Boy Scouts lift ban on gay leaders

a reply to: Xtrozero

If I may I think we focus more on Gay peoples sexual orientation too damn much. When you apply for a bank loans do you think, "I'm straight." When you file your taxes do you think the same? See my point. But many people get caught up in the sex thing.

a reply to: Darth_Prime
Because it does not seem to be a good idea to put a gay man or a woman in charge of boys. It does not seem like a good idea to put a man or a lesbian in charge of girls. Unless I knew them well personally of course, then it would be a different story.

a reply to: intrepid
Do you go camping with your bank loan officer often? Or send your son/daughter camping with your bank loan officer often?

originally posted by: TKDRL
a reply to: intrepid
Do you go camping with your bank loan officer often?

Only if I need a prime rate.

a reply to: intrepid
Hahaha oh man, that was great!

originally posted by: TKDRL
a reply to: Xtrozero
Really? That wasn't how it was back in my day lol.

Yes it was, and has been for many decades.

My mother was a den leader back in 1976 when I was a cub scout.

Female adult leaders in the BSA must under go the same Youth Protection training as male leaders.

Being an adult leader in the BSA, your gender does not mater.

In my pack, our current Cubmaster is a male, who just took on the role. Prior to him it was 3 different women. All of whom did an outstanding job running our pack.

Why was it females instead of males? Because parents have to volunteer, and in a LOT of cases, "dad" just isn't interested or is too busy.

I suggest when you get the chance to Google "Ventures". It's part of the BSA. Scouts in the Venture program are both male and female. They wear green uniforms. The adult registered leaders are also male and female.

Let's think of this another way: if you child is a boy, do you have issues that they have a teacher in school that is female? If your child is female, do you have issues that their teach is male?

We adult volunteers spend 1 hour each week helping teach these kids. We teach them many things, all based upon a couple of things:

The Scout Oath

On my honor I will do my best
To do my duty to God and my country
and to obey the Scout Law;
To help other people at all times;
To keep myself physically strong,
mentally awake, and morally straight.

and

The Scout Law


A Scout is trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly,
courteous, kind, obedient, cheerful, thrifty,
brave, clean, and reverent.

Everything we teach in scouting is based on the 12 points of scout law.

Doesn't matter if those teaching are male, female, straight or gay. Just like it shouldn't mater if the teacher in a school is male, female, straight or gay.

And lets all remember that being gay isn't like being in a religion.

Unlike a religion, gay people aren't "recruiting" people to bolster their ranks. You're either gay or not. It's not like being a Christian, Mormon, Hindu, or Islamist. You don't just choose your sexuality and run with it. Gay people aren't going around at 9am on Saturdays knocking on doors handing out "join our sexuality!" pamphlets.

a reply to: eriktheawful

Let's think of this another way: if you child is a boy, do you have issues that they have a teacher in school that is female? If your child is female, do you have issues that their teach is male?

Apples to oranges. In school trips more than a day, aka sleepovers, the chaperones were always male to male, and female to female. Maybe where you were there was a shortage of dads stepping up to the plate to be scout leaders, I am sorry that was the case for you guys. In scouts, we regularly took overnight, and full weekend trips. Makes sense the leaders are male to male, and female to female.

originally posted by: intrepid

If I may I think we focus more on Gay peoples sexual orientation too damn much. When you apply for a bank loans do you think, "I'm straight." When you file your taxes do you think the same? See my point. But many people get caught up in the sex thing.

I agree. I'm getting tired of the whole damn issue anyways. In the end it really doesn't matter much.

a reply to: MystikMushroom

There is an excellent Lewis Black bit on YT that explains this well. It's called "Queers". It can't be linked here but pretty much said what you did. It's apt.

a reply to: TKDRL

Which shows a couple of things:

1) You didn't bother to read my posts on how the BSA does Youth Protection and Two Deep Leadership.

2) You've not done any research, including the link I gave for the training we undergo to become Trained Adult Registered Leaders with the BSA.

3) You are basing how you feel about something without actually knowing how the BSA works, the rules we have to follow, and the strict enforcement of those rules.

Go back and look at my other posts in this thread, and then go to myscouting.org and check out the training and pay attention to the Youth Protection training we have to go through and what those rules are.

You might understand better.

a reply to: eriktheawful
All that said, I would still rather not sign up my daughters or sons in groups run by the opposite sex, or gay leaders. That is my personal preference. Same as I wouldn't let my sons or daughters go on overnight trips chaperoned by opposite sex or gay chaperones. That is still my right to voice my preference right? Lots of "safeguards" in place for sports like football, I still wouldn't let my sons play it. Not until they were into their teens at least, and could at least attempt to convince me to change my mind with logic.

a reply to: TKDRL

Because all Gay people prey on Boys? and Lesbians prey on Girls?

How can you be certain that a Scout leader hasn't been Gay and no one knew? it just seems ridiculous to Ban a person that may meet the criteria of a Scout Leader just because he is gay and people are ignorant and believe that it's unsafe for Gay people to be around Kids

a reply to: Darth_Prime
No, not all men prey upon girls either, don't mean I am gonna trust them I don't know with my daughters. It's about equality, I don't trust gay people I don't know anymore than I trust straight people I don't know. Get it now? Totally equal.

a reply to: Darth_Prime

I've met some gay men that unless they told you they were gay you wouldn't know.

Some people have this idea that all gay people are flamboyant, effeminate, and somehow wanting to convert everyone "gay". As if being gay is some kind of club you can join. Or worse, they seem to believe being gay is some kind of communicable disease they can catch from being around a gay person.

The fact of the matter is, no matter how hard you try -- you're going to have to interact with a gay person at some point in your life. Teaching understanding, tolerance (that's NOT the same thing as enthusiastic support) makes this world a better place.

100 years ago instead of gay people it would have been black people. Does anyone here not want their kids in a troop with a black leader? Anyone?

*crickets*

It's pretty much the same thing.

a reply to: TKDRL

So...you just don't trust people in general?

originally posted by: TKDRL
a reply to: Darth_Prime
No, not all men prey upon girls either, don't mean I am gonna trust them I don't know with my daughters. It's about equality, I don't trust gay people anymore than I trust straight people. Get it now?

I do. I have 2 daughters. The youngest will be 20 in Oct. That instinct NEVER goes away. Even when they bitch at you about it.

a reply to: MystikMushroom
No, not really. Especially when it comes to putting people in charge of them overnight. It complicates things a bit, like scouts, when overnight is a regular thing in the summers.

a reply to: MystikMushroom

Yes, thank you

you can't get indoctrinated into a Sexuality, just like you can't get conversion therapy etc. i have always said that teaching tolerance is never a bad thing, especially when people say "How am i supposed to explain this to my child"

you don't have to give them a visual Sex-Ed class, but teaching children that there are many different kinds of people, sexuality,gender, race, religion etc but that doesn't make them bad or good or whatever. and i agree that doesn't mean you have to show up at pride parades with Rainbow Flags, but the more we divide children into thinking at a young age the more hate and intolerance and respect is taught

a reply to: TKDRL


I understand being protective, but from what you said, you are going to trust a straight Man with your Son over a Gay man