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originally posted by: Cheddarhead
Could there be just a slight difference in the composition of those particular rocks, making them retain heat differently than the surrounding blocks? Looking at the daylight picture, they seem to be just a slightly different shade than the others.
If the shafts vent outside, could they build up and retain heat longer in certain spots than others?
Of course, the smart@ss in me wonders if the leftover grain in the pyramid either fermented or is holding heat like a rice filled heating pad.
originally posted by: truthseeker84
originally posted by: stosh64
It seems there are people in power who do all in their power to prevent any further exploration of these archeological sites. I don't understand why unless I go to the more conspiracy oriented parts of my brain.
Long story short, is there a chance that further SUBSTANCIAL, well controlled and professionally monitored archeological excavations will ever be allowed to happen?
ETA: Thank you for the thread purplemer , Stuff like this is why I still come to ATS. S&F for you
Great points.
The Chinese Emperor Qin's Tomb is the exact same situation.
Sometimes, it just makes people wonder, why on earth, would these government officials not allow something so important, so vital to our understand of our own history.
The answers to a number of historical mysteries may lie buried inside that tomb, but whether modern people will ever see inside this mausoleum depends not just on the Chinese government, but on science.
"The big hill, where the emperor is buried — nobody's been in there," said archaeologist Kristin Romey, curatorial consultant for the Terracotta Warrior exhibition at New York City’s Discovery Times Square. "Partly it's out of respect for the elders, but they also realize that nobody in the world right now has the technology to properly go in and excavate it."
You're both full of it.
Truthseeker, do you have any idea of the number of archaeological investigations that have occurred (and are still occurring) in Egypt over the last decade or two?
Do you deny the impact on archaeology that the "Arab Spring" and subsequent upheavals have had?
After two high-visibility investigations into the shafts, do you really think the time is ripe to claim "THEY" are hiding something from us?
Nobody is interfering with the excavation that has been ongoing for Decades at Emperor Qin's Tomb.
"The big hill, where the emperor is buried — nobody's been in there," said archaeologist Kristin Romey, curatorial consultant for the Terracotta Warrior exhibition at New York City’s Discovery Times Square. "Partly it's out of respect for the elders, but they also realize that nobody in the world right now has the technology to properly go in and excavate it."
originally posted by: truthseeker84
They discovered this, because parts of the warring chariots or war vehicles, weapons and/or tools, had components and parts in there that are "interchangeable". Meaning, that if one screw or wheel or something fell off of a machine, you can take another machine's parts and put it in this one to use it.
Imagine yourself building things by hand, there's simply no way you can achieve that kind of precision where components are interchangeable. The only way for that to work, is to have knowledge in areas of injection and molding equipment.
Evidence of the use of interchangeable parts can be traced back over two thousand years to Carthage in the First Punic War. Carthaginian ships had standardized, interchangeable parts that even came with assembly instructions akin to "tab a into slot b" marked on them.[3]
originally posted by: Marduk
originally posted by: truthseeker84
They discovered this, because parts of the warring chariots or war vehicles, weapons and/or tools, had components and parts in there that are "interchangeable". Meaning, that if one screw or wheel or something fell off of a machine, you can take another machine's parts and put it in this one to use it.
Imagine yourself building things by hand, there's simply no way you can achieve that kind of precision where components are interchangeable. The only way for that to work, is to have knowledge in areas of injection and molding equipment.
en.wikipedia.org...
Evidence of the use of interchangeable parts can be traced back over two thousand years to Carthage in the First Punic War. Carthaginian ships had standardized, interchangeable parts that even came with assembly instructions akin to "tab a into slot b" marked on them.[3]
originally posted by: truthseeker84
originally posted by: Marduk
originally posted by: truthseeker84
They discovered this, because parts of the warring chariots or war vehicles, weapons and/or tools, had components and parts in there that are "interchangeable". Meaning, that if one screw or wheel or something fell off of a machine, you can take another machine's parts and put it in this one to use it.
Imagine yourself building things by hand, there's simply no way you can achieve that kind of precision where components are interchangeable. The only way for that to work, is to have knowledge in areas of injection and molding equipment.
en.wikipedia.org...
Evidence of the use of interchangeable parts can be traced back over two thousand years to Carthage in the First Punic War. Carthaginian ships had standardized, interchangeable parts that even came with assembly instructions akin to "tab a into slot b" marked on them.[3]
Not too sure what you're getting at, but if you are saying that the technology existed 2000 years ago, then yes, that's exactly what I said, it's fascinating.
However, the scale of it and how to achieve it, is the interesting part.
During the First Punic War, perhaps there was interchangeable parts for ships (large parts), but on what kind of scale are we talking about here and what precision in making these parts?
Did you notice a keyword when it described the Qin Dynasty? The bronze bow locking mechanism and trigger were "MASS-PRODUCED". The ship parts in the First Punic War, was not MASS PRODUCED.
Meaning, there is a huge difference, in making "Interchangeable Parts" by hand, vs producing it in thousands, tens of thousands on a MASSIVE SCALE.
Make 18 wheels, or sail posts, sure... all the same size. Make 1,800 wheels or sail posts by hand, tell me if you can guarantee all 1,800 pieces will be interchangeable, I guarantee you, it's not going to happen by hand.
It's interesting how people only read certain parts of a text but at times omit the most important sections.
What scholars finds "impressive" was not the fact that WHO invented interchangeable parts FIRST, but who did it in a way that was basically unimaginable for people living 2000 years in the past.
In order to MASS PRODUCE something so precise and so small such as locking mechanism or triggers , you need assembly line, machinery, mold, injection methods, cool offs, the entire fabrication process is just mind boggling. This occurred almost 2,300 years ago and it's not only on weapons either.
originally posted by: truthseeker84
You're both full of it.
How so?
do you have any idea of the number of archaeological investigations that have occurred (and are still occurring) in Egypt over the last decade or two?
originally posted by: truthseeker84
I certainly do not and I believe I never made the claim that I do.
originally posted by: truthseeker84However, how does this change the fact that there are still limitation as of today, in terms of what Archaeologists are allowed and not allowed to do in Egypt.
originally posted by: truthseeker84There are many different hidden entrances, corridors or areas of the place are still off limits. Are you denying this? Are you making such claim as "We have 100% access to all Pyramid sites, all areas of Egypt, with 0 limitations and 0 rules." Is that what you're stating?
Do you deny the impact on archaeology that the "Arab Spring" and subsequent upheavals have had?
originally posted by: truthseeker84I can neither deny nor confirm something that I am not well versed on. So I really fail to see the connection. There shouldn't be anything that impacts archaeology in the 21st century.
After two high-visibility investigations into the shafts, do you really think the time is ripe to claim "THEY" are hiding something from us?
originally posted by: truthseeker84What? I'm just utterly lost at this point...
What shaft are you talking about?
originally posted by: truthseeker84
A. We have 100% access to all Egyptian archaeological sites.
B. We don't have 100% access to all Egyptian archaeological sites.
A is what I'm trying to drive across, which just a big Conspiracy Theory to me. It makes no sense to me that some of the greatest historical sites related to human history is basically "Off Limits" because "The People" or "The Government" don't want it excavated.
Are you implying that A is incorrect while B is correct?
Nobody is interfering with the excavation that has been ongoing for Decades at Emperor Qin's Tomb.
originally posted by: truthseeker84Now, you are being "Full of It".
They were excavating things outside of it, around it, near it, NEVER directly IN IT! The emperor's tomb itself, is NOT ALLOWED by the Chinese Government to be excavated!
"The big hill, where the emperor is buried — nobody's been in there," said archaeologist Kristin Romey, curatorial consultant for the Terracotta Warrior exhibition at New York City’s Discovery Times Square. "Partly it's out of respect for the elders, but they also realize that nobody in the world right now has the technology to properly go in and excavate it."
originally posted by: truthseeker84Misleading article written poorly almost 4 to 5 years ago.
1st: It is almost entirely out of respect for the elders. Ask any Chinese person, they will tell you the same. The Chinese consider that site to be the site of their greatest Ancestor, so out of superstitious respect, they will not touch the main tomb.
Chinese Government will not allow an excavation at this tomb, period.
2nd: Why it's misleading? Because it is utter horse # that we lack the technology to "GO IN" and "Excavate" it. We have super advanced robotics that disarms bombs and traps. We have optical equipment that can be mounted on insects. We have the technology to zap images from a planet that's not in our galaxy. You mean to tell me, that we lack the technological know how to enter a dirt rock with traps made thousands of years ago?
If that is true, then we should spend even more resources and time to get in there. As it is evident that the Qin Dynasty was much superior and much more advanced compared to humans of the 21st century. They can create intricate traps and tombs where modern technology cannot access?
It's simply an incorrect interpretation on your end.
originally posted by: truthseeker84
However, how does this change the fact that there are still limitation as of today, in terms of what Archaeologists are allowed and not allowed to do in Egypt.
originally posted by: Marduk
originally posted by: truthseeker84
originally posted by: Marduk
originally posted by: truthseeker84
They discovered this, because parts of the warring chariots or war vehicles, weapons and/or tools, had components and parts in there that are "interchangeable". Meaning, that if one screw or wheel or something fell off of a machine, you can take another machine's parts and put it in this one to use it.
Imagine yourself building things by hand, there's simply no way you can achieve that kind of precision where components are interchangeable. The only way for that to work, is to have knowledge in areas of injection and molding equipment.
en.wikipedia.org...
Evidence of the use of interchangeable parts can be traced back over two thousand years to Carthage in the First Punic War. Carthaginian ships had standardized, interchangeable parts that even came with assembly instructions akin to "tab a into slot b" marked on them.[3]
Not too sure what you're getting at, but if you are saying that the technology existed 2000 years ago, then yes, that's exactly what I said, it's fascinating.
However, the scale of it and how to achieve it, is the interesting part.
During the First Punic War, perhaps there was interchangeable parts for ships (large parts), but on what kind of scale are we talking about here and what precision in making these parts?
Did you notice a keyword when it described the Qin Dynasty? The bronze bow locking mechanism and trigger were "MASS-PRODUCED". The ship parts in the First Punic War, was not MASS PRODUCED.
Meaning, there is a huge difference, in making "Interchangeable Parts" by hand, vs producing it in thousands, tens of thousands on a MASSIVE SCALE.
Make 18 wheels, or sail posts, sure... all the same size. Make 1,800 wheels or sail posts by hand, tell me if you can guarantee all 1,800 pieces will be interchangeable, I guarantee you, it's not going to happen by hand.
It's interesting how people only read certain parts of a text but at times omit the most important sections.
What scholars finds "impressive" was not the fact that WHO invented interchangeable parts FIRST, but who did it in a way that was basically unimaginable for people living 2000 years in the past.
In order to MASS PRODUCE something so precise and so small such as locking mechanism or triggers , you need assembly line, machinery, mold, injection methods, cool offs, the entire fabrication process is just mind boggling. This occurred almost 2,300 years ago and it's not only on weapons either.
The Sumerians were mass producing bricks from moulds 5000 years ago. They even had a stamp so that the name of the king could be impressed on them
Spear tips were made from moulds in the bronze age. This is well known and accepted by scholars. no need for incredulity.
The earliest Chinese bronzes were made by the method known as piece-mold casting—as opposed to the lost-wax method, which was used in all other Bronze Age cultures. In piece-mold casting, a model is made of the object to be cast, and a clay mold taken of the model. The mold is then cut in sections to release the model, and the sections are reassembled after firing to form the mold for casting. If the object to be cast is a vessel, a core has to be placed inside the mold to provide the vessel's cavity. The piece-mold method was most likely the only one used in China until at least the end of the Shang dynasty. An advantage of this rather cumbersome way of casting bronze was that the decorative patterns could be carved or stamped directly on the inner surface of the mold before it was fired. This technique enabled the bronzeworker to achieve a high degree of sharpness and definition in even the most intricate designs.
originally posted by: truthseeker84
I'm not trying to exaggerate. You cannot just overlook these technological achievements and scoff away.
originally posted by: NJE777
a reply to: bananashooter
It is viral. Anyone want to open a cesspit that has been fermented for over 3000 years?
originally posted by: Phage
originally posted by: NJE777
a reply to: bananashooter
It is viral. Anyone want to open a cesspit that has been fermented for over 3000 years?
I think archaeologists are actually quite interested in cesspits. Lot to learn about how people lived at the time.
originally posted by: Harte
a reply to: Triton1128
Either my humor is really, really bad or you haven't been reading my posts much.
I prefer to think the latter.
Harte
originally posted by: Marduk
originally posted by: Harte
a reply to: Triton1128
Either my humor is really, really bad or you haven't been reading my posts much.
I prefer to think the latter.
Harte
Well you do have that nasty handicap of being an American
originally posted by: Byrd
originally posted by: Cheddarhead
Could there be just a slight difference in the composition of those particular rocks, making them retain heat differently than the surrounding blocks? Looking at the daylight picture, they seem to be just a slightly different shade than the others.
If the shafts vent outside, could they build up and retain heat longer in certain spots than others?
Of course, the smart@ss in me wonders if the leftover grain in the pyramid either fermented or is holding heat like a rice filled heating pad.
It's a recess in the rock. Notice that the cracks are noticeably COOLER than the rock... in fact, they're the same temperature as the other rocks. I have two speculations that may fold together to provide an answer:
* those rocks are slightly less eroded than the others around them (they're more sheltered from the elements)... hence their properties are SLIGHTLY different than the other stones around them.
* (by the way, those temperature differences look impressive in color but are very slight (a degree or so)
* The rocks are also in contact with interior rocks, which are not cooling and heating as fast as the outer rocks.