest person in need.'

I would very much like to avoid the dystopian blade runner future which is coming down the pipeline.

-FBB

I've said it 100x over, and I'll say it once again. We have the capabilities NOW to ensure that no one born today goes without a home, food, and water. 40 billion worldwide could end hunger and homelessness across the globe. 40 Billion...
The defense budget for the US alone was 601 billion in 2015. It's a drop in the bucket.

I'm by no means a full blown socialist or liberal. But there's something to be said when we have the capability to end hunger and homelessness and refuse because we're too damn greedy as a society to force our world leaders to do it.

Everyone deserves the means to food, shelter, and water. However, if you want that 60" tv, or 2015 Hummer, or that 3,000 sqft home, then yes... work for it and earn it. Outside of that, we don't accept the world for what it is. We can change it if only we'd get over the greed.

a reply to: Xtrozero

the thing is though, that burger king is open when school is in session and far later than high school kids should be out really... in other words they need adults working there also. one can argue that school kids can do with minimum wage jobs, but when it comes to adults, which anyone out of high school I consider an adult and should be making due without mom and dad's help (what the heck my husband was supporting himself at the age of 16) , well they need more than a minimum wage. and when you have worked for the same company for 7 or more years, you should be getting something that not only should be supporting yourself, but also supporting at least half of what is need to raise up a kid or two.

a reply to: dawnstar

Don't waste your time debating with them.

69% of the economy is service sector.

Simple facts people simple facts.