the bible and the practices of spanking observed

There are many forms of child abusing, and one i have observed during my time as a human was hitting a child under the pretense of training them.

When i have mentioned this to humans who believe this practice is necessary in order to raise a good child, they mention to me that as the bible tells them therefore it is essential to hit their children with a stick.

A good article about this topic: www.religioustolerance.org...

so let us take a look into the book called the bible, and see what is really the case because all of these humans who are in favor of hitting a child with a stick, belt, whip, switch, hand, i have not observed to have done their own research to the effects of this practice.

ALL the verses advocating spanking written in the bible are in PROVERBS. This addition to the bible does have some good wisdom in it i believe, but PROVERBES IS NOT A LITERAL BOOK. Nor is it the inherent word of god, but collections of wise quotes and metaphors written by KING SOLOMON, who turned to the dark side later in his life. Therefore this practice is derived from a questionable source, not JESUS who would know how to treat humans.

In PSALMS 23 we read of the shepherd comforting us with his rod and staff. in the metaphor that we are sheep and he is shepherd, in what case would he beat us with his staff? a shepherd does not beat his sheep, but therefore protects them from enemies with the rod and staff. the staff for protection, and the rod was to gently swat sheep on back of legs to direct them in the way the shepherd is herding them to pastures or water. This is not a punishment to the sheep for wrong doing but a reminder of what direction to walk.

The sheep are comforted by the presence of the shepherd because they feel safe, not afraid of him. Therefore if a child is afraid of their parent, their parent cannot direct their child in a good way and their child will get lost and run away.

included on this article are some good explanations of where humans who adhere to the bible get their ideas that spanking a child is right according to the bible. the most strong believers in this activities are people ignorant of what the bible actually says and the context it is written in.

i am always an advocate of not hitting children. many times my life seems not very purposeful but then god shows me how i can use my experience of my early life to educate people on this topic. jesus mentions very strongly how important it is to be gentle and kind to children.

"Mark 10:13-16
And they were bringing children to Him so that He might touch them; but the disciples rebuked them. But when Jesus saw this, He was indignant and said to them, "Permit the children to come to Me; do not hinder them; for the kingdom of God belongs to such as these. "Truly I say to you, whoever does not receive the kingdom of God like a child will not enter it at all.
And He took them in His arms and began blessing them, laying His hands on them."

Then again he says,

"And whoever receives one such child in My name receives Me; but whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in Me to stumble, it would be better for him to have a heavy millstone hung around his neck, and to be drowned in the depth of the sea."

To cause malfunction in how a child perceives the world is therfore to make child stumble. below is a link with an explanation why hitting a child is not good for them.

www.psychologytoday.com...

right now these last weeks ive been stuck in fragments of my mind that were broken off during early life due to frequent daily physical abuse under the guise of trying to "help me" under the methods of spanking. this was not all that caused the fragmentation but a good part of it, therefore it formed the input output functions of the brain.

from my perspective as a chiled 10% of it i could understand that i had done something wrong. 90% it i did not understand and it appeared as direct and personal attacts to me because they hated me.

during these times where i am stuck in a past fragment i can become very unhappy and the world seems to have no purpose and its easy to forget that it will only last until i can see past it. but now as writing this i know some good may come of it, there are a lot of parents or hurt people that may read this and i understand that if people see the truth, and realize they have believed something wrong about their believes and hurt people trying to do the right thing but are completely wrong.

i always was thinking if i saw a man hitting a child or a woman hitting a child i would go up to them and say " stop that you are killing your child." and tell them how it is not good for them.

but these practices are always done in secret because they are evil deeds, so i cannot fight these evils directly.

therefore if i can put this message where the world can see it, i have said this to all of humans.

I had an interesting conversation with a friend who is twice my age and also a Christian. Her parents were old school and she must of been spanked. After years of reflection on the bible verse that goes something like, ''spare the rod, spoil the child.'' She realized that the rod spoken of is used to describe discipline and not physical harm. The rod symbolizes wisdom and that children should be guided through teaching right action from wrong action by the adult who has already learned through life's mistakes how to be in the world.
I believe that through conversation and example, starting from birth, your child will be shown right from wrong. Sitting a child down in front of t.v. or other modern day gadget will never help a child. You need to be treating them as a fellow human being from the start and speak to them often and listen to what they have to say through the words they have learned. Children are far more than given credit for oftentimes and with proper communication skills from an early age, parents can better teach their children.

a reply to: sociolpath

Strange that the children of recent generations have little to no respect for anyone or anything... And were not spanked...

I can't say I know anyone around my age that didn't get their butts whipped when they were bad as a child

not that im advocating spanking a child...

but it seemed to work when it was normal practice

a reply to: sociolpath

You don't have any children, do you? I hope not. The attitude you have toward child rearing is what created the generation we see today who think they are special snowflakes and that the world owes them something. All kids are not the same and teaching discipline must be done differently for every child, but it must be done. Some kids need a smack on the butt at least once in their life. After setting the ground rules and enforcing them, a parent rarely has to resort to spanking again.

a reply to: sociolpath

Oh good lord. Okay so you were abused and I understand that it caused you problems.That I can feel for,but the issue of to spank or not to spank is a personal one that all parents have to make.It is like most things in life,it is in how you do it. I raised 2 boys and I spanked them. But here is the thing....I only spanked when absolutely necessary. I DID NOT use it to vent my own frustrations. It was a tool,one of many that parents have to use to show their kids what is right and what is wrong. So here were my rules on spanking:

1.Only when the child is doing something to endanger their life by defying you.
2.Only 3 swats allowed.If they don't get the point after 3 swats,you switch to another method.
3.Never spank when you are angry.Wait till you cool down first,then spank if you feel they crossed that endangering line.

My older sister and I were spanked nightly.Not too pleasant,but we were acting up and pushing the limits and we knew it.When my mother spanked,she refused to hurt her hand.So she grabbed her shoes (which were real rubber soles)and used those on us.I can still here her saying,"If your not sobbing,I wasn't effective". Now,did my mother abuse us at times? Yes. My sister and I both agree on that. But those were the times when if she had just talked to us,we could have understood what she wanted.Other times we out right deserved it. We knew we were pushing her and kept on till she did spank us. She didn't stop hitting either until she was worn out. I don't go by the bible so I don't worry about this or that passage. I know the bit about the rod is plucked out of the full quote of it being a Shepard rod used to GUIDE kids. But religious people have always had quite a track record of beating the crap out of their kids as far as I have seen.

I personally feel that done with the child's well being in mind,and done carefully,that spanking is but one of many tools a parent can use to discipline their kids. You can talk to your kids,but you can also be verbally abusive to them too,is that any better? No. Any type of discipline can be taken either to extremes or used AGAINST the child. It really depends on what the parents ultimate goal is.

My daughter is proof that you can raise a child to be well behaved without ever resorting to spanking...

We worked very hard to communicate to her our expectations of how she should behave and rather than 'threats' of 'punishment' we would explain what consequences would be faced if there was misbehavior.

Even from the time she was very small, people have come up to us in public and remarked how "good" she is -

- and with the ones who say 'how "lucky" we are to have such a well behaved child', I always reply, "Luck has nothing to do with it, we've put a lot of time and effort into teaching our daughter good behavior" -

- Because the reality is, it takes a whole lot more work to raise 'good' kids than to raise 'bad' ones, and most badly behaved children are simply the result of parents who (whether thru laziness or ignorance) have chosen the easy route of giving in and spoiling their kids instead of making the effort to teach them..

i can only present observations based on practices observed and personal experience. therefore i presented information. if you agree it is acceptable to strike a child, you will not observed a child being struck and it will contine as evil in the darkness.

the information provided is some truth on the subject to become a light to shine on the evil i am bringing to light. the ignorance on the subject is revealed in the information provided.

I use mild corporate punishment (spanking) never to hard and always with explaination and lots of love. Never with my hand only a small wooden paddle or spoon.

My oldest did something that really deserved a spanking. my child forged my signature on a teachers note. When they got home we had a talk. deep down I was tired of spanking and my child was getting to old to spank. So I counted my child out 10 swats, then I got down on my knees and bent over the bed handed the paddle to my child and instructed my child to spank me in my child's place. My child bawled like a baby and did as I instructed. I took my childs punishment. I talked to my child afterwards and explained that is what Jesus did for us, took our punishment upon the cross and died in our place.

My child has been very well behaved ever since.

Maybe a little is ok but abusiveness it is not.

a reply to: Akragon
You are making a jump in logic. There are a great many other factors that play a role in a childs behavior other than spanking. You may want to try looking at things like; parental involvment, television, the fact that children get very little out door time, social media, lack of community involvment including extended family, cultural additudes, and many other things that play a role in someones upbringing.

Spanking is one of a hundred different things that are different nowadays.

I think it is very possible that spanking was a huge dettriment to children in previous generations, but it was balanced out by many positives that todays children do not recive.

a reply to: calstorm

Yeah you're probably right...

Kids don't get in trouble as much these days because their faces are glued to some sort of social media...

On the other hand back in the day I never once saw a child speak to their parents the way kids do these days

I lipped off to my mom ONCE, and it never happened again.

And I've seen kids these days that need a good kick in the ass

I was spanked and I turned out fine.

I hated the spankings and was a master at timing the hand or spoon coming down so I could dart my wee hand between it and my soft fleshy cheeks. Then I'd cling to the spoon or wrist with all my wee might. They would say, "Don't do that. Do you want to add another swat?" I would answer yes to spite them.

But look at me now! (Nothing to see here, move along)

Dbl post. One for each cheek I guess.

originally posted by: sociolpath
the bible and the practices of spanking observed

What 135,000 years of insanity has shown us is that torture is not an effective practice because it is based on ignorance of two very important realities;
The first reality is that there is no 'free-will'. and the second is that we have no 'choice'!
That means that we do not 'choose' to do as we do, or even think as we think!
What we are is simply manifested in the moment!
Beating someone to cause them to 'think twice' in the future doesn't work in the torture of prison, or as torturing children!
If you have no 'choice', any and all 'punishment' is torture!

If all the absolute CRAP were trimmed from the bible, at most, there would be, maybe, 10 pages left.
At best, it would be just a Haiku!
But WHAT a Haiku! *__-

Violence has not worked (as a means to peace and Love and ethics and Virtue) for the last 130,000 years, it ain't gonna work today or tomorrow!
People hit their kids out of frustration, ego, ignorance, mean cussedness, because their insane parents abused them by the same means and, by God, if it was good enough for me, it's good enough for the kids!
In Jesus name!
Dis-gusting!

"I got beat and I am fine!"
What is that, Stockholm Syndrome!
How pathetic!
Insanity passed from generation to generation!
Excuses to hit!
How sad and ignorant!

originally posted by: ChesterJohn
I use mild corporate punishment (spanking) never to hard and always with explaination and lots of love. Never with my hand only a small wooden paddle or spoon.

My oldest did something that really deserved a spanking. my child forged my signature on a teachers note. When they got home we had a talk. deep down I was tired of spanking and my child was getting to old to spank. So I counted my child out 10 swats, then I got down on my knees and bent over the bed handed the paddle to my child and instructed my child to spank me in my child's place. My child bawled like a baby and did as I instructed. I took my childs punishment. I talked to my child afterwards and explained that is what Jesus did for us, took our punishment upon the cross and died in our place.

My child has been very well behaved ever since.

Maybe a little is ok but abusiveness it is not.

Dear God...

a reply to: NowWhat

Don't act so shocked.

And don't worry none of my children are abused nor ever have been, and like another I get compliments on how well behaved, well mannered and respectful my children are.

All I have to do is look at the protesters at the colleges going on and see the results of non spanking, a bunch of manipulating, arrogant, self confuted crybabies who wont stop stomping their feet until they get what they want.

If someone claims to follow the path of Jesus, and they are striking their child, I do not believe they are following the teachings of Jesus.

If they are not following the teachings of Jesus and they use scripture to prove their points of life, I cannot believe what they say is true.

Jesus would never strike a child.

originally posted by: sociolpath
If someone claims to follow the path of Jesus, and they are striking their child, I do not believe they are following the teachings of Jesus.

If they are not following the teachings of Jesus and they use scripture to prove their points of life, I cannot believe what they say is true.

Jesus would never strike a child.

Ain't THAT the Truth!!!

originally posted by: sociolpath
If someone claims to follow the path of Jesus, and they are striking their child, I do not believe they are following the teachings of Jesus.

If they are not following the teachings of Jesus and they use scripture to prove their points of life, I cannot believe what they say is true.

Jesus would never strike a child.

Yet some would say Jesus didn't agree with everything that was said in the old scriptures...

Whoever strikes his father or mother shall be put to death. Exodus 21:15

If one curses his father or mother, his lamp will go out at the coming of darkness. Proverbs 20:20

All who curse their father or mother must be put to death. They are guilty of a capital offense. Leviticus 20:9

originally posted by: Akragon

originally posted by: sociolpath
If someone claims to follow the path of Jesus, and they are striking their child, I do not believe they are following the teachings of Jesus.

If they are not following the teachings of Jesus and they use scripture to prove their points of life, I cannot believe what they say is true.

Jesus would never strike a child.

Yet some would say Jesus didn't agree with everything that was said in the old scriptures...

Whoever strikes his father or mother shall be put to death. Exodus 21:15

FOR THE NATION OF ISRAEL ONLY

If one curses his father or mother, his lamp will go out at the coming of darkness. Proverbs 20:20

FOR THE NATION OF ISRAEL ONLY

All who curse their father or mother must be put to death. They are guilty of a capital offense. Leviticus 20:9

FOR THE NATION OF ISRAEL ONLY

You forgot that not everything that is written in the Bible is for everybody. Those verse were for Israel.

originally posted by: ChesterJohn
a reply to: NowWhat

Don't act so shocked.

And don't worry none of my children are abused nor ever have been, and like another I get compliments on how well behaved, well mannered and respectful my children are.

Terrified maybe? that doesn't seem healthy....

All I have to do is look at the protesters at the colleges going on and see the results of non spanking, a bunch of manipulating, arrogant, self confuted crybabies who wont stop stomping their feet until they get what they want.

Yeah if only there was a way to get them inline......



Kids protesting, learning about democracy and defending freedom of speech are healthy pursuits, being a broken and submissive peon to your parents is not...

And teaching your kids that its ok to let someone else take the punishment for your crimes is kinda abhorrent tbh.