Drag Queens banned from Pride Parade in Scotland

I've only met one transvestite in my life...

And I didn't ask too many questions because as I'm ignorant to the topic I didn't want to offend...
I just let them discuss it when they felt like it...


She/he (I'm guessing she, but there is my ignorance) told me it was to do with her pagan beliefs...

That she felt it was due to a connection with her pagan goddess('s)...


This doesn't seem to align with what I've read so far in this thread such as gender fluidity, entertainment, cosplay etc...

They never alluded to a biological effect from what I remember, just her beliefs.




*For clarity it was a guy in a skirt and bra under his vest*...
But I say she as that's what I assume is correct.



Anyways, I don't know why that would offend anyone to be honest.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
*For clarity it was a guy in a skirt and bra under his vest*...

Oops, you messed up there fella, expect a flaming.
I've started using the word 'person' or 'individual' now in any discussion such as this, they are the only words I can see which do not attract any offence.

originally posted by: 8675309jenny
Can someone explain to me WTF these PRIDE festivals are all about?????

I thought being homosexual is NOT a choice???? Which I happen to agree with.

So if it's not a choice, then it's not an ACHIEVEMENT.

If it's not an achievement then there is nothing to be PROUD of.

White pride is stupid because you were BORN white, you didn't achieve it! Likewise for all races, or really ANYTHING you didn't somehow earn, influence, achieve etc. Black pride?? Nope, you were simply born black.


Maybe I need to get involved in organizing some BLUE EYE PRIDE events, or BROWN HAIR PRIDE... or any other equally stupid trait that I never CHOOSE or CREATED....


These festivals have turned into obnoxious, outlandish, and often INDECENT displays of taunting and PC in-your-face narcissism by insecure people who just HAVE TO FORCE their specific brand of PC-XYZ in the face of PERCEIVED hate from just regular average people.


In other words, WE DONT CARE ANYMORE. You can stop flaunting it around like a goddamn badge, because WHOOPTY DOO, you're gay. We're all cool with it, seriously, now get over yourself!!!

Political achievements.

Quite obviously.



Force lulz... In capital letters no less.

"Now get over yourself"...

You planning on forcing that ideology?

a reply to: grainofsand

I was just pointing out which gender they were born.

So the story was fully detailed and maybe could get an explanation.



Edit: this will probably be misconstrued as well...

Sigh.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: grainofsand

I was just pointing out which gender they were born.

See that's the thing, you assumed male, but as stated in this thread, if the person identifies as female then they are not male. Unless/until a person tells you the gender they identify with then we cannot know.

So the story was fully detailed and maybe could get an explanation.



Edit: this will probably be misconstrued as well...

Sigh.

It probably will, that's why it is best to use the terms 'person' or 'individual' as far as I see it.
Any assumption is apparently offensive to many.

Not having a go at you mate, just seeing an argument you could be shot down with. You can't assume anything about gender these days and doing so is apparently offensive so become gender blind and just refer to folk as a person to be safe.

*Edit*
I found this interesting: internationalspectrum.umich.edu...

Please Note: It is very important to respect people’s desired self-identifications. One should never assume another person’s identity based on that person’s appearance. It is always best to ask people how they identify, including what pronouns they prefer, and to respect their wishes.

So, even though I'm a rough looking general builder, with a few days stubble, if you assumed (correctly) my gender was male but I identified differently then it could be offensive to me.
That is how things have changed, it is why I try to only use neutral terms now, far too easy to offend someone these days.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
I've only met one transvestite in my life...

And I didn't ask too many questions because as I'm ignorant to the topic I didn't want to offend...
I just let them discuss it when they felt like it...


She/he (I'm guessing she, but there is my ignorance) told me it was to do with her pagan beliefs...

That she felt it was due to a connection with her pagan goddess('s)...


This doesn't seem to align with what I've read so far in this thread such as gender fluidity, entertainment, cosplay etc...

You might want to read this post in another thread then as it goes into things like spirituality etc..

originally posted by: pfishy
a reply to: BuzzyWigs

So, are the transgendered crowd associated with Free Pride actually offended, or are the organizers just so caught up in the fear of possibly offending anyone or anything that they just made an incredibly near-sighted and ridiculous decision?

They want their own Transgender Pride.
Separate from the regular Pride events.

So far, no problem.

Then someone says "No drag queens welcome!"
That did not not need to be said, but opps, there it is.
"This is our thing, not another fag thang."

Okay, I get that. I understand the feeling.
It is a bit odd to claim to stand for inclusion
and then turn around and be so exclusive.
Sure, religion does that all the time, but
that doesn't make it right.

So what is going one here????

The truth is the "alternative community"
is mostly run by white gay men. Those
who are lesbian or trans don't get into
positions of power or influence unless
they are "on-board" with the agenda
being set by while gay men. Some goes
for those who are Black or Latin, in
most gay circles, White rules.

I say have a Trans and Lesbian Pride.
That way to combine two groups who
are often under-represented.

Trust me, those gay white men who
like to dress in drag have there only
thing... they won't be interested in
attending this one... and if they do?
Then welcome them!

a reply to: JadeStar

Thanks Jade.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: JadeStar

Thanks Jade.

You're welcome. BTW: There's an old book called "Transgender Warriors" by Leslie Feinberg which goes into the history of transgenderism in shamanism, and other spiritual traditions, creation stories, etc.

a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

A Transvestite is different than a Trans Person, it would depend on if thy were Trans, or Transvestite

originally posted by: Darth_Prime
a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

A Transvestite is different than a Trans Person, it would depend on if thy were Trans, or Transvestite

And that's the thing, unless someone tells you how they identify there is no way of knowing so 'person' or 'individual' are the only sort of safe words these days.

The parade might be in Scotland, but everyone knows it's English people marching in it.

a reply to: Drest

What the deuce?!
There's probably people from all over the UK who go there, as well as around the world.
I do not understand your silly assertion?

a reply to: wasaka

Pride is supposed to be inclusive to all Groups and communities of the GLBtQ+ umbrella.

A lot of trans people don't want to associate with the GLBTQ+ community and live their authentic life as their Authentic Gender without the Trans Label, there has been huge pushes for trans rights even within the last year, and a lot more Tran issues being talked about openly, but at the same time a lot of Trans people don't want to be activist, don't want that Trans Label so there may look like an Misrepresentation of trans people

I think it's hard, because the Trans label can be powerful, i know there are Trans people that work with the HRC that are Stealth so they don't get represented as Trans, but at the same time, they are just being their authentic self and the trans label is not needed

it's a difficult situation, Look at Laverne Cox (who i love) who is an 'out' Trans Woman who is an actress, a speaker, an activist.. she is gaining these positions as a trans Woman and Bringing visibility to Trans issues all over. she is needed just as much as the Trans people who identify as Cis-Normal and don't need that Trans label and who don't associate with the GLBTQ+ Umbrella

I think both are needed, both are integral for Trans-Normal life

speaking of Laverne Cox

“Gender is policed in such a way that it does not just affect transgender people,” she said. “It affects gay-identified men, straight-identified men. And straight-identified men [who are] deeply policed. As I date a lot of straight-identified men, I’ve seen them so deeply internalize these ideas very rigidly about what it means to be a man -– to be a straight man. “

She is quite brilliant

a reply to: JadeStar

That sounds familiar, not as a book but as a concept...

I wish I wasn't ill at the time or my polymathic mind would have let the info sink in...

She did mention Druids...
I remember that much.

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: Drest

What the deuce?!
There's probably people from all over the UK who go there, as well as around the world.
I do not understand your silly assertion?

I'd hazard a guess that was a Scottish dig at the English bloods...

Whether the humour was intended is a different question.

a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

...after having a quick look through past post history it is my guess that no humour was intended.
It is always disappointing when new members make silly drive-by one liners in threads which are clearly serious and mature discussions though.
Facebook generation is all, I suppose.

a reply to: grainofsand

I agree, if you don't want to add to the discussion don't, but if you don't have anything to add, or ask a question, or even share your opinion.. it does nothing to progress

a reply to: Darth_Prime

Agreed.
...and speaking of England as that member brought the place into conversation, I have to say that in my part of the SW coast we have a high percentage of people from the whole gender spectrum. We have our bigots of course but the vast majority of folk don't really give a toss so long as people are nice, so the bigots keep their bigotry to themselves as they will be quickly shouted down by everyone else.

It is a tourist dominated economy though so that does affect everyones behaviour and attitudes to others.

I like living in a place where someone wearing a dress, but with the physical appearance of the male sex, will generally not generally be subject to abuse.
20 years ago we had a couple of 'gay' nightclubs and a few bars, but they all closed a few years ago as the 'straight' clubs started enforcing zero tolerance for bigotry, so coupled with internet dating there was no need for segregated places of entertainment any more.

I had many a fun night at the gay clubs over the years before mainstream clubs changed their policies, the music was better, there were no blokes looking moody and wanting fights, just good fun and dancing. The only drawback was having to say "Sorry I'm straight" whenever I was approached by an admirer.

These days club land is a place where it's a case of 'do your thing' so long as it is not unkind or mean. It doesn't matter who is wearing what, or who is kissing each other, it's all about safe friendly fun for everyone.
I would not wish to live somewhere which was not as accepting as where I am now...and I'm a 'privileged' white straight male.

a reply to: grainofsand

Thank you

Question: would your straight Bars/Clubs Host Drag Queens?

It does sounds accepting, and you are right there will be people who don't agree with a bunch of things... but it's one thing to voice hatred and another to have your opinion of things and let others be... it's like people who show up at Pride holding "God Hats ****" signs, or shouting Slurs at people.. what is the point of spreading unnecessary hate?