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originally posted by: ScepticScot
a reply to: Semicollegiate
It makes no difference if money is linked to a physical asset ir not it is still an IOU it just happens to be an exchangeable one. Saying I owe you five pounds/dollars is in no way different from saying I owe you five pounds/dollars worth of gold/silver/sea shells or shiny buttons. What is a surplus to you has inevitably be a debt else where. What is wrong with his column is that he tries to extrapolate up from this to government finances. This would only hold true if all assets and production were fixed. As this is obviously not the case his analysis is so over simplified as to be meaningless.
They all think government etc will look after them.
originally posted by: ScepticScot
a reply to: Semicollegiate
The value of gold doesn't come from any intrinsic value or utility in its use but from the fact that for centuries it has been used as a currency. Gold value is every bit as faith based as fiat currency.
originally posted by: Semicollegiate
Gold does have intrinsic value. The gold price is the market value of the commodity.
Fiat money has value because it must be accepted, by law, for all debts, public and private.
originally posted by: galadofwarthethird
a reply to: Semicollegiate
Yes and none of that has anything to do with the intrinsic of the system itself or which immaterial object you wish to put what value on. And it has everything to do with people and human nature and certain facts, one being that they are to stupid to see beyond fancy symbology, and well at least a few hundred if not thousand more.
So what your saying is we should be down to two work days by now if you look at all the stats on paper. But you look away from the paper and out there in the real world and add up ity bitty factors one being what I said above about human nature. And well you do that math and the world you see around you is pretty much were it should be and could be once you add up all those factors.
Like I said. We should technically still be in villages and towns, our mind and brain still has not progressed far from herd or tribal mentalities. And in fact it would not be a good thing if we did. Because when we do, things will become a lot more bot and mechanical out here on planet earth.
And yes money is a commodity. Who knows why they dont teach it as not. Most likely so they can get a heads up on this game over you all. But ya! something is only worth what people think its worth. And when you can control what people think its worth? Well you get the picture. In essence its all fiat currency in a supply and demand society.
But in our case its more or less in a fake scarcity supply and demand society based on a fiat currency which is held up by edicts and mass smoke and mirrors. Basically Paul and Peter both got robed by John so he can pay back Steve who borrowed half from Peter and half from Paul. And round and round we go.
What did you call it? Oh ya> "Fiat money is a vehicle for inflation. The USDollar has lost 95% of its buying power since 1913"
And what you think that if we started using silver or gold it would have been immune to inflation?
WW1 cost more than all of the wealth in the world, hence the 95% devaluation of the dollar.
originally posted by: galadofwarthethird
a reply to: Semicollegiate
On paper it did, outside of that it fluctuated all over the place, but mostly it stayed static is because it was traded for in paper, if it was traded for itself this whole time inflation would still exist and we would still be fighting wars over other resources like oil and everything else.
Don't know if the whole cash for gold craze is still going on or not, but I take it that semi phase within a phase passed as well, or at least till next time around, the gold rush was even in the foundation days of this country. And also the cost of ww1 had again had more to do with human nature then any material object and the values placed on it.
None of it is real, its just as real as you believe it to be. Which is why we fight wars to back up the petro dollar or why if we were under any under medium we would fight wars to protect that standard.
But hey if you believe it so then change it to gold and come back in 70 years and when inflation is still going on then we shall see.
Here in this vid they say its cost prohibited for mass production, but I doubt it.
All your whole gold does not cause inflation is based on the fact that its rare on earth, remove that it becomes just another material. Basically those who trade in gold and for gold have more of an interest in keeping it rare and a commodity and not a standard for commodities. As then it would be subject to the bubbles of supply and demand as its in the forefront of things.
Changing one standard material item for another does nothing in the scope of things. But maybe it will run with it for a few years or even generations if even that.
Just because you label something which has not been in process and practice of our society as "progressivism" does not mean that when it is put into practice it will be that or all that different. It just means you believe it will, but your believe and others believes will carry it only so far. If you were to start back when paper fiat currency was becoming global, then by now we would have reached the same place with gold as we have with fiat paper all the ups and downs busts and bursts.
WW1 cost more than all of the wealth in the world, hence the 95% devaluation of the dollar.
Magic no? When one war which is meaningless by now can cost more then the sum total of its parts for all of history. Thats like buying a apple thats worth 1$ for one billion dollars. I do believe that is what is called as swindling and nothing else. But hey if you believe it then it must be so...Should you not get on paying back what all those dead people owe?
Or how about this, why dont we just print a one gazzillion dollar bill and pay everything then when everything is payed we can go back to our regular life's right? Or wait is there more to this, like the fact that everybody does not want to admit that we are all living on others sweet in many ways in a system that is for the most part ebb and flow and made up pie cutting contest.
It would be cool you know, especially among religious people, heard they like others paying for there whatever so they can go on doing what it is they are doing. The bank of God and the creditor of Jesus, worked wonders for them, why not adapt it as a financial system as well.
Quite obvious that inflation is sin right? Or is gold somehow magically supposed to solve world hunger and poverty and war and all those things? Were exactly are you going with this. But probably I dont even want to know.
originally posted by: galadofwarthethird
a reply to: Semicollegiate
originally posted by: Semicollegiate
The gold backed dollar kept the same value, 0% (zero) inflation from 1789 until 1917. The price of everything decreased over the 19th century.
originally posted by: Semicollegiate
"on paper" is where the fractional reserve banking practice made more money that there was gold to back it. All fluctuations in the supply and value of money are caused by banks lending money that they don't have. The gold standard itself was not the reason for the fluctuations and bank failures and bank panics. Deviation from the gold standard caused all of the bank failures and panics.
Refining is not "creation". The amount of gold on Earth is fixed. That is what makes gold a good basis for sound, non-inflationary money.
Over time the amount of stuff in the world increases and gold will buy more stuff, because there is the same amount of gold but more stuff available to buy. That is the natural rate of interest on savings.