This is going just alittle too far.

Originally posted by Simon_Boudreaux

To me the museum is just a slap in the face for scientist and another way for the religious to push their views on the rest of the world.

The museum is not a slap in the face to anyone especially to the many scientists who do not support the ideas of a billions of years old earth or that humans share common ancestors with animals.

How does a museum funded by private donations push views on the world. If I post a link will I be pushing my views on the readers of this post?

www.answersingenesis.org...

Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

Romans 1:19-25

Neither presenting my views nor quoting scripture pushes them on anyone, just as the teachers who presented evolution to me did not push their views on me. God has endowed us with a magnificent mind and the freedom to use at as we wish for a good reason.

I can see it now, 50 years after the doors open, we'll have people claiming that Adam and Eve had x colour hair, and were X feet tall, were white of course with perfectly white gorgeous features. Their proof? Their remains are in the museum.

Now, if they were to include copies of every transcript written by every church father and Pope, that would be a true museum.

As long as its not Government money what is the problem? Does the Constitution not give EVERYONE freedom of speech? There are Museums dedicated to Witchcraft what is the difference here? If you dont like it dont go.

[edit on 6-1-2005 by Amuk]

Originally posted by Amuk
As long as its not Government money what is the problem? Does the Constitution not give EVERYONE freedom of speech? There are Museums dedicated to Witchcraft what is the difference here? If you dont like it dont go.

True. But the subtitile of this site is "Deny Ignorance", and this museum sounds like a fairly ignorant project.

I fully support their right to build it, people's right to visit it...AND defend my right to make fun of it!

Originally posted by Amuk
As long as its not Government money what is the problem? Does the Constitution not give EVERYONE freedom of speech? There are Museums dedicated to Witchcraft what is the difference here? If you dont like it dont go.

[edit on 6-1-2005 by Amuk]

As I said before I have no intentions of visiting the museum when it opens.

I'm not denying they have the right to build it.I'm not saying it shouldn't be built.It is their right to build it.The same as the witchcraft museums you talk about.However, I do think that some of the exhibits are a bit too extreme in the facts they present(or lack of)when schools teach in science class that the earth is in fact several billion years old not 6,000.We have artifacts that date back far more than the 6,000 years they talk of.We even have artifacts that date back to 2.8 billion years ago(which btw also goes against what science has taught because the artifacts are clearly made by an intelligent species human or otherwise) Amuk I think everyone has the right to express their beliefs no matter what they are but by placing a sign at the entrance stating that if you don't believe what they have inside or if you don't throw all your beliefs out the window and believe them then you are willfully ignorant.

Thought I would edit and add one of the artifacts I talked about before anyone tries to say yeah whatever where's your proof.

Over the past few decades miners in S.Africa had been finding these spheres that are about an inch in diameter,or the size of a large marble. Some with three grooves ethed around the equator.Two types of spheres have been found so far.One is composed of solid blue-ish metal with white flakes,the other is hollowed out and filled with a white spongy substance..The kicker is they were found in a rock called Precambrian and has been dated to 2.8 billion years ago..
Who made them and what for?

www.talkorigins.org...


Simon

[edit on 7-1-2005 by Simon_Boudreaux]

Originally posted by sntx

Originally posted by Simon_Boudreaux

To me the museum is just a slap in the face for scientist and another way for the religious to push their views on the rest of the world.

The museum is not a slap in the face to anyone especially to the many scientists who do not support the ideas of a billions of years old earth or that humans share common ancestors with animals.

How does a museum funded by private donations push views on the world. If I post a link will I be pushing my views on the readers of this post?

www.answersingenesis.org...

Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.

For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:

Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

Romans 1:19-25

Neither presenting my views nor quoting scripture pushes them on anyone, just as the teachers who presented evolution to me did not push their views on me. God has endowed us with a magnificent mind and the freedom to use at as we wish for a good reason.

If you open a place and have a sign at the entrance reading that if you DON"T discard everything you've been taught and believe in what they are presenting or you are an ignorant person yes that is pushing your views on someone.

Originally posted by Simon_Boudreaux
Amuk I think everyone has the right to express their beliefs no matter what they are but by placing a sign at the entrance stating that if you don't believe what they have inside or if you don't throw all your beliefs out the window and believe them then you are willfully ignorant.

But if your belief system would be shattered by this sign then YOU have a problem....LOL (not you personally just whoever)

I don't believe any of it, or the witch museum either, but that is just me. If built with your own money I have no problem with you placing sign calling all Non-believers "little satanic piggies" or whatever. Are susposed to make sure everyone speaks "THE TRUTH" and if so whos truth should they speak?

I also support your right to poke fun at it, and start your own Museum claiming the Earth is in fact only three weeks old and Bill Gates created it and hang a sign over the door telling everyone what idiots they are if they cant see the truth.

Where the problem comes in is trying to have this nonsense taught in schools and such. THERE I have a problem

Exactly Amuk..What if someone goes to this museum to actually try and find faith or hope or god whatever the case may be this is the example they are going to get.Everything they have been taught in school everything they've ever read about the universe and planet earth how old it is and how it came to be.Everything they've been taught about the history of this planet will suddenly be all wrong.Some people might not be able to handle that kind of mindf**k

But like you I would have a problem if they were to try and teach this in schools.
Imagine a group of individuals getting their views taught to the whole school age population.
Now imagine that that same group be led by a person like Rev. Jim Jones.

Or run by the leaders of this church.
www.abovetopsecret.com...
I hope there is a god and he smites the people of this church until they they can be smited no more...and then smite them some more

[edit on 7-1-2005 by Simon_Boudreaux]

Originally posted by Simon_Boudreaux

If you open a place and have a sign at the entrance reading that if you DON"T discard everything you've been taught and believe in what they are presenting or you are an ignorant person yes that is pushing your views on someone.

Restating your assertion does not answer my question. The question "How is the museum pushing views on the world?" does not require an answer though. It is clear that the museum does not and in fact can not push views on anyone. Making a statement does not push views. Posting a sign does not push views. Airing a comercial does not push views. Teaching a course does not push views. Holding a gun at someones head and saying repeat after me does not push views. The point is as free moral agents we can form our own views on subjects and nothing that any person can say or do can force us to change our minds. That is one of the wonderful things about the human mind. It has been given to us as a free gift to use or not use however we want. That is why the term willingly ignorant is used in conjunction with being presented with biblical truth. What you hold in your mind is a choice. The good work of the many people that are making the Creation Museum possible can help make the choice an informed one.


Steve

Originally posted by sntx

Originally posted by Simon_Boudreaux

If you open a place and have a sign at the entrance reading that if you DON"T discard everything you've been taught and believe in what they are presenting or you are an ignorant person yes that is pushing your views on someone.

Restating your assertion does not answer my question. The question "How is the museum pushing views on the world?" does not require an answer though. It is clear that the museum does not and in fact can not push views on anyone. Making a statement does not push views. Posting a sign does not push views. Airing a comercial does not push views. Teaching a course does not push views. Holding a gun at someones head and saying repeat after me does not push views. The point is as free moral agents we can form our own views on subjects and nothing that any person can say or do can force us to change our minds. That is one of the wonderful things about the human mind. It has been given to us as a free gift to use or not use however we want. That is why the term willingly ignorant is used in conjunction with being presented with biblical truth. What you hold in your mind is a choice. The good work of the many people that are making the Creation Museum possible can help make the choice an informed one.


Steve

If you don't consider any of the things you've listed above would you mind giving me an example as to what would be pushing views in your eyes?Several of those things can push views in the right setting.So seeing that we can agree to disagree I'd like to know.

I would also like to talk with the museum organizers to see how they came up with their information.

But to answer your question for you I'm leaning towards the concept of people wanting to fit in so to speak...they won't want to be "willfully ignorant".

To me it is pushing views that's my opinion it's the way that I see it the same as I see "recruiters"from the churches in my area coming to my house in the middle of nowhere and braving my dogs to tell me I need Jesus in my life pushing their views on me.Only difference is I don't have to visit the museum.Whether that makes any sense or not for you I don't know perhaps I just can't express myself the way I wish.

[edit on 10-1-2005 by Simon_Boudreaux]

Originally posted by Cherish

In six of whose days? The bible says that 1,000 of our years is one day to God...

Actually it says a thousand years is as one day to God. Ever feel that minutes seem like hours and vice-versa?

God is eternal, so a thousand years is like a day to Him. It doesn't mean that a thousand years IS one day.

Originally posted by Amethyst

Originally posted by Cherish

In six of whose days? The bible says that 1,000 of our years is one day to God...

Actually it says a thousand years is as one day to God. Ever feel that minutes seem like hours and vice-versa?

God is eternal, so a thousand years is like a day to Him. It doesn't mean that a thousand years IS one day.

Just because God is eternal why would a 1,000 years seem like a day to him?Eternal means forever,only meaning you live through a long amount of time it wouldn't speed it up or slow it down for you. Time is still time.

That being the case how many days(1,000 years) did he sit up in space twiddling his thumbs before he got bored and decided to make everything?I'd bet it took longer than 6 days(6,000 years as the museum is saying).

[edit on 10-1-2005 by Simon_Boudreaux]

Originally posted by Simon_Boudreaux

Originally posted by Amethyst

Originally posted by Cherish

In six of whose days? The bible says that 1,000 of our years is one day to God...

Actually it says a thousand years is as one day to God. Ever feel that minutes seem like hours and vice-versa?

God is eternal, so a thousand years is like a day to Him. It doesn't mean that a thousand years IS one day.

Just because God is eternal why would a 1,000 years seem like a day to him?Eternal means forever,only meaning you live through a long amount of time it wouldn't speed it up or slow it down for you. Time is still time.

That being the case how many days(1,000 years) did he sit up in space twiddling his thumbs before he got bored and decided to make everything?I'd bet it took longer than 6 days(6,000 years as the museum is saying).

[edit on 10-1-2005 by Simon_Boudreaux]

That's an interesting question, and my answer is it's something we humans won't be able to wrap our limited minds around.

God has a plan, that's all I know.