Socialism is Not a 4 Letter Word

originally posted by: daskakik

originally posted by: beezzer
And yet you ignore my premise that the only way to solve the problem is finding a way to pay for the high costs instead of finding a way to lower the costs.

Doesn't the arguement about minimum wage not working apply in that case as well?

Minimum wage is all about what the market will bear.

Artificially increase it? It'll have a negative impact on the market.

originally posted by: xuenchen

originally posted by: Isurrender73

I want to start out by saying many of the social programs in this country started out with the right mind but not enough forethought.

And many of the programs seemed to have ended up paying the administrators more than most of the donors make, and certainly more than all of the recipients get.

Ironic.

Yes corruption when it comes to who gets our tax dollars is huge. Socialism would look a lot better if we could end the corruption. The people should have some say in how much those who receive our tax dollars can make.

I don't want to make a person a millionaire who is running socialist organizations. Having greedy men in control of a socialist program is a waste of taxpayers money.

We should at least be able to put a cap on how much social instutes that run off our dime can pay their employees. If someone wants to be a millionaire they can join the free market and get out of social programs paid for by our taxes.

This way we would have socialist running social programs. Not greedy selfish people who are looking to get rich off our tax dollars.

originally posted by: Isurrender73

Obamacare is not a socialist program.

I bet the insurance companies and medical cartels think it is.

And liking it too !!

originally posted by: xuenchen

Yet all of the above are closely intertwined and separated only by very thin threads.

Pretty much. Which is why they are often confused with one another. Depending upon how they are used they will have some similar features and some opposing ones.

One thing they all have in common however is that they all deal with power and control. This also means that they all have the exact same internal enemy which causes them to fail. That enemy is Corruption.

originally posted by: NthOther
When did I even use that word?

I did when I pointed out the definition of fascism given by those that coined the term.

Why are we talking about socialism again?

Why are we trying to glamorize socialism again?

I do not see a socialized economy fixing America, if that is the aim of this thread..

Last I checked I am already paying into quite a few social programs Medicaid, medicare, social security etc. Oh and social security wont be around when I retire...

which means what?

a reply to: Bicent76

You're not paying enough.

You evil, greedy, greed-head!

originally posted by: beezzer
Minimum wage is all about what the market will bear.

Artificially increase it? It'll have a negative impact on the market.

How is that any different than the costs in AlaskanDad's post?

a reply to: beezzer



no I am not..

Or not enough people are.. TSK TSK

originally posted by: daskakik

originally posted by: beezzer
Minimum wage is all about what the market will bear.

Artificially increase it? It'll have a negative impact on the market.

How is that any different than the costs in AlaskanDad's post?

So you are for an artificial manipulation of the market by government that would inversely affect what people have and can afford?

originally posted by: daskakik

The guys that coined the term defined it that way. The way the propaganda machine co-opted it and applied it to any and all authoritarian government is incorrect.

Oh, "those guys". That clears it up for me.

originally posted by: beezzer

originally posted by: daskakik

originally posted by: beezzer
And yet you ignore my premise that the only way to solve the problem is finding a way to pay for the high costs instead of finding a way to lower the costs.

Doesn't the arguement about minimum wage not working apply in that case as well?

Minimum wage is all about what the market will bear.

Artificially increase it? It'll have a negative impact on the market.

One of the problems with min wage is globalization. As long as we trade with nations that have no minimum wage we will continue to loose production jobs to cheap oversees labor.

I think we should require all of our trade partners to adopt the same min wage as the US. This will bring skilled production jobs back to the US. As it will no longer be cheaper to produce them overseas and ship them here.

No tariffs just a universal min wage. True supply and demand, with a living wage for the lowest skilled laborer.

originally posted by: beezzer
So you are for an artificial manipulation of the market by government that would inversely affect what people have and can afford?

These days I'm not for or against anything.

All I said was that you will get shafted just like those who got shafted to implement the ideals that you hold dear.

Socialism here in France teaches people to follow eachother blindly for the sake of security and ignore the world outside with either blinkers or hostility. It suffocates creative thinking and creates administrative black holes that feed themselves. Thinking outside the box is frowned upon and many people just cannot comprehend the concept. If it's not in the instructions it shouldn't exist.

This is no real place for individuality, and although the word "entrepreneur" has french origins, you cannot be one without having to follow a rediculous amount of rules, jump through hoops, wave pieces of paper, tick untold boxes and conform to something that can be controlled by bureaucracy.......Ironic eh?

It's no surprise the so many kids here in France can't wait to flee their little communes to travel and educate themselves abroad or in the bigger cities and towns. It's rare to see teenagers and young adults in the country unless they drive a tractor or visiting on holiday.

No wonder I have given up on any kind of career here and I'll be sticking to renovating old houses for profit. No tax if I do one at a time as a main residence and as long as I don't do anything rediculous, no daft rules to follow or lines to tow.

Le "Sheeple".

a reply to: mOjOm

The levels of authoritarianism is the only difference.

originally posted by: Isurrender73

I think we should require all of our trade partners to adopt the same min wage as the US. This will bring skilled production jobs back to the US. As it will no longer be cheaper to produce them overseas and ship them here.

No tariffs just a universal min wage. True supply and demand, with a living wage for the lowest skilled laborer.

That would require massive authoritarian policies and probably World War.

a reply to: NthOther

First hit on google: "Fascism was a term coined by Benito Mussolini for his nationalistic and totalitarian political movement"

Any definition not in agreement with that definition (like the one you tried to use) is word games.

originally posted by: daskakik
a reply to: NthOther

First hit on google: "Fascism was a term coined by Benito Mussolini for his nationalistic and totalitarian political movement"

Any definition not in agreement with that definition (like the one you tried to use) is word games.

"Coined"

a reply to: nerbot

I agree too much socialism leads to communism.

I am not asking for anything but a balance. I don't want to stifle anything. Nor do i promote group think.

Democracy is not group think, except for those who refuse to think for themselves. You can't make someone think for themselves, but you can give the choice to.

It may even be possible to indoctrinate our kids to be free thinkers through the education system. We need 7 billion free thinkers, who use a democratic system to compromise according to the majority.

We don't need any group thinkers. We can cooperate without giving up our ability to think for ourselves.

a reply to: daskakik

That is not a definition.