Current Trend in Cognitive Biasing is Corrupting the Idea of Liberty.

The question:

Should a government provide all citizens with the state of being free within society from oppressive restrictions imposed by authority on any citizens way of life, behaviour, or political views?

In the United States, the federal government affords its citizens a large degree of personal freedom thanks to the bill of rights and other amendments to the constitution, yet some citizens seem to feel that only their idea's of liberties are protected and others who are different are somehow not protected.

Current trends in outright fake news published only to inspire hate and fear are polarizing western society into camps that want personal liberty for their own beliefs and restrictions to all others. Catlin Dewey explores this topic in her recent article for the Washington Post:

Walter Quattrociocchi, the head of the Laboratory of Computational Social Science at IMT Lucca in Italy, has spent several years studying how conspiracy theories and misinformation spread online, and he confirmed some of my fears: Essentially, he explained, institutional distrust is so high right now, and cognitive bias so strong always, that the people who fall for hoax news stories are frequently only interested in consuming information that conforms with their views — even when it’s demonstrably fake.

Link

The internet is becoming a propaganda machine creating the justification for all ideologies regardless of their rationality. The internet has become the most powerful legitimizing agent ever used by people, so internet responsibility should become a focus in western education. The world can not allow fear and hate to replace the values of rational thought.

Lastly, I would like to thank those ATSers out there who are still exposing the fake news and bigotry. I admit that I fall for these stories some of the time, and I am glad there are voices here who reach out like a torch of rationality in the darkness of ignorance and save those that they can.

a reply to: hubrisinxs

Lastly, I would like to thank those ATSers out there who are still exposing the fake news and bigotry.

…has spent several years studying how conspiracy theories and misinformation spread online…

Everything that goes against the main scream is called conspiracy theory by the main scream. Imo, they are ones spreading lunacy to justify eventually shutting it down.

Can't have truth bombs mucking up their propaganda.

a reply to: intrptr

That sounds great in theory but the "truth bombs" are about as rare as hen's teeth. In eschewing the mainstream, people are simply flocking toward a fringe that even less concerned with the truth.

What we need is principled independent journalism and that's not what people are getting from the "alternative media" either. Instead we're throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

I know it's an inconvenient truth. ....

It's about money and the media gives the people what they want!! Capitalism at its most absurd...

It's the biz...production costs money and we want to make a profit!!!

Join us and be the change you seek with your very own media platform.

Start here....

www.celtx.com...

What do you mean by liberty?

For some it means simply being able to do what they want when they want without taking responsibility for the results of their actions.

For some it means freedom to take full responsibility for ourselves and our lives.

In the same way I ignore people who repeatedly say "trust me" I treat the mainstream the same. They feel the need to constantly tell us that they're agenda-less and none biased. It's just horse poop.

Let your news speak for itself and reveal the facts. It's just too Orwellian and incredibly uncomfortable to see constant reminders of how trustworthy they are, especially as it's them (as a for profit business) saying it. It really is awkward.

a reply to: hubrisinxs

If you think the internet is bad, you should see what they say in books.

originally posted by: Joneselius
In the same way I ignore people who repeatedly say "trust me" I treat the mainstream the same. They feel the need to constantly tell us that they're agenda-less and none biased. It's just horse poop.

Let your news speak for itself and reveal the facts. It's just too Orwellian and incredibly uncomfortable to see constant reminders of how trustworthy they are, especially as it's them (as a for profit business) saying it. It really is awkward.

Here's a thought....

Reject all the horse poop, take some personal responsibility and become an internet media mogul and spread the message of truth as you see it. Crying on a www. forum doesn't get a lot done. Become a producer and change the world.

Try this for starters.....join us.

www.celtx.com...

a reply to: intrptr

So, ignore the lunacy of the lunatic fringe simply because the mainstream also lies and manipulates.

Great idea.

Can't have truth bombs mucking up their propaganda.

While I agree, you'd have to be pretty dense not to see how all this fake alt media stuff is literally radicalizing many people.
To ignore it is to ignore one of many enemies to rational thought and honest discourse.

a reply to: theantediluvian

Excellent response.

The government does not afford any of the rights listed in the Bill of Rights.

The Bill of Rights makes it very clear that every human is endowed with these certain inalienable rights simply by being human.

Propaganda predates the Internet and even the printing press. And the elite ruling class authoritarians have always tried to have a monopoly on it.

a reply to: theantediluvian

That sounds great in theory but the "truth bombs" are about as rare as hen's teeth.

Snowden and Manning truth bombs you mean. Speak for yourself. I take great efforts in landing hard where daily lies are fostered. This is the only place I reside.

In eschewing the mainstream, people are simply flocking toward a fringe that even less concerned with the truth.

The fringe is great, its the only place two way conversation is allowed. Compared to what was, this is light years ahead of water cooler and coffee machine conversation. Ordinary people post something and it can be picked up and carried round the world. Debate is golden, simply not allowable in the main scream.

a reply to: Jakal26

So, ignore the lunacy of the lunatic fringe…

Yah, 911 rubble, Nazi UFOs and fake moon landings aside…

…simply because the mainstream also lies and manipulates.

Thats all they do. The news media especially lies about world events. They foster the crap here to discredit sites like this.

Edit: "They", I should have said, you.

a reply to: hubrisinxs

The internet is becoming a propaganda machine creating the justification for all ideologies regardless of their rationality. The internet has become the most powerful legitimizing agent ever used by people, so internet responsibility should become a focus in western education. The world can not allow fear and hate to replace the values of rational thought.

That is so true.

It's true we have to move past the propaganda and fear. This is something I have notice many years ago.

I fell for many of the propaganda and fear myself and it cost me a lot of money because I believed in many of the lies and faked videos from fake whistle blowers.

For example Planet X.

a reply to: intrptr

The fringe is great, its the only place two way conversation is allowed.

Really?
Do you ever bother to read some of the commentary on a lot of these alt media sites? Or do you just ignore it when "your side" is screaming over others and simple sitting around confirming their own bias? Apparently, it's the latter, because at a lot of these alt media places, just like in the mainstream, anyone who questions the line being towed is labeled a "statist"...a "cop apologist"...a "government apologist"....a "sympathizer"...etc etc....
Hell, I've seen people call for the death of those that disagree with them time and time again, all the while, their circle jerking buddies are chanting and cheering it on (just like those idiots at mainstream sites unable and/or unwilling to take in information contrary to their own bias)

There is a lot of two way conversation and debate here, granted. But that is because this place is so heavily mod'd..if it wasn't it'd be the same thing.

The news media especially lies about world events. They foster the crap here to discredit sites like this.

I won't disagree with that, because we all know it to be true.

Edit: "They", I should have said, you.

Then you have to come along with your typical ad hom.
Are you capable of having a conversation/debate without it?

I'm not fostering any crap. I think the questions raised are legitimate...no matter how much the paranoid fringe wants to claim otherwise.
One cannot discount the effect that all media has on the brain and to ignore one while pushing the other is to be intellectually dishonest about it. You know that as well as I do, but you won't admit it here. You will continue to put words in my mouth, like you often do with everyone that in any way disagrees with you here, and won't listen to a damned word.

I'm not saying in any way, shape, or form that any media should be censored. But I see more and more fake and bogus skewed news from ALL sides and it is messing with those that refuse to read beyond headlines and click bait bs...then I see more and more people leaning into what is essentially extremism...

There is no middle ground anymore. "They" have won the war...we are so divided we can't even speak to each other without being a**es about it.

It's sad...and it's pathetic.

a reply to: Informer1958

I fell for many of the propaganda and fear myself and it cost me a lot of money because I believed in many of the lies and faked videos from fake whistle blowers.

As have I, in the past, when I wasn't as well versed on using this tool (the net) for all it's worth.
"They" got me with the "chemtrails" bit. Now, I'm not saying it's impossible, but the current fringe narrative is bogus.

I spent a LOT of time photographing, recording, speaking out about.....leading others astray. I will admit that.
It was only years later that I started to look into "the other side" of things and listen to arguments outside my own bias.

I don't regret it though. It taught me a lot about listening to all sides and reading that which is contrary to my own notions at any given time. So, in the end, it was worth it, I suppose. And, I have since spoken up many times about that to those I possibly led astray or misinformed. I've called out those perpetuating this scam, that is, in the end....all about $.

It's true we have to move past the propaganda and fear. This is something I have notice many years ago.

Question is, how (or is) that even possible at this junction?
I am not so sure I have a single idea or answer for that.

Like I said, "they've" won...all those that seek to divide us...they've won.
How do we as a society move beyond years of indoctrination and propaganda that is literally bringing us to the bring of our own demise? Entire generations hinge their thoughts on these garbage lies and I don't know that one can change their minds', at this point.

"You can sway a thousand men by appealing to their prejudices quicker than you can convince one man by logic."
-Robert A. Heinlein

a reply to: hubrisinxs

I think that the erosion of the concept of liberty in the minds of populations, is what allows the weakness of fear to take hold.

I hear from some very outwardly patriotic people, both around here, but mostly in daily life here in the UK, people who believe that their freedom (which is synonymous with liberty as I understand it) is at risk from people coming to our shores, or cultures springing up within our borders which are different from our own. But a true patriot in a nation which values liberty should not be concerned about that sort of thing in the least, when his or her own government is about the business of removing their freedoms, their liberty.

If freedom and liberty are something one seeks to protect, then one must understand that liberty only works when everyone has a precisely equal measure of it, otherwise no one, in FACT has any. In any state which hands liberty to one group, and refuses it to another, you have a tyranny, and are being controlled by those running the place. That is not acceptable, and the fact of the matter is, that anyone who values liberty enough to deserve it, would rather die than see his fellow human beings denuded of it.

Many of the self described patriots I have met and spoken to on matters political, have failed to grasp this element of things. The truth? I am a patriot, not because I mindlessly love my government, not because I ignore the failings of my nation in history, but because I love liberty, and because I love my nation enough to want to see its people afforded proper liberty, proper freedoms, to see them run their nation for themselves, to make better, and different mistakes than those which have been made in the past, rather than repeat old and decrepit ones.

True patriotism is realistic, inclusive, and values liberty enough to know that only when everyone has a piece of it, does anyone have it at all.

originally posted by: Jakal26
a reply to: intrptr

So, ignore the lunacy of the lunatic fringe simply because the mainstream also lies and manipulates.

Great idea.

Can't have truth bombs mucking up their propaganda.

While I agree, you'd have to be pretty dense not to see how all this fake alt media stuff is literally radicalizing many people.
To ignore it is to ignore one of many enemies to rational thought and honest discourse.

a reply to: theantediluvian

Excellent response.

The MSM is radicalizing people FAR more than the internet could ever dream. That's why we're a nation of war mongers - because the job some naively think the Internet is accomplishing has already been mastered, decades ago, by the MSM.

In fact the exact opposite is happening. The internet is finally allowing uncomfortable truths to come out, which 1) terrifies those invested in the status quo, and 2) terrifies all the dupes who still swallow corporate media, which includes what we're taught in school.

Of course there's loads of BS on the internet, but 1) nobody falls for most of it, and 2) the majority of what the mainstream calls BS is actually true. Like 9/11 Truth movements. This thread, if created in 2002, would probably have targeted and demonized such a group. I see neither logic nor reason going into the mindset being promoted here, but rather an appeal to authority which clasically masquerades as reason.

a reply to: intrptr

Snowden and Manning truth bombs you mean. Speak for yourself. I take great efforts in landing hard where daily lies are fostered. This is the only place I reside.

Those are poor examples. In both cases, you have whistleblowers who contacted mainstream media — Glenn Greenwald (Guardian US, former Salon.com columnist, has contributed to NYT and LA Times to name a few) and Kevin Poulsen (infamous hacker turned journalist, now a senior editor of Wired).

A far cry from Alex Jones and his cohorts.

The fringe is great, its the only place two way conversation is allowed. Compared to what was, this is light years ahead of water cooler and coffee machine conversation. Ordinary people post something and it can be picked up and carried round the world. Debate is golden, simply not allowable in the main scream.

Not really sure that you're making an apples to apples comparison? I'm an ardent believer in debate and we've certainly had a complete transformation in how people communicate over the last quarter century but that's got little to do with the accuracy of the information involved. Sure, many people are better informed than they would have been otherwise but at the same time, there are many others who are more misinformed than ever.

People need to be better consumers of information and that's just not what I see happening. Maybe I'm wrong but what I see is that people tend to find the sources that confirm their preexisting beliefs and hold them as more credible because they want to and not because of any objective consideration.

a reply to: theantediluvian

I agree most definitely. I am currently study journalism and have aspirations to become a principled independent journalist.