A Su25 Can Fly At 10,000m Easily, And Higher. Proof

a reply to: TheBlacklist

So you are just going to persist in spreading false information which my OP just proved to be false.

Spreading false information...you are using RT as a source and you think I am spreading false information...Amazing.

Your OP proves nothing as they didn't change the powerplant for the SU 25UB, they used the same airframe as the regular Su 25, but miraculously it can fly higher than what the same plane that is a single seater can do with the same engines and airframe...can you explain how that works?

And you do know the manufacturer says it won't fly as high as you think it does, and if it could it wouldn't be firing any weapons as it wouldn't have them on the plane to keep the weight down so they could do something like that.

You know here is what is even funnier about your source pics there from RT...the man who built and engineered the SU 25 told RT that no SU 25 could have brought down MH 17...

Kiev-born Soviet and Russian aircraft designer Vladimir Babak said on Monday that the SU-25 jet – which was spotted tracking the MH17 Boeing at the moment it crashed down – did not have the capability to shoot down a passenger plane. He said the fighter jet could have successfully attacked the Boeing at an altitude of 3,000-4,000 meters, but not at the plane’s altitude of 10,500 meters. He added that air-to-air missiles would have only damaged the Boeing – not completely destroyed it while still in the air.

www.rt.com...

But here we see someone that is an expert and has only seen pics of the crash site and he insists it was a plane that shot down MH 17...even when the designer says it is impossible.

I think the designer and manufacturer know more about what their plane does than RT and their so called experts.

So what this all means is that any Su25 can do this, at least you have seen that a Su25-UB can do this and you seem to agree that it doesn't differ from the standard Su25, performance wise.

No you haven't proven a thing with your OP and the capabilities of the SU 25, because it has been proven more than once in more than one thread that the SU 25 cannot do what you think it can and neither can it's variants that Ukraine fly.

But how about contacting Sukhoi who manufactured and designed the plane and tell them their engineers know nothing and you have proof their plane performs feats it isn't capable to do. Here you go...

Sukhoi Company (JSC)
23B, Polikarpov str.,
Moscow, 125284, Russia, p/b 604
Phone:
+7 (495) 940-26-63
+7 (495) 940-26-64
+7 (495) 940-27-62
+7 (495) 945-44-22
Fax:
+7 (495) 945-68-06
+7 (495) 941-76-45
E-mail: [email protected], [email protected]

www.sukhoi.org...

Let us know what they say.

So this was your debunk? Just deny the provided proof and claim the opposite? Discrediting the source off course.

And that was your proof?

How about actually providing something that isn't made up to help back Russia's absurd theory of an SU 25 shooting MH 17 down...this is just one of many of their fairy tales about the SU 25.

Not going to work.

Your right you need better proof than that.

originally posted by: TheBlacklist
a reply to: tsurfer2000h

They are the Russian governments expert what do you expect them to say?

So when they say it was a BUK they are reliable. When they say it was fired from Ukraine controlled territory they are suddenly not reliable, even though this was determined using the same expertise.

Cherrypicking, much?

Problem with his theory is that the major damage was from the front left side, so that puts that into question.

Problem with that is that there are obvious exit holes in the left side too.

The manufacturer has nothing to gain from lying. It will not fly that high with ANY WEAPONS ON IT AND BE EFFECTIVE. Its SLOWER than the 777 as well. There was no mayday as well and no one and i mean No foghter pilot will shoot at a aircraft head on withing range of a machine gun because the debris could bring them down as well.

Also the Seperatist tweeted they shot it down mistaking it for a ukranian transport and when they found out it wasnt they deleted it. OP you might need to actually stop and lurk more.

As for the exit holes as thin skinned as a 777 is a rod from a BUK will pass through it like a laser through air. Bro do you even SAM?

I htink youre just here to be contrary and "make your bones' so to speak with the Russian cheerleader crowd

Ah forgot. You do know they can PHOTOSHOP a Altimiter correct?

a reply to: yuppa

Ah forgot. You do know they can PHOTOSHOP a Altimiter correct?

Photoshopped into a video, where you can see the meter running?

It is not slower either, it is flying over a 1000 km/h.

That was photoshopped into the vid too I guess.

As for the exit holes as thin skinned as a 777 is a rod from a BUK will pass through it like a laser through air. Bro do you even SAM?

So why are there exit holes in the left side if it exploded on the left side?

The manufacturer has nothing to gain from lying. It will not fly that high with ANY WEAPONS ON IT AND BE EFFECTIVE

This is explained in the vid, as I mentioned. Sukhoi gave a service ceiling of 7,000m because the cabin is not pressurised and it doesn't have an oxygen supply. It has nothing to do with the aircraft's performance.

And it's not like they came out after MH17 to say this. It is just an old qoute from their specific specification.

A R60 missile is only 45 kg. A 100 30 mm rounds weigh less than hundred kilos. This weight is relatively insignificant.

a reply to: TheBlacklist

Excuse me CGI ing a Altimiter. Its still manipulation. I dont believe the OP at all. RT has been caught in too many lies and even the Site admin will agree. It snot able to get to that height at all armed. [snipped]

a reply to: yuppa

It snot able to get to that height at all armed.

But it is, when unarmed?

originally posted by: ShadowLink
Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's only about 35,000 feet.
That's not much above commercial jet altitude.

There are quite a few other fighters that can operate beyond that altitude easily.
So what's so great about this capability?

Agree with you there. Even the late WW2 props could fly and excel at 10km with no problem...P47s, P51s, late BF109s, Ta152... Almost all the late war bombers and more. 10km is not a great indicator of performance for a jet trainer.

a reply to: kelbtalfenek

Even the late WW2 props could fly and excel at 10km with no problem...P47s, P51s, late BF109s, Ta152...

Exactly. The point is that people, even so called experts, have been claiming that the Su25 is not capable of this(and so it couldn't have shot down MH17).

It obviously is capable of flying at such altitudes, without a problem.

Are you not aware of this situation, regarding the Su25 and the MH17 tragedy?

originally posted by: TheBlacklist
a reply to: yuppa

It snot able to get to that height at all armed.

But it is, when unarmed?

According to the designers its not able to. Russia was even caught editing the Wiki page on it. Former pilots,and officials(all in russia and who can b e killed if they dont tow th e party line) Are not belivable. Ill always believe th e manucafturer over second hand stories and anecdotes. In other words they are flat out liars who claim it can get that height and hold it long enough to line up a shot to begin with.

TheR-60 missile is also HEAT SEEKING and would not HIT THE COCKPIT. it would had hit the engine,and we would had heard a MAYDAY. Also aircraft break up in varying ways accordin gto a number of factors. SO its very possible large debri can be found if hit by a BUK/SAM.

WW2 fighters had OXYGEN systems for heights over that so that comparison is bunk about. They were not pressurized they had MASK SYSTEMS for that though.

AHHH i found something. CONVERTING METERS TO FEET IS THE KEY HERE.

SO here we have a Russian media TWISTING the truth by Changing the terminology to fit their narrative by saying a Aircrafts.. Whos max crusing altitude of 22,965 FT(AKA 6999.73meters) IS well BELOW the height of the triple 7 that day (10,500 meters) AKA 34448.82 Feet.

Obviously SOMEONE has been adjusting their ALTIMITER to support this LIE. YEs you can make a altimiter say anything you want with soem adjusting. Commercial airlines do it all the time with a dial in the cockpit.

SO th emystery of the ALTIMITER is SOLVED. OP i just burned your Theory and RTs as well.

a reply to: yuppa

According to the designers its not able to.

Based on lack of oxygen supply.

Russia was even caught editing the Wiki page on it.

No, an IP adress was found tracing back to the Kremlin. How hard is it to spoof an IP adress? There are lots of sources that claimed a 10 km ceiling before MH17.

It means nothing.

WW2 fighters had OXYGEN systems for heights over that so that comparison is bunk about. They were not pressurized they had MASK SYSTEMS for that though.

So that means that the Su25 could do it too, when equipped with an oxygen mask? That is a very simple upgrade.

Furthermore, if you check the vid in my op, you will see that this Su25 is in fact equipped with an oxygen mask, the pilot is wearing one.

So according to your own suggestion, it is completely possible.

It is flying at 10,500m, doing over 1000 km/h, and it is flying level, or rather climbing slightly.

TheR-60 missile is also HEAT SEEKING and would not HIT THE COCKPIT. it would had hit the engine,and we would had heard a MAYDAY. Also aircraft break up in varying ways accordin gto a number of factors. SO its very possible large debri can be found if hit by a BUK/SAM.

I am suspecting a combination od both cannon fire and air to air missiles. Possible the cockpit was hit first with cannon fire killing the pilots and destroying electronics, finished with air to air missiles.

At least one engine has parts with holes in it.

Also, they are not guaranteed to hit the engine directly, it just homes in on them but there is a proximity fuse.

Depending on the angle it was fired from, it could explode somewhere between the nose and the engines.


It almost has to be a combination of cannon fire and missiles because one single BUK cannot make exit and entry holes on the same side, or entry holes on different sides of the plane from opposite angles.

a reply to: yuppa

Obviously SOMEONE has been adjusting their ALTIMITER to support this LIE. YEs you can make a altimiter say anything you want with soem adjusting. Commercial airlines do it all the time with a dial in the cockpit.

You just said yourself that WW2 fighters were capable of flying at this altitude, with oxygen masks. Since this Su25 was also equipped with an oxygen mask, you really have no argument against its capability to fly at this altitude, also.

Btw, I thought you said it was CGI.......

a reply to: yuppa

SO th emystery of the ALTIMITER is SOLVED. OP i just burned your Theory and RTs as well.

Sure you did.....

Altimeters can be adjusted to make up for differences in atmospheric pressure at sea level compared to higher elevated terrain.

The possible difference in readouts of different settings are well within a 1 km margin, way less even, probably. There is no way you can adjust one to get a difference of 5 km.

Btw, the radar image I posted was faked too right?

originally posted by: TheBlacklist
a reply to: yuppa

SO th emystery of the ALTIMITER is SOLVED. OP i just burned your Theory and RTs as well.

Sure you did.....

Altimeters can be adjusted to make up for differences in atmospheric pressure at sea level compared to higher elevated terrain.

The possible difference in readouts of different settings are well within a 1 km margin, way less even, probably. There is no way you can adjust one to get a difference of 5 km.

Btw, the radar image I posted was faked too right?

Im right your wrong. point blank. There was some tampering with the altimiter and with the radar to fit the narrative.
Also it dont matter if the SU-25 pilot had oxygen. the ENGINES themselves will STALL OUT Before it gets to that triple 7s altitude. Your source is Busted kid. Nice try.

a reply to: yuppa

There was some tampering with the altimiter and with the radar to fit the narrative.

You are obviously just spouting random drivel. First it was photoshop, then CGI, now it was being tampered with. Repeating this doesn't make it true.

Also, you just said this

you can make a altimiter say anything you want with soem adjusting. Commercial airlines do it all the time with a dial in the cockpit.

It is simply not possible to adjust it to display a difference of 5 km in height.

Also it dont matter if the SU-25 pilot had oxygen. the ENGINES themselves will STALL OUT Before it gets to that triple 7s altitude.

Complete BS. Even the debunkers and the manufacturer agree that it can at least reach that altitude. And you said this,

WW2 fighters had OXYGEN systems for heights over that so that comparison is bunk about. They were not pressurized they had MASK SYSTEMS for that though.

Did you not imply that the Su25 is not capable, because it has no standard oxygen mask?

Your source is Busted kid

Right, your contribution has been a joke, all over the place, and blatantly false.

Super crappy try, guy.

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a reply to: TheBlacklist

Complete BS. Even the debunkers and the manufacturer agree that it can at least reach that altitude.

No they don't.

You seem to hear only what you want to hear.

Repeating this doesn't make it true.

And that goes for saying an SU 25 brought down MH 17.

Did you not imply that the Su25 is not capable, because it has no standard oxygen mask?

Well it isn't, as it wasn't designed to be able to go where a pilot would need one.

Right, your contribution has been a joke, all over the place, and blatantly false.

Pot meet kettle.

False because it doesn't agree with your RT/Kremlin mouthpiece idea that an SU 25 can do this...what is even funnier they know for a fact the capabilities of the jet doesn't allow it to what they say it has, but of course there are the gullible that want to believe so badly they just don't want hear the truth.

Super crappy try, guy.

a reply to: tsurfer2000h

No they don't. You seem to hear only what you want to hear.

Is that so? Here is a post from a certain debunker, namely, you, qouting Babak,

The Russian Defense Ministry had said shortly after the crash of MH17 that had been seen Ukrainian Su-25 near the Malaysian Boeing. This version contradicts the Russian chief designer of this aircraft type in an interview with WDR, NDR and SZ. "We have worked with our colleagues played all versions and as a Su-25 can not understand that Boeing could shoot," says Vladimir Babak, who for 35 years with his favorite child, the Su-25, is engaged. The Commission acknowledges that the aircraft briefly rise to more than 10,000 meters, but there could not shoot without crashing. For the Su-25 is a low-flying aircraft, only for it had been constructed.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

So, it can at least reach 10,000 km. Did you forget about this?

In the vid in my op, it is flying at 10,500m, over 1000 km/h, and even climbing.

Or, as posted by Zaphod,

The ones that build it say that it can barely reach 10,000 meters for a short time. That's it.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

a reply to: tsurfer2000h

False because it doesn't agree with your RT/Kremlin mouthpiece idea that an SU 25 can do this...what is even funnier they know for a fact the capabilities of the jet doesn't allow it to what they say it has, but of course there are the gullible that want to believe so badly they just don't want hear the truth.

No false, because it can at least reach 10,000 m, false because altimeters don't have the option of offsetting by 5 km's, no photoshop was involved, no CGI was involved etc.