8-year-old girl fatally shot by 11-year-old boy for not letting him see her puppy

There's not a gun problem. There's a parenting problem in America. A major one.

Only one of limited sight and mental capacity would blame the tool, and not the individual that used the tool.

originally posted by: crazyewok
Obviously the girl should have had a gun! If her parents had been responsible and brought here a AR15 this wouldn't have happened!
/sarcasm

www.kittyhell.com...

If the girl had one of those, which you can see by the coloring and images it a completely age appropriate weapon she clearly could have defended herself from the sneak attack.

How does America differ from other countries besides gun ownership?

Parents don't discipline their children here. They let their children do whatever they want.

When I was a kid, I wouldn't even go in the same room my dad's gun cabinet was in without permission.

The boy in this story just did as he pleased.

a reply to: WP4YT

Kids do as they please without fear of discipline.

It's because we had a generation afraid to discipline their children our of fear that government kIdnappers (CPS) would come and take their children away.

And now here we are, at the next generation of parents, who don't discipline their children not out of fear, but because their partners didn't discipline them.

And now we have a whole generation of criminals that do as they please.

Guns aren't the problem. They are just a tool for the sad individual that uses it.

originally posted by: Reallyfolks
Well slick, you give me a logical way to get rid of roughly 310 million non military guns in the US that doesn't require mass gun death of both citizens and government agents trying to do that. You tell me how to shutdown the black market of which estimates say 100 million of the 310 million are in. You tell me how you stop people from building there own. Seriously, you people keep screaming get rid of guns without so much as the first clue as to how to do it. I'll wait patiently as you state this logically. I'm expecting crickets, deflection, or something not very logical or based in reality.

There is no quick fix to doing so but periodic gun buys get guns off the street, confiscation and destruction of guns used in crimes also gets them off the street. As you get more and more weapons off the street the price of guns increase which puts them out of reach of the common criminal. Eventually they become accessible to only a few. To get to that point in the US optimistically it would take 20 years of sustained gun control and more realistically 50 years.

It is completely doable within your childrens lifetime. The real challenge in my opinion comes from 3d printing, right now people can build their own weapons with a CNC machine and some skills but 3d printing and it's wide accessibility in a few years is going to completely change the worldwide face of gun control as manufacturing becomes completely revamped and localized for most items.

This is just getting PATHETIC.

I am responsible for mass shootings.

I am responsible for little boys shooting little girls now.


Stop denigrating gun owners because the mobs' phobia of guns.

That happened from BAD PARENTING.

originally posted by: andy06shake
The boy is due to appear in court on October 28, at which time a judge will decide whether he should be tried as a juvenile or as an adult. I think the choice is obvious really considering he is 11.

If he was my kid I would request he be tried as an adult, and go to an adult prison. Spending 7 years in juvenile is going to destroy him, it puts him in the middle of a bunch of other criminals during his formative years. Kids who goto Juvie are pretty much screwed for life. In an adult prison on the other hand he'll mostly be ignored by the other prisoners. He can do school work, and still get out after a number of years and try to put together a life.

The people who say things like 'just give up your guns, my family doesn't have guns and we're alive' are so ignorant to the world we live in lol. what if somebody came into your house with a gun?
Making guns illegal won't make them disappear or keep criminals from getting them, it will just make it impossible for law abiding citizens to protect themselves and their families.

originally posted by: abcd123420
The people who say things like 'just give up your guns, my family doesn't have guns and we're alive' are so ignorant to the world we live in lol. what if somebody came into your house with a gun?
Making guns illegal won't make them disappear or keep criminals from getting them, it will just make it impossible for law abiding citizens to protect themselves and their families.

Quite to the contrary. The persons saying those things probably have more experience in life, and have seen and been through things you perhaps can't even imagine.

I'll let you in on a little secret. The idea that people need guns to protect themselves from the government, it's like cavemen saying they need sticks to protect them from an army full of machine guns.

Really. A little gun is not going to protect you.

Iraq fell in a matter of days to the United States and coalition forces.

The only reasons places like Afghanistan have lasted so long is because they are supported from the outside, with lots of firepower. When the Soviet Union was trying to invade, it was the United States. When the US tried to invade, the Afganis already had a lot of training and weapons (a lot more than just guns) given to them by the United States.

Guns do too much harm. I'm sick and tired of people glorifying them.

I would prefer a world where there were no more arms. Ever. And no one ever harmed another person.

Where the sword and spear are changed into the plowshears and pruning shears. Where the prophecy is fulfilled:

(Isaiah 2:3, 4) . . .And many peoples will go and say: “Come, let us go up to the mountain of Jehovah, To the house of the God of Jacob. He will instruct us about his ways, And we will walk in his paths.” For law will go out of Zion, And the word of Jehovah out of Jerusalem.  4 He will render judgment among the nations And set matters straight respecting many peoples. They will beat their swords into plowshares And their spears into pruning shears. Nation will not lift up sword against nation, Nor will they learn war anymore.

Where peace reigns in all the land. Where a boy can go to sleep at night without fear. And a man can sleep without wondering what will happen to his family the next day.

Your gun, it will not provide the peace and security you think it will.

a reply to: Aazadan

I can see where you are coming from but if he is tried as an adult wont he treated as such by the system? Personally i imagine any 11 that has done such a thing should receive physiologically screening because the boy obviously has major problems.

a reply to: neo96

Well you do insist on blaming all Muslims for terrorism don't you?

If so, then all gun owners are responsible for this.

You can't have that argument both ways, despite whatever contrived argument or inane memes you throw at it.

originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: Aazadan

I can see where you are coming from but if he is tried as an adult wont he treated as such by the system? Personally i imagine any 11 that has done such a thing should receive physiologically screening because the boy obviously has major problems.

My guess is that as an adult he would be charged with second degree murder which would get him 15 years, and he'll probably take a plea to a lesser charge that gets him between 7 and 9. If tried as a juvenile he's still getting atleast 7 but juvenile detention will screw him up even worse. He could probably even do a large part of that sentence in a mental health facility rather than the prison.

a reply to: neformore

And you do insist on blaming ALL gun owners.

And the winner is ?

The one who isn't trying to regulate Islam.

originally posted by: zerozero00

originally posted by: Equisitor
a reply to: Cabin

What is wrong with the world when an 11 year old thinks its normal to shoot a girl over a puppy. What was his earthly experience to think that is what he should do when he got angry and who gave him that experience?

The parents should go to jail for child abuse as two children's lives have been destroyed by what they taught their kids.

It's because the 11 year old lives in a country where everyone has guns and it's acceptable to kill another man!

simple really!

Why are you even surprised?

Attitudes need to change before these incidents will stop

There is never ever going to be peace and harmony until you change gun laws and gun attitudes!

Im sorry but its nto acceptable to kill another man UNLESS ITS A LAST RESORT as in DEFENSE OF YOURSELF OR A INDIVIDUAL. Hippy thinking will not work as the 60s are a example. They failed.

OH a 11 yr old boy (who was not legally old enough t have a gun in the first place) Stole his parents gun and shot a little girl. Yeah it sucks. But you cant always watch your children. Im sure his parents didnt even know he had it till it went off.

It may be tragic but its no excuse to SCrew with the Second amendment. This country s soil is full of blood of people who fought for that right(and other rights) Innocent and not innocent alike.

Ive said it before. No one will abridge the second no matter the reason,and no matter the cost. Too many died to defend it an d many more will in the future.

originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: IShotMyLastMuse

When an 8 year old gets killed by a firearm, by an 11 year old, America does indeed have a gun problem. Tell you this the poor wee girl certainly had a gun problem.

It's not a gun problem. Are guns suddenly raging out of control in people's homes ? It's not the guns. It's the people. We have a problem in this country alright. How does an 11 year old boy surmise that it's proper to shoot his neighbor because she said he couldn't see her puppy ? Until we begin to accept the fact that morality in this country has decayed so badly that the adults starting families have no sense of morality to pass on to their children.

Where were his parents ? Why did he have a gun at his access ? Why did he feel like it was OK to use it ? I have a lot of questions, but none of them have to do with taking everyone's right to own a gun away just because this family didn't take the responsibility seriously enough.

originally posted by: zerozero00

originally posted by: jjkenobi
Negligent parenting on so many levels. First , not teaching the value of human life. Second, not securely storing a firearm. Third, not teach proper safety protocols for said firearm.

But yeah, blame the gun.

Again, backward comments galore

Americans love their weapons like us Brits love our pets

Responsible parenting wont make a difference if guns are everywhere and are acceptable, life has little value when you think it alright to be armed, life has little value until you see that the whole design of a gun is to kill kill kill!

Wrong on so many levels. I'd be hard pressed to say it any better than my good friend (I wish ) Samuel L Jackson did:

"I don't think it's about more gun control," said Samuel L. Jackson, who stars as a conniving house slave in Quentin Tarantino's upcoming revenge fantasy "Django Unchained." "I grew up in the South with guns everywhere and we never shot anyone. This [shooting] is about people who aren't taught the value of life."

articles.latimes.com...

The value of human life. Sadly in the USA it is all but gone and incidents like this will continue. Doesn't matter what inanimate object is used, it will happen if we stay on this course.

originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: Reallyfolks
Well slick, you give me a logical way to get rid of roughly 310 million non military guns in the US that doesn't require mass gun death of both citizens and government agents trying to do that. You tell me how to shutdown the black market of which estimates say 100 million of the 310 million are in. You tell me how you stop people from building there own. Seriously, you people keep screaming get rid of guns without so much as the first clue as to how to do it. I'll wait patiently as you state this logically. I'm expecting crickets, deflection, or something not very logical or based in reality.

There is no quick fix to doing so but periodic gun buys get guns off the street, confiscation and destruction of guns used in crimes also gets them off the street. As you get more and more weapons off the street the price of guns increase which puts them out of reach of the common criminal. Eventually they become accessible to only a few. To get to that point in the US optimistically it would take 20 years of sustained gun control and more realistically 50 years.

It is completely doable within your childrens lifetime. The real challenge in my opinion comes from 3d printing, right now people can build their own weapons with a CNC machine and some skills but 3d printing and it's wide accessibility in a few years is going to completely change the worldwide face of gun control as manufacturing becomes completely revamped and localized for most items.

I agree with destroying guns used it crimes, but buy backs are pretty useless though. Seriously they are. Plus as the guns destroyed in crimes and few buy backs take place new ones are coming in. Guns last and passed around. The printing is interesting but basically don't even need it. Any idiot who can drill two straight holes in a baseball bat can always go old school with a zip gun. Sorry the focus needs to be education, enforcement of current laws, black market and disagree if you like but these crap parents need to quit medicating their kids for every little thing with ssri drugs.

Your kid doesn't have disabilities you need to quit filling him with soda, high sugar foods, caffeine, etc. Take some other basic steps and be amazed how much they settle down. Don't need drugs, better parents.

a reply to: neo96

Actually, I don't blame all gun owners - I'm using your argument against you.

Having said that, I think there should be stricter gun laws over there. It doesn't necessarily mean taking guns off people. Better regulation, better systems and checks and balances could, I'm sure be introduced, tied in with better mental health care and better education as to the dangers of firearms (but hey, you guys detest "Obamacare" and "socialised health medicine", so good luck with that)

BUT... as the gun lobby throws the baby out with the bathwater continually that type of suggestion gets equated to "they're coming for my guns" and "you can't mess with the second amendment, even though its an amendment, which meant that someone messed with the original constitution", and while you're all done feeling sorry for yourselves another set of kids, or individuals gets killed.

In this case, the parents of the kid who got hold of the the gun should be charged with manslaughter, and BOTH do time for it. The kid himself deserves a break, and the best care that can be afforded to him from mental health profesionals because he's eleven and frankly while he may have had some idea what he was doing he is far, far to young to have made a reasoned argument in his mind about killing the little girl who - according to your arguments, wouldn't be dead now if she'd had her own gun.

a reply to: Squirlli

I was just thinking a while ago about my childhood and the availability of firearms to me.

I remember one time when I was quite young, my father showed me one of his pistols. He let me hold it, told me a few things about it. Showed me where he kept it. Then in no uncertain terms told me point-blank that if I ever touched it, he would beat the living tar out of me. And I had absolutely no reason to believe otherwise.

Several years later I had to go into that drawer to get something. His words held such meaning, even several years later, that I used a stick to move the gun out of the way to get the item I was searching for.

Modern day parenting techniques that use time out, losing their XBox, no allowance, etc. does not carry the same weight. My parents were old school. Mom was first, then Dad, then Granddad, and maybe even the next door neighbor! And, as if the pain wasn't enough, when the other kids in the neighborhood found out you got a whipping, you had to deal with that embarrassment too.

American society has changed a lot since I was a kid. There are a lot more distractions. Kids are getting all kinds of mixed messages. But I believe the promise of a good class A ass whooping still has some impact.

-dex