What separates man from everything else - Speech

There really isn't that much evidence that humans are fundamentally different from other animals.

Speech, social organization, tool use, environmental engineering, self awareness, theory of mind, kindness, cruelty, and even death rituals have all been observed in other species.

Furthermore we have relatively little data on humans in the wild- most humans are domesticated- they live in an environment built for them by somebody who had a use for them and are trained by discipline to live by behaviors they would not instinctively or creatively occur to them.

There is an argument to be made that our civilization is a separate entity from humanity, with its own evolution and behaviors and a symbiotic interaction that alters humanity's behavior but is not strictly the product of human behavior- like a computer virus running on our system that could just find another host if we vanished. We already have other species living successfully in our civilization- some of them with jobs. Maybe very few humans have ever been all that different from their dogs- they only receive civilization and it is not part of who they are- or maybe all humans are that way and this is an alien civilization that we have been domesticated into.

a reply to: The Vagabond

Well I followed you until this crap:

like a computer virus running on our system that could just find another host if we vanished. We already have other species living successfully in our civilization- some of them with jobs. Maybe very few humans have ever been all that different from their dog

Seriously? Okay give me an example of other species living with jobs among us.....You might not be different from your dog bud but I don't eat crap (maybe at work) and lick my balls (Sure wish I could)....You had me up through here...Sorry

a reply to: yulka

You only believe that because you haven't met my talking Cat!

a reply to: Chrisfishenstein

It depends on the branch of Christianity you follow.

The Son
Jesus Christ
The Word
Michael

All of these were in Heaven with the Father/God/Jehovah/Yahweh before coming to the Earth to act as a sacrifice to atone for the sins of man.

It doesn't explain how the older religions didn't know of this God prior to his appearance 8-9 thousand years ago. Man has had religious practices for tens of thousands of years.

Even though the Bible acknowledges other gods, none of the older religions mention this "one" God. How did they not know about him if he created them?

Again, it falls back to justification. Man creates gods from time to time to fill the emptiness of the void. We are here so our lives must have meaning. We justify that meaning by saying God put us here for a purpose.

We simply are.....

a reply to: Chrisfishenstein

Why do you work? A simple question

a reply to: 200Plus

Okay....Please read up on this.....Especially Noah's days.....That might help you understand a little more, and they knew about the creator very well...

originally posted by: yulka
a reply to: Chrisfishenstein

Why do you work? A simple question

I don't.....I just make tons of money surfing the web fighting you guys all day....

a reply to: Chrisfishenstein

I can get you videos from Germany of both of those dog behaviors humans are allegedly above. At least the dog doesn't cry while he's doing it.

There are dogs who decide where it's safe for their owners to walk, and dogs that can have you arrested, some of whom have been buried with police honors and avenged by the state.

My point is that a dog couldn't build our society but he can be trained to cooperate with as much of it as he can understand.
The same is true of most humans.

One other thing- there are a few areas of the planet where untrained animals have long been documented to trade gold to humans for food- pack rats in particular but also ants and a couple other critters. It's ASSUMED they just carry around the shiney until they find something better, but I've seen enough out of animals not to jump to conclusions.

a reply to: The Vagabond

Okay so your example back to me is dogs....

So we are a computer virus, dogs are much like humans without emotion, Ants and more....OH I can't go on....Sorry this is just making me laugh...

People all over these boards rip me for my beliefs and you guys all day talk about crap that makes ZERO sense and nothing to back it up....Peace

I've said this before ... the only thing that makes us different is ... cupcakes. Serious, what other animal takes it's food, mixes multiple ingredients, and processes it into something completely unrecognizable from the original?

a reply to: eeyipes

Wow that was informative....Cupcake...I am done now...Bye

a reply to: Chrisfishenstein

What is so far fetched and upsetting about this theory? Animals have a different spectrum of capabilities but the basic ingredients all seem to be there in some proportion, as evidenced by their ability to successfully interact with complex human behaviors.
What were you expecting? A Walrus as governor of New Jersey?

a reply to: Chrisfishenstein

Did you miss the point? Has any other species participated in any sort of "cooking" ?

Cooking started as a form of food preservation ... heat it up to kill bacteria, salting meat, making pemmican (mixing dried meat, fruit and fats to form a long lasting nutritious food).

Cooking (aka food preservation) has allowed us to live in harsh climates and travel all over the globe. When you depend on what you catch and forage today to eat, you starve come drought, fire and hardship. When you preserve your food against rot and ruin, you live.

Who ever thought that first prehistoric fire cooked steak would lead one day to yummy cupcakes? Well, it did.

a reply to: Chrisfishenstein

I'll rephrase, are you productive?

I wouldn't believe that speech is what separates us from most of the other animals in the kingdom, even though we do use symbols or images to convey language. Especially when communication face to face is said to be like 70 to 90 percent non verbal instead of verbal, unlike writing or typing which pretty much verbal.

Our perceptions of reality would be a huge one, since this can go into a multitude of ways and theories, where whether ones comfortable with their own self image and aware of a full extent, or to some one who could believe a false one and making exaggerations, like following suit or trying to make a trend. The idea of an ego most likely would be the cause of such a separation from that of a Herd or Hive minded community thinking all alike.

a reply to: yulka

Firstly, the video in the op flows with wisdom, inspiration, and intelligence. Very beautiful

I highly agree with the replies of Firefly_, The Vagabond, and Specimen.


"What separates man from everything else?"
I believe that the analytical Mind separates. When the Mind analyzes a thing, it dissects, divides, and compartmentalizes the thing that it experiences. In doing so, a distinction is established: this versus that. The more deeply the Mind analyzes, the greater the illusion of separation appears. As the concept of separation is strengthen through the analytical Mind, the more mankind becomes detached from animals, nature, reality, and the unity of existence.

I am not saying that animals lack Mind or analytical capabilities, simply, our overuse of analyzing and categorizing is the very thing that continues to separate us.

originally posted by: yulka
a reply to: Chrisfishenstein

I'll rephrase, are you productive?

Seriously? What don't you understand? I am on here all day, does that answer your question?

originally posted by: The Vagabond
a reply to: Chrisfishenstein

What is so far fetched and upsetting about this theory? Animals have a different spectrum of capabilities but the basic ingredients all seem to be there in some proportion, as evidenced by their ability to successfully interact with complex human behaviors.
What were you expecting? A Walrus as governor of New Jersey?

Wait, the governor of New Jersey isn't a walrus? Crap....

It isn't upsetting as much as it is funny to me....No the "ingredients" are NOT there in ANY proportion....They can't interact with human behavior until TAUGHT....They aren't born to understand, none of them are...Please don't compare training a dog at 6 months to a baby either...A dog at 6 months is decades older than a baby, the basic ingredients are not there to compare animals to humans...Sorry

But heck if your argument is for dogs, you should have that same belief to any animal on Earth, all can be taught it just takes a much longer time...I don't consider "understanding" what we are saying as a comparison to a human either....You can beat an animal into understanding without talking...

a reply to: Chrisfishenstein

Hello Chrisfishenstein, may Peace be with you. You said:

"People all over these boards rip me for my beliefs"

I have compassion for the attacks against your beliefs. Stay positive bro! I believe that when we ridicule those who ridicule us, only the seeds for increased negativity are planted: like things beget like things. Jesus spoke of this extensively in the sixth chapter of Luke.

Select verses from Luke 6


46 “Why do you call me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ and do not do what I say?

38. Give, and it will be given to you. A good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over, will be poured into your lap. For with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.”

27 “But to you who are listening I say: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you,28 bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you.

31 Do to others as you would have them do to you.

32 “If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners love those who love them. 33 And if you do good to those who are good to you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners do that.

35 But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be children of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. 36 Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.

Look at the animals of the world. Spend time with them, observe them, interact with them. Can't you see that they have emotions? Can't you see that they have individual personalities, likes, dislikes, and wants? The animals have memories. They share and teach culture. They have family and societal structure. They have verbal and non-verbal communication. They are engineers, architects, innovators, and inventors.

a reply to: Chrisfishenstein

Humans have to be taught too- feral children rarely survive capture because we're LESS resilient in our own society. That's also why dogs are more successful bums than people.
Lke a dog or any other animal people have varying levels of understanding that may limit but not preclude their interaction with the behavior of other humans.

Long story short most humans are just highly trainable animals. In fact for more most people, if you name their best personality trait, it'll be something dogs do better. Everyone likes a brave man, but let's see one of those fetch your slippers the day after he saves your life.