Confessions of a church-going atheist

originally posted by: darkbake

There is no requirement for the organ player to be a theist. The requirement is for the organ player to play the organ. I'm sure the church would be glad to have the opportunity to influence an atheist anyway. Not all Christians are that closed-minded.

I'm not really all that interested in the requirements. The OP seems to be taking advantage of an institution he/she doesn't believe is legitimate.

That seems a tad hypocritical (and morally questionable) to me. Like I said, it would be like me accepting an Atheist Scholarship to refine my piano chops and land a paid gig, having no interest in or respect for their beliefs whatsoever.

Using them, in other words. It doesn't matter if they have their own ulterior motives of converting me or not. Two wrongs do not a right make. It's not much different than religious folk going along with their own institution's lies in order to preserve and maintain their social/business contacts.

It's disrespectful at the very least.

originally posted by: rajas
a reply to: corblimeyguvnor

In court you just use two terms, religious freedom and liberty.. Under the Human rights law, so no it wont hold in court..
You could take the church to court, and you would lose since they dont have an obligation to marry you if its against the priests will if it collides with his beliefs.

This is your crusade no one elses. Human rights, ten commandments doesnt matter you lose in all cases. Dogma or basic human rights protects individuals from doing something they dont want, cause someone else has an ideal..

Mods, as previously stated, Thread Drift, irrelevant, please delete. If rajas want's to continue argument / discussion i am available through messaging. Once again, apologies OP

a reply to: corblimeyguvnor

No its relevant for the subject at hand, the church teaches a message of love, if you dont want to learn it, do not force your views on it. The OP embraced the teachings and did not force his view on anything.

originally posted by: rajas
a reply to: corblimeyguvnor

No its relevant for the subject at hand, the church teaches a message of love, if you dont want to learn it, do not force your views on it. The OP embraced the teachings and did not force his view on anything.

Irrelevant considering it was a thread about music and instrument playing, rather than god exists / doesn't exist. Msg me if you want to continue

Congratulations - that is great that you are getting to persue something you love. I bet it feels strange to find yourself in a church. I pray you are treated with nothing but love and respect. Keep an open heart and mind. Don't feel like you have to hide who you are or what your beliefs are either.

I will caution you that at my church - a large evangelical non- demoninational - every person serving as part of the worship team must be christisn - 100% Jesus followers. Seekers and atheists are welcome in our doors with open arms, but they don't serve on the worship team. (Worship team includes musicians)

But I imagine all churches have a different policy and approach. My friend's husband is an atheist and he gets paid to to sing at a church.

Good luck with your endeavor! Enjoy the ride.

Just maybe God has a plan for you. By accepting this position you have become a future believer.

Seems the Christians in your church are a lot more tolerant than some in this thread....

a reply to: Prezbo369

Indeed. All I wanted was to share a personal story of where music has taken me. I'm tempted never to utter the words "atheism" and "church" in the same sentence again, lest I incur the wrath of imbeciles from either side. I'm an atheist who happens to be learning to play the organ in church; therefore, I am automatically screwing my local religious community over. Pathetic. Truly.

a reply to: Tenebris
Be fair,I think you got that reaction from ONE person in this thread.
Did you not read any of the other replies?

originally posted by: rajas
a reply to: Raggedyman

It won't help you, you love the laws more than people That makes you a pharisee

Most people dont understand the meaning, its called the foundation of society.
But no, Essene..

Society is not Christianity, Christianity is a small community within society.
who are called to love those in the society

you make out like the church is the ruler, it's the servant as was Jesus

a reply to: Raggedyman

Where does your moral, values, ideals and ethics come from?

No, seperation of the State and Church, State and its institutions dictates your life, Church doesnt.. And your trying to OT the topic so it fits your agenda..

Where in my post did you see me make a statement quote:

you make out like the church is the ruler, it's the servant as was Jesus

originally posted by: darkbake
a reply to: NthOther

There is no requirement for the organ player to be a theist. The requirement is for the organ player to play the organ. I'm sure the church would be glad to have the opportunity to influence an atheist anyway. Not all Christians are that closed-minded.

Indeed. In fact, in terms of employment, is it not illegal to discriminate based on religion? If you can perform the job, i.e.: Play the organ sufficiently well for church services, then it would be illegal to refuse you the job based solely on your religion. It's illegal to even ask you what religion you are, one of those "Stay away from this subject" concerns any competent personnel manager learns very early on.

originally posted by: NthOther

originally posted by: darkbake

There is no requirement for the organ player to be a theist. The requirement is for the organ player to play the organ. I'm sure the church would be glad to have the opportunity to influence an atheist anyway. Not all Christians are that closed-minded.

I'm not really all that interested in the requirements. The OP seems to be taking advantage of an institution he/she doesn't believe is legitimate.

How is he "taking advantage"? He's performing a service. It's a tit for tat exchange. He gets to play the organ; the church gets to hear the music. Win-win. His personal beliefs should not (and legally cannot) enter into it.

a reply to: NthOther

Do you think you'd be getting organ lessons (and a job) for free if you told them you're an atheist?

I mean... do you normally pay for your jobs? Because if you do, you're doing it wrong.

a reply to: NthOther

Unless the job requirement said "You must be Christian" or "You must be a Jew" or "You must be a Muslim" then its really no ones business what the person believes.

The OP seems to be taking advantage of an institution he/she doesn't believe is legitimate

And you think that everyone who works for Walmart believes in their corporate policy? This isn't a life choice, they aren't joining the military, they aren't signing up to serve the church in their spiritual missions, they are playing a musical instrument.

This is no different than hiring a clown for a kids birthday party or playing piano for a town hall meeting, or a musical gig for a Policeman's ball.

The last example, someone with a criminal record could be hired, it means nothing.

a reply to: DISRAELI

Yes, and I'm thankful that everyone else is understanding. However, this one person has jumped to a conclusion so wild that it astounds me.

originally posted by: DISRAELI
a reply to: Tenebris
Be fair,I think you got that reaction from ONE person in this thread.
Did you not read any of the other replies?

That ONE persons replies received many stars in support of their intolerance.

a reply to: Prezbo369
Yet the OP was getting more.

originally posted by: DISRAELI
a reply to: Prezbo369
Yet the OP was getting more.

Irrelevant, it doesn't change the fact that:

the Christians in your church are a lot more tolerant than some in this thread....

originally posted by: Prezbo369
Irrelevant, it doesn't change the fact that:
"the Christians in your church are a lot more tolerant than some in this thread..."

Are the people who give stars technically "in" a thread?
I would naturally apply the phrase to those adding a post, in which case we're only talking about one person. Rather outnumbered by users making more positive comments.