THIS is what Russia is aiding and abetting

a reply to: RogueWave

Are you saying that because they were originally developed in Russia, that Russia supplied every AK in the world?

While ignoring geo-politics in that region for the last half century. Okay. Its not like the Russians ever fought wars in those areas and their arms weren't diverted, or the Soviet Bloc wasn't selling off arms during its collapse... oh wait.

originally posted by: CharlesT
a reply to: boncho
I do appreciate your post. The only descrepency is in the weapons you mention in that even the US covert entities provide AK weapons and ammunition to their surrogates, mainly to deflect suspicion fron the sources of their support. After all, it wouldn't look too good if ISIL's primary ground weapon happened to be an AR-15, would it?

That's not the point, the point is the OP is trying to brand guilt simply because weapons fell into the wrong hands, but if you follow the arms trade you will find this with just about every country.

If you trace back where the covert entities are buying the arms, I wouldn't be surprised if it was directly from Russia either. Or through mediators.

My point wasn't trying to blame the Russians, its to point out that its a stupid argument unless you have specifics, because it happens on both sides, and laying a blanket of blame on an entire country or government is pointless.

A huge amount of weapons that killed American soldiers in Afghanistan were Russian origin, do we blame the Russians for it? No.

If you want to discuss various arms are coming in to war zones, by all means, if you want to lay blame you have a big job ahead of you. The "dead bodies that told a story" or whatever the nonsense the OP is, told no story. We don't know who they were, how they died, by what weapon, etc

We just have the equivalent of Russian Fox News telling us Russia is a hero.

a reply to: CthulhuMythos

Standard tactics of the pro-Putin trolls. Misleading title, appears to be the opposite when you read, then you are supposed to watch an RT video.
Another tactic is flooding. Seems to me that some well-known posters here who jumped on ATS around the time of the Ukrainian crisis actually post pro-Putin articles and news full time, eight hours a day.
I just check the New section on ATS and the same three our four names are leading in posting pro-Putin threads. By the time I read the basics (and I'm a quick reader), there are already several pages of the same arguments over and over, and the few who present critical opinions on the Vladimir get tired after a while because 1. they are not doing this full time 2. they try to present rational arguments and refutations and that takes time.

OK, it is time to note these returning loops of information waste by the same posters and install a filter for all threads.

originally posted by: the2ofusr1
a reply to: markosity1973

Just seen this new one

This right here is just as much Russian propaganda as you see in the west, only this is Russian propaganda aimed at the west.

I mean come on. It's one thing to say we cleared and liberated this place and that, quite another to say villagers are returning. Really? What were they all hiding behind a rock just outside town? The Russians drop them in via parachute? Some type of "all clear" bat signal in the sky? They're not worried about bombs or IEDs? Is that just something isolated to Iraq?

Wonders never cease.

originally posted by: tsurfer2000h
a reply to: woodwardjnr

Russia were invited to Syria by Assad. not sure what Americas reason for being in a sovereign country is just yet?

Well one reason would be they are fighting terrorists that have killed American citizens while being in Syria would be one one of my guesses.

But did Syria ask Russia to kill it's people in airstrikes that aren't near rebel positions?

GULF WAR

26 February 1991: Nine British soldiers of the 3rd Battalion, Royal Regiment of Fusiliers, were killed and further 11 injured after their Warrior armoured vehicles were hit by Maverick missiles fired by two U.S. A-10 ground attack aircraft.
An Oxford inquest returned a verdict of unlawful killings.

27 February 1991: Two British soldiers of the Queen's Royal Irish Hussars were injured when their Scorpion armoured vehicles were fired on by U.S. M1 Abrams tanks.

14 April 1994: In the 1994 Black Hawk shootdown incident, 26 Allied military and civilian personnels, including two British Army officers, were killed when two U.S. Air Force F-15Cs fighter aircraft shot down two U.S. Army UH-60 Black Hawks helicopters they were in.

AFGHANISTAN

5 December 2006: Marine Jonathan Wigley's death was caused by gunfire from a U.S. F-18 aircraft.

July 2007: British Guardsman Matthew Lyne-Pirkis, of the Grenadier Guards, was wounded along with three other allied soldiers of the Afghan National Army after being hit by gunfire from a U.S. Apache helicopter gunship.

23 August 2007: A bomb dropped by an F-15 killed three soldiers of the Royal Anglian Regiment and wounded a further two. During the subsequent inquest, issues such as inadequate communication equipment and incorrect coordinates from a British forward air controller were raised. The coroner finally stated it was down to the "flawed application of procedures" rather than individual errors or "recklessness".

21 December 2009: A British soldier was fatally shot by a US helicopter crew in Afghanistan who thought they were attacking an enemy base. Gunfire from the helicopters left 11 injured on the ground. The coroner criticised the British commanders for the fact Patrol Base Almas was not marked on military maps, for the 'unprofessional' use of grainy images and for insisting there were no friendly forces in the area to the Apache crew.

5 December 2010: Private John Howard was killed by American troops after soldiers called for backup. Private Howard is understood to have died as the low-flying pilot attempted to strafe an enemy target with cannon fire.

Oct. 3rd 2015: Early this morning, in the Afghan city of Kunduz, the U.S. dropped bombs on a hospital run by Doctors Without Borders (Médecins Sans Frontières (MSF)). The airstrike killed at least nine of the hospital’s medical staff, and seriously injured dozens of patients. “Among the dead was the Afghan head of the hospital, Abdul Sattar,” reported the New York Times.

IRAQ WAR

23 March 2003: A British Tornado jet was shot down by a U.S. Patriot missile, killing two crewmen.

28 March 2003: British Lance-Corporal of Horse Matty Hull was killed by U.S. A-10 jets as well as five others wounded in the 190th Fighter Squadron, Blues and Royals friendly fire incident.

6 April 2003: During the Battle of Debecka Pass, BBC World Affairs Editor John Simpson and members of his crew were injured when a bomb dropped from a U.S. F-15 aircraft hit a friendly Kurdish and U.S. Special Forces convoy, killing 15 people, including BBC translator Kamaran Abdurazaq Muhamed.

USA Bombs civilian Hospital

USA Killed British Soldiers

We can all play THAT game mate...i'm sure all these people didn't ask the USA military to kill them either!

I'll do you a favour...i won't mention Nagasaki or Hiroshima or the extremely long lists of civilian and 'friendly fire' killings by the USA during WW2...it would take much too long to compile.

You know about throwing stones in glass houses..don't you?

a reply to: Rosinitiate

Not EVERYONE has left Syria believe it or not. And yes, the brave and / or foolhardy get just far enough from the frontline to be safe and as soon as they can, return home.

I saw it myself in Bosnia Herzegovina in 1993.

a reply to: markosity1973

Because everything Russia reports is gold and everything the west reports is #. Let's be a little objective here. A few people lurking around the outskirts is not a resettlement of a village.

But we all know Russia doesn't use propaganda as a tool.
.......ok.

a reply to: Rosinitiate

Feel free to post western coverage of such things for a secondary viewpoint.

All I've seen in our MSM is accusations against Russia but no on the ground coverage like on RT.

Here is BBC footage, but it only shows fighting. I'm more interested in what is happening to the every day citizen.

originally posted by: Rosinitiate
a reply to: markosity1973

Because everything Russia reports is gold and everything the west reports is #. Let's be a little objective here. A few people lurking around the outskirts is not a resettlement of a village.

But we all know Russia doesn't use propaganda as a tool.
.......ok.

Yes, all major or influential nations use propaganda and regularly so too.

But ultimately, it's not the rhetoric or finger pointing or even patriotic flag waving that counts...results do.

originally posted by: markosity1973
a reply to: Rosinitiate

Feel free to post western coverage of such things for a secondary viewpoint.

All I've seen in our MSM is accusations against Russia but no on the ground coverage like on RT.

If you can't see it than never mind. Carry on.

originally posted by: MysterX

originally posted by: Rosinitiate
a reply to: markosity1973

Because everything Russia reports is gold and everything the west reports is #. Let's be a little objective here. A few people lurking around the outskirts is not a resettlement of a village.

But we all know Russia doesn't use propaganda as a tool.
.......ok.

Yes, all major or influential nations use propaganda and regularly so too.

But ultimately, it's not the rhetoric or finger pointing or even patriotic flag waving that counts...results do.

I am simply calling a spade a spade, nothing more. My views shouldn't be lost on anyone here at this point.

a reply to: boncho

You have a bunch of statements from Russian media, and you have propaganda from both governments. You want to make a big deal about US weapons getting in the hands of Al Nusra, guess what small arms every terrorist organization in the world uses? AK-47s...

So you are saying that Russia supplied every terrorirst organisition using AK´s, with AK´s?

And you base this on this,

Okay. Its not like the Russians ever fought wars in those areas and their arms weren't diverted, or the Soviet Bloc wasn't selling off arms during its collapse... oh wait.

Does this mean that weapons were supplied directly to terrorist organisations, by Russia itself.

You seem to be saying that Russia armed ISIS, and you base this on their use of AK's. Such idiotic and shortsighted nonsense.

originally posted by: Rosinitiate

originally posted by: MysterX

originally posted by: Rosinitiate
a reply to: markosity1973

Because everything Russia reports is gold and everything the west reports is #. Let's be a little objective here. A few people lurking around the outskirts is not a resettlement of a village.

But we all know Russia doesn't use propaganda as a tool.
.......ok.

Yes, all major or influential nations use propaganda and regularly so too.

But ultimately, it's not the rhetoric or finger pointing or even patriotic flag waving that counts...results do.

I am simply calling a spade a spade, nothing more. My views shouldn't be lost on anyone here at this point.

You are rightly suspicious of the Russians. What they are doing right now is unprecedented really.

The thing is the USA's plans were not working. They have little to no control over the rebels they gleefully give guns to. Massacres like the one in the RT video are a regular occurrence. You must have surely seen MSM coverage of ISIS atrocities.

The war will not end of the USA continues on the way it was. It is Madness to keep doing the same thing and expect a different result.

originally posted by: markosity1973

originally posted by: Rosinitiate

originally posted by: MysterX

originally posted by: Rosinitiate
a reply to: markosity1973

Because everything Russia reports is gold and everything the west reports is #. Let's be a little objective here. A few people lurking around the outskirts is not a resettlement of a village.

But we all know Russia doesn't use propaganda as a tool.
.......ok.

Yes, all major or influential nations use propaganda and regularly so too.

But ultimately, it's not the rhetoric or finger pointing or even patriotic flag waving that counts...results do.

I am simply calling a spade a spade, nothing more. My views shouldn't be lost on anyone here at this point.

You are rightly suspicious of the Russians. What they are doing right now is unprecedented really.

The thing is the USA's plans were not working. They have little to no control over the rebels they gleefully give guns to. Massacres like the one in the RT video are a regular occurrence. You must have surely seen MSM coverage of ISIS atrocities.

The war will not end of the USA continues on the way it was. It is Madness to keep doing the same thing and expect a different result.

Listen, you've been here awhile and we've been in the same threads OFTEN. I'm not trying to be rude but surely you read other people's posts outside of your own. I read yours and have agreed often with you. It's just baffling you act as though you are so hell bent on defending Russia you don't seem to see that 1.) the video I quoted is clearly Russian propaganda. It doesn't matter if their cause is more just, they just fed you bull# and you don't even care. And 2.) all things considered, if you've bothered to read anything I've posted in the countless threads we are both in, I generally agree with you, I just don't have a blind allegiance to Russia.

a reply to: Rosinitiate

I've got nothing against you. And yes I have read most other threads on here lately.

You see the OP video as Russian propaganda and that is your god given right to freedom of thought as far as I am concerned.

Our western media is just as biased and hellbent on painting Russia as the bad guy.

I guess you see the OP video as propaganda about how wonderful a job Russia us doing.

I see it as evidence of atrocities being committed by armed rebels. I'd love for western reporters to go in and show us some of the stories if atrocities Assad is supposed to be committing too.

But they're not.

a reply to: markosity1973

I think you need to go back a reread my original. I quoted the video from 2ofusr1 regarding people moving back in. Like Russia is so awesome that literally after two weeks everyone can go home.

a reply to: Rosinitiate

Lolz. we both know that is not true, but they are helping the Syrian army liberate some areas, bit by bit.

PS They (the Russians) have also been dropping arms to the Kurds in the north, like the US have. It looks like the two are on the same page in that respect and I am pleased about that.

Russia fears that those Chechen terrorists return to Russia ! Saudi and GCC countries had threatened Russia with those suicide attackers.

a reply to: RogueWave

Do you have anything to back up that the Russians are actually doing anything at all? They're just as bad. Don't trust either side.

Get out of the middle east. Let them kill each other.

a reply to: markosity1973

As long as all this has your approval...

Hey starving Syrians, this guy approves. Everything will be fine.