What can TPTB possibly do to keep this global economic game going for at least another 30 years?

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

Unless of course said business goes under

Free house?

I guess so....until those lovely fellas from clockwork orange come to visit

a reply to: justQ

You have no idea what you are talking about

Actually, I do.

Most of the US debt for example is owed to Federal Reserve and not other countries like China

Who said anything about China?

Interest payments are due and better have the money

Did I say anything different?

Any kind of debt is bad debt if it becomes unplayable

Indeed.

That so hard to comprehend ?

No.

a reply to: ScepticScot

What percentage of GDP should the debt be at

Chinese got a good model

USA doesn't

Time will make it all obvious to everyone

originally posted by: justQ
a reply to: ScepticScot

What percentage of GDP should the debt be at

Chinese got a good model

USA doesn't

Time will make it all obvious to everyone

Well you said that debt should be low so I would assume you have a figure in mind. In my view it would be pointless to set a percentage (and attempts to do so are a political gimmick) as the correct level of borrowing, and hence changes to debt/gdp ratio, depends on the state of the economy.
If you don't mind elaborating what is it about the Chinese economic model that you think is better?

a reply to: ScepticScot

Well for one they have nationalised central bank that produces yuan without debt

Sadly this thread interests me no more

I get a feeling some people here are newbs

See you around

That's right, there is a much better measure than the debt as a share of GDP.

Debt service cost as a share of GDP is the one.

originally posted by: JedemDasSeine
That's right, there is a much better measure than the debt as a share of GDP.

Debt service cost as a share of GDP is the one.

Yes is better but only as a comparative measure, there is still not a correct level for it to be at.

a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

Oh, god would I love it if we lived with the duel system.. especially by sword. That would be the life huh, going through the Bush family like Ghost Dog.

originally posted by: TheLaughingGod
a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

Oh, god would I love it if we lived with the duel system.. especially by sword. That would be the life huh, going through the Bush family like Ghost Dog.

Untill you meet your match?

originally posted by: ScepticScot
a reply to: aiolosmartine
If you are talking about a major economic collapse as opposed to another recession the the government debt is not by itself a major factor. The US has an almost infinite ability to accumulate debt and despite much of the scaremongering the current debt position isn't that bad.
The government debt only becomes a problem if there is a significant shock to the system from some other factor.

Precisely correct; and the US can effectively write down that debt the same way it always has, through inflation, which means it pays back the dollar borrowed today with a dollar tommorrow with the purchasing power of 10 cents. They just keep rolling the debt over and pay it back with ever more worthless dollars.

a reply to: TonyS
Inflation isn't the only way, the correct approach is that as long as the economy grows quicker than the debt then the actual nominal debt is largely irrelevant. For countries with their own currency then then inflation will also reduce the real debt level. That is why it is sometimes annoying to read/ hear comments along the lines of the US/UK are bankrupt. Sovereign countries with their own currencies never need go insolvent (barring actual economic idiocy).
I would disagree with your description of dollars as worthless. Like all currencies it is ultimately just a store of value, that the value changes over time not make it worthless.

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: justQ
a reply to: ScepticScot

What percentage of GDP should the debt be at

Chinese got a good model

USA doesn't

Time will make it all obvious to everyone

Well you said that debt should be low so I would assume you have a figure in mind. In my view it would be pointless to set a percentage (and attempts to do so are a political gimmick) as the correct level of borrowing, and hence changes to debt/gdp ratio, depends on the state of the economy.
If you don't mind elaborating what is it about the Chinese economic model that you think is better?

Yes but looking back in history and see how others did with the percentage of debt to GDP. After WWII the UK had debt at 200% of GDP and the country not only survived but prospered. UK Debt

Japan is currently at 230% debt to GDP and they are not in total collapse. Japan Debt to GDP, so this is a current example.

Now we are currently at 102% according to FRED. So should we be concerned with our current debt causing an economic collapse? No.

a reply to: blargo
Exactly. Worrying about nominal debt is pointless. Worrying about debt relative to GDP without taking into account other factors is not much better.
The current political obsession with debt levels is far more damaging than the debt itself is.

Alot of great insight IMO from both sides of the fence.

originally posted by: TheLaughingGod
a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

Oh, god would I love it if we lived with the duel system.. especially by sword. That would be the life huh, going through the Bush family like Ghost Dog.

Yep! back in the days when our leaders were real men, not the cowardly little boy girl hybrids like most all of them including especially, Our president the whining, cowardly child, blaming all his failures and lies on anyone else but himself.
And Bush too, they would already be dead, and they know it. The SS could not help them, since the duel was a fight of honor to the death, and if the one being challenged was shown to refuse the duel, would be branded a coward and unfit for anyone to ever do business with ever again. So it was win or die or suffer the (thought of as worse) cowards death, for being below the lowest consideration for the unabashed display of cowardice. That suits most every single one right now.
Perhaps justice will be served in some other yet unseen way and they will all pay for destroying our freedoms and our American spirit. They have become the demons who are oppressing America.

Just look at how arrogant they are when they are accused of the slightest of things. It is so gagging to even witness it. But funny in a way to see the next generation of their supporters defend all their crimes but condemn others who do not support them for the very same thing.

Yep a sword running these maggots right through the gut would be glorious to see. Just a few scenes of them trying to pick up their entrails and crawling away in fear of the Devil's grasp on their soul and all the patriots up in arms would send the entire rat pack of them to South America never to be seen again.

And America would be free once again. For a time.

a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

Haha, yeah.. couldn't have said it better. I think their time will come, I'm sure of it. They will pay one way or the other, even if they have to go to hell.

a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

I guess if your ability to articulate your position to those in power, and provide compelling reasons why it's the correct position to take are so bad that they won't listen to you then picking up a sword and murdering them is a valid option. That's simply rule by thuggery.

originally posted by: Aazadan
a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

I guess if your ability to articulate your position to those in power, and provide compelling reasons why it's the correct position to take are so bad that they won't listen to you then picking up a sword and murdering them is a valid option. That's simply rule by thuggery.

I never said they should be murdered. In a duel the other guy is expected to defend themselves, but maybe you are thinking like me, expecting the worst of these cowards we have trying to implement whatever kind of tyranny over us they can, (Obama, Reid, John boehner, Eric Holder, etc.,

Would begin for a moment in a duel, and throw down their own sword in fear, realizing that judgement has come for them, messing their pants and sobbing in tears, and begging for their life to be spared while confessing in public every kind of deceit and dirty deals they had done behind America's back, and then also realizing that a duel is only something that a real man of the country "America", would even consider, not themselves, knowing they have none. Men who defend honor rather than hide from anyone who has a scrap of honor in them are the kinds of men they have hidden from, legislating new laws around themselves that protect them from honorable outcomes or justice.

To them, Justice is what they define it to be, but only for others who oppose them lawfully or politically. A fine example is Obama's latest defilement of the Inspectors General, making that job now fit only for their own eunuch's in government positions.

Eventually, they will see honor, dignity, truth, and morality coming like an army for them, and they will die of fright right where they stand. Murder them? Nope, it is not necessary.

originally posted by: NoCorruptionAllowed

originally posted by: Aazadan
a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

I guess if your ability to articulate your position to those in power, and provide compelling reasons why it's the correct position to take are so bad that they won't listen to you then picking up a sword and murdering them is a valid option. That's simply rule by thuggery.

I never said they should be murdered. In a duel the other guy is expected to defend themselves, but maybe you are thinking like me, expecting the worst of these cowards we have trying to implement whatever kind of tyranny over us they can, (Obama, Reid, John boehner, Eric Holder, etc.,

Would begin for a moment in a duel, and throw down their own sword in fear, realizing that judgement has come for them, messing their pants and sobbing in tears, and begging for their life to be spared while confessing in public every kind of deceit and dirty deals they had done behind America's back, and then also realizing that a duel is only something that a real man of the country "America", would even consider, not themselves, knowing they have none. Men who defend honor rather than hide from anyone who has a scrap of honor in them are the kinds of men they have hidden from, legislating new laws around themselves that protect them from honorable outcomes or justice.

To them, Justice is what they define it to be, but only for others who oppose them lawfully or politically. A fine example is Obama's latest defilement of the Inspectors General, making that job now fit only for their own eunuch's in government positions.

Eventually, they will see honor, dignity, truth, and morality coming like an army for them, and they will die of fright right where they stand. Murder them? Nope, it is not necessary.

So in your world people who stand in front of each other and then shoot each other are smart and honorable a not complete and total idiots? When you say nonsense like this nobody can take anything you say seriously.

a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed

Sorry, I would rather not live in a world where might makes right, physical might least of all.

At best you're delusional wishing for a world where the proper political reaction to disagreeing with someone on policy is to legally kill them.