Does the Discovery Kepler 452b Kill the Existence of God?

originally posted by: dukeofjive696969
a reply to: ketsuko

Most human behings dont follow there holy books to the letter, so that means hell is full and heaven well pretty empty.

We are saved through grace by faith and not through works. Following the Holy Book to the letter would be salvation by works.

a reply to: dukeofjive696969

That's true, but it doesn't make the book wrong does it? If I follow the steps in a math book and still get the answers wrong, who is wrong, me or the book? Naturally it's me. If I had studied harder I would be getting the right answers, it's not the books fault that I don't know what I'm doing.

One of the first questions I'd have for any alien I encounter would be: Are there hundreds of ridiculous religions on your planet, too? I've always thought it would be hilarious to discover a planet full of religious zealots, all arguing over who's religion is right. Only then could we humans put our 'faith' in perspective.



a reply to: ketsuko

Just curious there, Ketsuko: What makes your religion any more credible than any other? Is it because it's your religion?

originally posted by: Kangaruex4Ewe
In the Christian bible it states...

John 10:16

And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

Why would it destroy God if it is clearly written that there are "other folds/sheep"?

That's a good point, never thought about it like that.

I remember back in fourth grade during my years at a private Catholic school, I asked a nun who was our teacher at the time..."If God walked and died for our sins on earth, did he walk and die for sins on other planets?" Of course she didn't know how to answer that, paused and said, "that's a good question."

originally posted by: dukeofjive696969
a reply to: RealTruthSeeker

Thats a good one, never been re written.

Are you saying it has? Maybe the correct term should have been "changed". It's never been changed through out it's history, where people get that idea is amazing.

God is a human concept.

It is both right and wrong. I can never be just one or the other.

Right because, there has to be a true creative essence which started all things or we wouldn't be here.

Wrong because, if you believe you know it, or can know it, you are an idiot. And if you worship or revere such a God without knowing, you are reducing your own existence and opening yourself to servitude under false 'Gods'.

If you have, need, or seek a God. Then you are one as far away from 'God' as you can ever be.

It is the paradigm of spiritual children who are so afraid of the depth of the void, they need comforting from it.

To think you will be saved by a name is essentially marking yourself as a fool. Only the saveable or worthy will be 'saved'. And it will have nothing to do with their devotion to God.

So many of the atheists the Christians and Catholics think they need to 'save' will actually be the ones seeing heaven. And the religious 'children' will be sent back to the start, to see if they can get it right next time, without needing to wear training wheels.

Not in Islam it doesn't. The very first Surah (revelation) in the Qur'an labels God as "Lord of the Worlds". Yes, "worlds" as in plural form. And our religion isn't the only one that believes God is the Lord of all existence, not just an earthly deity.

AL-FATIHA (The Opening/Opener)
1) In the name of Allah, the Beneficent, the Merciful.
2) Praise be to Allah, Lord of the Worlds,
3) The Beneficent, the Merciful.
4) Master of the Day of Judgment,
5) Thee (alone) we worship; Thee (alone) we ask for help.
6) Show us the straight path,
7) The path of those whom Thou hast favoured; Not the (path) of those who earn Thine anger nor of those who go astray.

www.op-pc.org...

originally posted by: RealTruthSeeker
Some seem to think that the discovery of life on other planets would destroy the idea that God exist. Personally I do not think that it does.

"God" is a very generic term. It would be best if you attribute a specific god, if that was your intention. That way we would know which religion you're referring to, as I have a sneaky suspicion you're implying that Your god wouldn't be disproved if life was discovered on another planet.

Furthermore, each belief system has it's own literature, and it's own concepts of creation and/or life outside of Earth. So the answer to your question would be, yes and know and maybe.

If you're referring to a god, but not a specific religion, then the answer is simply no, it doesn't disprove a god.

originally posted by: RealTruthSeeker
What if we go to these planets and find intelligent life and learn that they to also believe in some form of God? What would people think about that? Would they say that all life in the universe is delusional? Or would they finally embrace the idea that maybe God really does exist?

Again, you sound like you're referring to your concept of god, not a god in general. If another planet believed that Jesus Christ came to earth to save the earthlings, then I certainly would be more for the likelihood of Christianity being somewhat accurate. Of course, that isn't enough evidence to completely change my mind. That doesn't exactly proof a god, that just backs up a specific belief system's credentials. They could have picked up on the religion after visiting Earth, for all we know.

It would not surprise me at all if intelligent life were to believe in a god(s). Simply because they do doesn't mean it likely exists. Once there is evidence, I will review it, and come to a personal conclusion.

But an incorrect idea, no matter how many people believe in it, is still incorrect.

originally posted by: RealTruthSeeker
I have no problem accepting the fact that intelligent life most likely exist out there somewhere. I don't think we are the only creation of intelligence that God has created, there is likely millions. And no, I don't think they all have the Bible, but it could very well be that they do in fact have some kind of concept of God.

Well that answers my first issue. I'm glad you accept the probability of other life though, good on you!

originally posted by: RealTruthSeeker
I agree with the last part of this quote. Why should the Bible be concerned with life outside of this planet? The scriptures are only relevant to life on this planet. Just because the Bible doesn't say life exist elsewhere does not mean that it doesn't.

I think this quote answers some of your questions. Many christian's don't believe aliens exist simply because it is not mentioned in the bible. Sure, it doesn't really disallow their existence, but I bet one of their arguments would be something along the lines of "If they exist, it would have been mentioned"

originally posted by: RealTruthSeeker
Anyway, what are your thoughts? Does life on Kepler 452b or any other planet kill the idea that God exist? For me it doesn't, but I would like to hear your thoughts on the matter.

A christian god? There are plenty of other things out there that disprove that.

A general, un-described god of the universe? No, other life would not disprove that concept.

a reply to: enlightenedservant

Salam my friend.

*65:12*
"Allah is He who created seven Heavens/skies/universes, and of Earth a similar number."


Quite a few verses touch on this subject.

a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

Salaams. Very true. I've been fascinated with astronomy since I was a child. And I used to wonder, "If Judgment Day was just the Earth ending, what about the people in the space station? Or what if there's a new mission to the moon? Would those people miss it?". So there was no way I could've accepted a God that was limited to just the Earth.

As a side note, I love the new avatar lol. I might seriously order some new toilet tissue now just for special occasions.

a reply to: enlightenedservant

So there was no way I could've accepted a God that was limited to just the Earth.

Exactly what I left out when I posted on page 1.

OT;
Lol I figured a few people have a confederate avatar I might as well join in.

a reply to: RealTruthSeeker

Sure, but if they can do it and are just as sentient as we are, then why can't we? With God all things are possible right? So why isn't not sinning possible even with God?

a reply to: Ghost147

This thread is not limited to any specific God, just God in general. There aren't any particular quotes from any religious book in the OP. If I wanted to talk about a certain God I would have made a different thread.

a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

For God all things are possible, but not for man. Man can't even go one day without screwing up. On another planet there may be intelligence that lives in perfect harmony. No wars, no killing or stealing, no pain and so forth.

a reply to: RealTruthSeeker

Yet you believe God is with you, right? So even with God, why is sin still inescapable?

If those aliens can do it then so can we, only as long as God is with us. And he is.

originally posted by: RealTruthSeeker
a reply to: Ghost147

This thread is not limited to any specific God, just God in general. There aren't any particular quotes from any religious book in the OP. If I wanted to talk about a certain God I would have made a different thread.

I assume that you think that K452b will contain life? I don't know how you've jumped to that conclusion, as the whole of NASA and the rest of the astronomic scientists have no idea at all. So, assuming that you've made that leaping assumption, my response would be;

Doesn't it depend on your personal beliefs? For example, if your god stated that this planet was the only planet with life, then yes, it would destroy the existence of that god. If your god stated that life exists everywhere, then no it wouldn't. If you didn't believe in any god to begin with, then this discovery makes no difference.

But I have to go back to asking why the discovery of this particular planet would raise such a question? There are other exoplanets that have a higher chance of containing life – the only difference between those and this are the type of star it's orbiting – it's a star like ours. This is the first exoplanet discovered orbiting a G2 star within the liquid water zone. At the moment that is the whole story, until we find out more about it.

Like I said in my first post; it confirms and refutes nothing. Yet.

a reply to: JohnTheSmith

Since I've only used generics in this discussion, then I'll continue. That's why it's called faith. Lots of people have it in lots of different things.

duke has faith in science. Some people take that to the point of religion.

a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

The Spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak.

a reply to: 321Go

It's a hypothetical question bro, we know life has not been discovered there yet.