You Decide: Is this "Freedom of Expression"?

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

They can go to hell.



the wall of text I was referring to some dribble posted about a preacher gone wild.

originally posted by: deadeyedick

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: deadeyedick
Tell me which of the 10 commandments should the gov. remain neutral on?

All of them. The laws against murder and theft do not come from the 10 commandments. And the other eight commandments are not relevant to law.

You just say crap because you like the sound it makes.

That was one of your most dishonest post ever.

It was an accurate post.

So, you're implying that we should have LAWS that make simple lying and adultery illegal, and a LAW to keep the sabbath as a holy day, and a LAW to not worship any other gods, a LAW to not use the lord's name in vain, etc? That would be BLATANT theocracy, and that is completely the opposite of the founding principles of this nation. Period.

If you actually believe that law should exist based on ALL of the 10 commandments (excluding murder and stealing laws, which are not grounded in biblical law themselves), I'm truly concerned.

originally posted by: deadeyedick
Tell me which of the 10 commandments should the gov. remain neutral on?

Having no other god besides Yahweh. Not taking Yahweh's name in vain. Not allowing any graven image or representation of anything. Requiring religious observance of Saturday as the Jewish Sabbath. "Honoring" parents. Outlawing "adultery" as defined by the Bible.

None of this is the government's business.

originally posted by: deadeyedick
They can go to hell.

Yes, of course they can, dear.

the wall of text I was referring to some dribble posted about a preacher gone wild.

Dribble? I said nothing about a preacher gone wild. It's well established that it was a Baptist minister who sued the state, claiming that the statue was violating their Constitution.

The lawsuit was filed on behalf of Bruce Prescott, a Baptist minister who said he was "highly offended" when he saw the monument during a visit to the Capitol last year, News9.com reported.

"It's inappropriate, it's not the right place," Prescott told the station. "Put it on the doorpost that's what the Bible says, it doesn't say to put it at the State Capitol."

FOX News

ya know, I grew up with a catholic church by my house. I wasn't catholic but I did enjoy all the statues and stained glass windows, both inside and outside of that church, yes it was always open and yes, us kids would venture inside once in awhile. the place was beautiful!!

gee, doesn't one of those commandments kind of forbid such art? so, there seems to be one commandment that kind of offends even some of the christians is seems. and ya know what?? I got a feeling that people the world over kind of knew that murder and theft was wrong long before moses even entered the picture and were punishing people for the offense.

adultery originally only concerned married women, I mean it was okay to take a servant girl to bed, even for a married man, and well, that married man could have as many wives and concubines as they wanted. it was probably more like saying you can't borrow someone's horse without their permission.

god, goddesses, tree spirits, whatever, heck if you want my opinion the god most worshipped in today's world is in the form of coins and dollar bills. their whole world seems to be about serving that dollar, working to bring more of the money to them, to get the rewards that it bestows on them.

thou shalt not kill, heck, if the christians can't see themselves rallying around a call for a crusade and wanting to drop bombs on far away villages and cities, then well, I think I have a much higher moral standard of this command than they could ever dream of....thou shalt not kill, don't take another life unless in self defense, don't kill a person's dreams and hopes, their self respect, their culture and their religious beliefs. there is much more to that thou shalt not kill than just murder, at least in my interpretation of it.

and well, why the ten commandments anyways? doesn't the golden rule far exceed those commandments also? ya know the Do unto others as you would have them do unto you? seems to me that one simple principle if it was applied across the country would not only exceed any relgious doctrines out there, but any laws also. matter of fact it would probably make most laws not needed anymore.

Surely a hollowed out pumpkin is enough, but then we don't really do Halloween

a reply to: woodwardjnr

heck when I was growing up, one family took it upon themselves to make freezing cold water a part of their holloween ritual. when use kids would go up to the door to trick or treat, there'd be someone on the roof throwing buckets of water on us....

funny but I don't ever remember anything being said about that either, although it was in upstate NY and often times, winter has just started setting in and well it was near freezing outside. a few dummies aren't going to hurt the kiddies, but well this very well could have given some of us some good colds!

Well, it's pretty clear there is a very clever campaign going on against free speech. Whether or not these people meant to be involved is frankly pretty irrelevant. If someone is looking for a case of someone going overboard with their enthusiasm for theatrics, Halloween would be exactly the right time of year to find it. Everybody probably knows someone who gets a little strange around that time of year. Maybe not this bad but it happens.

So if I'm just going on instinct here, I'm going to guess this is TPTB and the media cherry picking a story that they believe will make a majority of viewers say "That's over the line!". That's my guess if I'm assuming the people who put that display up aren't even involved. Maybe the media hounds just sat back and watched and waited for something "outrageous!" to dangle in front of the public.

The timing is (as always) "interesting".

originally posted by: DelMarvel

originally posted by: Flatfish
a reply to: JuJuBee

The most disturbing part of your entire OP is the fact that you can't see the difference between this guys right to have the Halloween display in his yard, (private property) and your perceived right to display the Ten Commandments on Courthouse grounds, (public property).

That's scarier than anything this guy could ever hang in his yard!

I'm not sure if it's that some people can't see the difference or if it's that they don't believe in the difference. They have their vision of what America and Christianity should be and it's OK with them to use the Courthouse lawn and every other function of government to force their beliefs and code of behavior on other people wherever they are.

In other words, putting up the ten commandments on government property to tell people how to worship and using the government to dictate what you can display in your own front yard is all part of the same mind set.

Hell, I can't even figure out why they pretend to care so much about the Ten Commandments in the first place.

It's more than apparent that they prefer to ignore those sins and concentrate on perceived sin that didn't even make the top ten list.

You know, like "Thou shalt not do business with gays." Or, "Thou shalt not provide healthcare insurance to employees that includes contraceptive coverage."

originally posted by: Liquesence

originally posted by: deadeyedick

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: deadeyedick
Tell me which of the 10 commandments should the gov. remain neutral on?

All of them. The laws against murder and theft do not come from the 10 commandments. And the other eight commandments are not relevant to law.

You just say crap because you like the sound it makes.

That was one of your most dishonest post ever.

It was an accurate post.

So, you're implying that we should have LAWS that make simple lying and adultery illegal, and a LAW to keep the sabbath as a holy day, and a LAW to not worship any other gods, a LAW to not use the lord's name in vain, etc? That would be BLATANT theocracy, and that is completely the opposite of the founding principles of this nation. Period.

If you actually believe that law should exist based on ALL of the 10 commandments (excluding murder and stealing laws, which are not grounded in biblical law themselves), I'm truly concerned.

No what I am saying is that directly or indirectly our laws reflect the ten commandments.
That is what makes the system work.

originally posted by: deadeyedick
No what I am saying is that directly or indirectly our laws reflect the ten commandments.

You can say that, but does it have any basis in fact? Let's see...

What laws (directly or indirectly) reflect these 8 commandments?

Thou shalt have no other gods before me
Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image
Thou shalt not take the name of the Lord thy God in vain
Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy
Honour thy father and thy mother
Thou shalt not commit adultery
Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour
Thou shalt not covet

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic
Those would be indirect.

separation of church and state covers the first one and so on....

originally posted by: deadeyedick

originally posted by: Liquesence

originally posted by: deadeyedick

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: deadeyedick
Tell me which of the 10 commandments should the gov. remain neutral on?

All of them. The laws against murder and theft do not come from the 10 commandments. And the other eight commandments are not relevant to law.

You just say crap because you like the sound it makes.

That was one of your most dishonest post ever.

It was an accurate post.

So, you're implying that we should have LAWS that make simple lying and adultery illegal, and a LAW to keep the sabbath as a holy day, and a LAW to not worship any other gods, a LAW to not use the lord's name in vain, etc? That would be BLATANT theocracy, and that is completely the opposite of the founding principles of this nation. Period.

If you actually believe that law should exist based on ALL of the 10 commandments (excluding murder and stealing laws, which are not grounded in biblical law themselves), I'm truly concerned.

No what I am saying is that directly or indirectly our laws reflect the ten commandments.
That is what makes the system work.

All right, please show me laws that are directly or indirectly reflected by commandments other than laws against murder and stealing.

And I mean laws that aren't archaic (such as a fornication or sodomy law from years ago that is still on the books), or laws that aren't time/place/manner contingent, like how lying under oath is a crime.

Example: murder is illegal, across the board. Period.

Just another case of, "I don't like it, so everyone shouldn't like it either!"

*eye roll*

You know, one of the awesome things about being alive is that you can pick and choose what you accept into your reality. There's this feature humans have called the "ignore feature"

If you don't like something, just ignore it. We seem to do a pretty good job ignoring all kinds of other things unintentionally already.

originally posted by: MystikMushroom
Just another case of, "I don't like it, so everyone shouldn't like it either!"

*eye roll*

Or more accurately, "I don't like it, so I want to take away your right to enjoy or do it."

originally posted by: deadeyedick
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic
Those would be indirect.

separation of church and state covers the first one and so on....

Somehow I didn't think your answer would make sense. And it doesn't.

a reply to: Liquesence

or laws that aren't time/place/manner contingent, like how lying under oath is a crime

That is a good example.
like I said it is indirect.
another is how one can lose every bit of money by a judge for adultery.
again there are indirect and if one is not willing to want to see then they will not.

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: deadeyedick
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic
Those would be indirect.

separation of church and state covers the first one and so on....

Somehow I didn't think your answer would make sense. And it doesn't.

it is quite simple that keeping other religions out of gov is following the commandment

a reply to: MystikMushroom

Just another case of, "I don't like it, so everyone shouldn't like it either!"

sounds like you are describing the whiners taking down the ten commandments

originally posted by: deadeyedick
it is quite simple that keeping other religions out of gov is following the commandment

Oh, keeping OTHER religions out of government! I see! ... No, I don't. You have given NO laws that are reflected by the 8 commandments.