Seriously, if God or a higher power exists

If I exist or any other higher power that you believe in exists, how the hell am i/ we supposed to prove it. The World Is Soo messed up and everyone is so off based, how the hell would I/we prove it. God #ing exists. You want proof.

Here. Think this through.
I think therefore I am
I am therefore I exist
I am god,
Therefore god exists

Right?

Are you claiming responsibility for this mess?

originally posted by: skunkape23
Are you claiming responsibility for this mess?

Sure, why not

Maybe it's the believers that are expecting truth to their questions. Maybe those souls are testing the system to see. Maybe they are wrong and cannot be proved. Perhaps it's not to be understood. Like a water drop in the ocean trying to wonder why it does what it does. Thinking that they can be separated from the waves that define them.....

originally posted by: staple
Maybe it's the believers that are expecting truth to their questions. Maybe those souls are testing the system to see. Maybe they are wrong and cannot be proved. Perhaps it's not to be understood. Like a water drop in the ocean trying to wonder why it does what it does. Thinking that they can be separated from the waves that define them.....

But how annoying is it that soo many people claim to know. Or how people claim to have knowledge when they don't have a clue.

When someone claims to know, question them. I would rather show up at those gates wrong that believing mans fables and superstitions blindly.

I am god

Be careful now, that's blasphemy and we all know what happens to blasphemers. Eternal hell!

Seriously though, I agree. The concept of God has been so twisted by religion that people can't see any other definition other than the one religion posits.

God is not something separate from ourselves, it is an intrinsic part of our and everything else's being. God is in the very fabric of the universe and we are that fabric.

Maybe people should ask themselves instead "do the objective divine and demonic exists and how do my own behavior fit in on a divine/demonic duality scale?".

That answer might create a change to become more self aware.

a reply to: asinapi1

You can't prove something that is an intrinsic experience. I would suggest that 90% of all believers fall into two categories. The first, they have personally experienced a moment in their life where they feel God revealed Himself to them. I'm not talking about rays shining down from heaven with angels descending, but a simple coincidence (circumstances that seemingly resolve outside the paradigm of ones perception) or epiphany (one realizes something quintessential).

The second, is inculcation or indoctrination. A lot of these people believe, only because they've been brought up in a society or family where unbelief is unforgivable. Others of course are simply ignorant and follow along because they have found nothing more substantial or their faith doesn't play a pivotal role in their life.

Moral of the story: It's all about personal experience, not "proof" or "evidence" in the materialistic sense. If you believe great, if you don't, great. It will all be worked out in the end regardless of our collective ignorance.

funny. Everything we know of has a progenitor and yet when we come to the ultimate Progenitor we just cant seem to say we believe in it though its obvious. But isnt that just all too human......to deny or not see whats right in front of us all the time. We do it with negative relationships, we do it with work, we do it when were looking for our keys and theyre right in front of us on the table.

Maybe the problem is a human problem. Maybe we are looking but we cant SEE......maybe we are hearing but not LISTENING......touching but not FEELING.

Spiritual sense is real......but if we already have known problems with our more common, corporeal senses acuity, how do we suppose our spiritual sense will be properly calibrated and connected in order to perceive spiritual reality?

originally posted by: asinapi1
how the hell would I/we prove it.

“Trying to prove God is like defending a lion, it don’t need your help, just unlock the cage.”

This life is a preparation for the next...

Fire on the Altar MP3

...one of the main reasons you were placed on this planet was to be tested by God...

HOW CAN I FIND GOD?

Not long ago, the Lord gave me $200,000. I said, "Lord, what am I going to do with it? I don't need it. What did You give it to me for?" He said, "You passed my test."I said, "Passed your test? What in the world did I do to pass Your test?" He said, "You fulfilled a scripture. Tell them everywhere you go...tell them that the Bible is my test; every time they fulfill a scripture, tell them to never worry about the answers to their prayers."

Misguided Faith by Norvel Hayes.

Instantly, before I could complete my query, that same Voice in a tone of gentle thunder echoed within my head:　"Didn’t you read my book?"

　　Yeshua began His answer: "If you had read My Book you would have known all the answers."

"In fact, everything that My children need to know about how God thinks and works and judges and rewards, either before or after the Cross, is already in My Book. That is why I commanded mankind to ‘engrave My Words upon their hearts,’ and to pass them along from generation to generation. I wanted everyone to hear and know just Who I AM, the Messiah, their one hope of Salvation, their Most High God."

Dr. Richard Eby dies, visits heaven, and returns with a startling message

originally posted by: asinapi1
If I exist or any other higher power that you believe in exists, how the hell am i/ we supposed to prove it. The World Is Soo messed up and everyone is so off based, how the hell would I/we prove it. God #ing exists. You want proof.

Honestly, the issue here depends on your religion.

In Islam, we believe humans are only put on this planet as a test to see if we'll accept that there is a God or not. And if we accept that there is a God, will we submit to Him or defy Him? And if we choose to submit to God, then we have to prove righteous ourselves through our actions & inactions.

We don't believe God is something we can ever understand, just as it's impossible for a painting to understand its painter. We also believe God's existence is so great that our eyes literally cannot see Him, even though His influence is everywhere. I guess I'd compare it to a microbe trying to "see" and "understand" an aurora or a thunderstorm.

We also believe God made no creations in His image; has signs of His work & existence around us; and that He only uses humans as His messengers because most humans need other humans to relate to things. Though if you ask, most individual Muslims can also tell you instances in their own lives where God has provided something which fit as proof to that individual. As in, everyone has different criteria for "proof". So we pretty much feel that there's more than enough proof for those who believe & there will never be enough proof for those who don't believe.

Up until we became self-aware of our selves, we saw the world as a live place, with gods in every living thing and we interacted and were a part of this view of the world. Nothing happened to us that was not basically fated to us by the Gods. But slowly many people stopped thinking like this. We became separate beings and aware we could make our own choices were responsible for our actions and sometimes unhappily for the outcomes of those actions.

If you think about how our 'awareness has evolved from the earliest of mankind when we were developing language, communication and talking about how we then perceived the world in all its spirituality, you get the bigger picture.

There are still people who want the Gods of life controlling their fate. This has morphed into one single all-powerful God for most of them, and they choose to get him through their religions dogma and 'officials'' to tell them what to do and how to live their lives, before they evolve further and accept fully responsibility for themselves and their own decisions.

Although most who live their religious lives would hate to admit it, anyone non-religious will know that this is born out by some of their phrases used when they are trying to get someone, independent of their religious dogma to listen to what they say and want them to do.

They always starts with telling one: "God said" or "Allah said" - or "it is written", "we are told to" and I dare say many can add a lot more phrases used; but in essence, they really want you to stop being a perceived threat to them because of your independent thought and the fact you aren't frightened by what frightens them, you are free, they are not.

Frankly if God existed he is going to either be:

the Mean-minded harsh taskmaster with an unreliable temper.
Someone who loves mankind and hates what we are up to, so would have put in an appearance very much earlier when we started down the path to where we are today,
or, would have rushed out to grab the rest of the world to follow his holy book written based on the teaching of a somewhat 'unusual' choice of holy prophet.

But, being the boss of this planet, nevertheless he would have made his appearance well known to us by now. Its debatable whether he would be proud of us or not.

a reply to: asinapi1

"I am God therefore God exists?" Pretty weak argument.
If you are God so is every one else.

Which makes sense from a made in Gods image perspective.

But that will be met with ridicule from all sides because of preconceived notions everyone has about "God".

a reply to: asinapi1

You remind me of my high school debate coach reminding us not to use faulty reasoning only his faulty chain was:

God is love. Love is blind. Ray Charles is blind. Therefore, Ray Charles is God.

Your reasoning follows that kind of conceptualizing.

God exists whether you believe in Him or not. God exists whether you experience Him or not. He is.

Your mission in life is to decide how you will go and what you will do. You have this freedom, call it blessing or curse. You can seek God and find Him or spit in His eye or even deny Him and never see. But the idea that God exists because you make Him exist is backward. You exist because He exists. He set you in motion; however you want to believe He did that (I prefer setting the universe in motion myself) because He has simply always been here.

And you can experience Him, some of us have, but as has been mentioned, explaining a personal experience or three to someone who does not believe as proof is difficult at best.

a reply to: asinapi1

If I exist or any other higher power that you believe in exists, how the hell am i/ we supposed to prove it.

A higher power? Sure! That's not hard to believe. There are higher powers everywhere I look. The bank that holds my mortgage is a higher power. The DMV that issues my license and my auto registration is a higher power.

But, does the inevitable existence of a higher power necessarily mean that higher power is GOD? Nope.

But how annoying is it that soo many people claim to know. Or how people claim to have knowledge when they don't have a clue.

Guten Morgen- Have You ever read The Tao Te Ching? Because what You've typed above and to which I AM responding to is covered.

#56 " The One who speaks does NOT know; The One who knows does NOT speak"

But You don't even have to go past #1 that reads "The Tao that can be told is NOT the Eternal Tao"

So it doesn't matter what someone else says or does because they are not You. As soon as You look outside of the Self, then You are at risk to come under that person's influence. i.e. "Pastor Dave told us that...." Then You're getting Pastor Dave's view/thoughts and whomever taught Pastor Dave..

It is "seek and You will find" and NOT "Go to My Church™ and follow the directions..."

namaste

originally posted by: asinapi1

originally posted by: staple
Maybe it's the believers that are expecting truth to their questions. Maybe those souls are testing the system to see. Maybe they are wrong and cannot be proved. Perhaps it's not to be understood. Like a water drop in the ocean trying to wonder why it does what it does. Thinking that they can be separated from the waves that define them.....

But how annoying is it that soo many people claim to know. Or how people claim to have knowledge when they don't have a clue.

Asinapi1- Maybe you should ask yourself why you are so profoundly threatened by some one else's faith in a higher power.
It is obviously causing you to resent people that you have never even met, so perhaps it's a personal problem on your part.

Perhaps such an entity exists, but is not omnipotent and omniscient as people imagine, and is somehow limited in its capacity to directly affect or act upon this reality. Perhaps it exists yet is cruel by our standards (no doubt just by its own,) and simply chooses not to act except in select circumstances. Perhaps it does act all the time, but only manifests through personal, subjective gnosis, and not in forms or ways the human mind is always capable of perceiving.

Perhaps it doesn't exist at all and this explains the lack of positive evidence for its existing.

On the other hand, I also can't prove to myself with absolute certainty that I exist in the fashion I perceive myself to, nor that I have free will, nor that anything else I believe in is valid. (Examples: that emotional love means anything beyond potentially illusory meaning I ascribe to it myself, that any of this matters at all in the grand scheme of things, that love for my family or others is anything more meaningful than biologically mediated behavior and neurological impulse, that altruism or compassion are anything more than one of many behavioral tendencies, no better or worse than any other in the objective sense, etc. etc.)

This is why I'm agnostic, but always trying to "explore." One thing I will never do, is claim to know with any certainty one way or the other.

Peace.