World Trade Center 7 Explosion and Controlled Collaspe Caught on Tape.

There was no damage to ....what...?... eighty odd floors in one tower.
Yet it went down at a speed that resembled a demolition.
No resistance in any of them.....just straight down to the ground..no slowing down, no stopping halfway or whatever....
The whole masses just dropped as if there was nothing underneath.

I don`t know what helped them come down but any demolition company would have been proud to execute such a feat !

a reply to: cardinalfan0596

Yes, oil, gasoline, petroleum, jet fuel or kerosine. But - oxygen deprived. If sufficient oxygen is supplied, all of these burn rather cleanly (as can be seen when a jetplan crosses overhead). Only if there isn't a sufficient amount of oxygen - only in that case petroleum (kerosine) burns with thick black smoke. I'm assuming the planes contained jet fuel. If not supplied with additional oxygen burning jet fuel reaches temperatures of roughly 1500°F (~800°C). Do we agree?

a reply to: jaffo

Calling my aunt my uncle does not give her a beard.

You are waving the same red flag over and over again. It is known as "argument from authority". A person that applies these tactics is, I quote: "stressing status and appealing to authority. People who use this tactic try to convince you by quoting some ‘authority’ who agrees with their claims and pointing to that person’s status, position or qualifications, instead of producing real-world evidence. "

Ok. Right. Let's put aside the what happened question. Answer the ones that don't have a suitable answer, who and why and how?

Who did it?
Why did they do it?
How did they do it?

Those 3 questions are where the conspiracy falls apart.

Top tip. To start a war for oil doesn't work as an answer. Iraq was the wmd / no wmd debate. Nothing to do with 9/11.

originally posted by: scottyirnbru
Who did it?

Our alien buddies. We provided a half-decent coverup.

Why did they do it?

To warn us once and for all to stay out of their way and stop trying to reproduce their technology. They made an agreement with us and kept their part of the bargain, we're supposed to do likewise. They are very peculiar about keeping agreements, you'd better not break one you made with them. So, they punched a hole in the recently reinforced part of the Pentagon (just to show they could) and brought down at least 2, probably more of the most significant buildings in America's most significant city (just ot show they could). They deliberately choose these locations, choose the date too - come on, 911.. - and changed the weather conditions to ensure it would be a nice, clear day with 100 percent vision.

How did they do it?

Alien Ray. Told ya.

Those 3 questions are where the conspiracy falls apart.

I believe I just gave a very plausible explanation - which makes sense as it is the truth - and the only thing I saw falling apart are a number of buildings with near free fall speed.

Top tip. To start a war for oil doesn't work as an answer. Iraq was the wmd / no wmd debate. Nothing to do with 9/11.

And no WMD either. Correct.

I haven't heard the US Government side of the story, but because the aliens told our government IN ADVANCE what would happen - not years before, but weeks before, but still, in advance - the Government had some time to think out a strategy. They knew that they would not be able to stop the attacks, so a coverup had to be thought out. They already knew about some cells planning to fly airplanes into the towers - something they had discovered in an early stage and monitored closely so they could stop it if need be - and decided to use this. After all, there would be plenty of proof availalble that such cells existed - they did! OBL had not received the information until after the attacks so denied being the masterbrain behind it - but when he heard the truth, he agreed to be the American scapegoat, given they would let him off the hook. Which they did.

So, there's the story.

Alien ray. Told ya.

a reply to: ForteanOrg

If you were right, we'd have a new "Wunderwaffe". We could simply use old airplanes,...

Where are you going to acquire old B-757's and B-767's that cannot be traced? Only a certain number of those aircraft were built and can easily be traced because acquiring aircraft leave behind long paper trails.

... fill them up with kerosine, ...

What does jet fuel consist of?

..fly them into any high-rise building and not only would that high-rise building buckle...

It was determined that fire, not the aircraft impacts, had caused the buckling of WTC 1, WTC 2 and WTC 7 just prior to their collapse, and remember, WTC 7 was not struck by an airplane yet it buckled in the moment just before it collapse.

... and come down at free fall speed, but as a bonus a totally different type of high-rise building, standing near it, would also collapse at free fall speed.

Looking are the videos, none of the WTC buildings fell at freefall speed.

a reply to: Tardacus

this response is the single most eye-opening post that i have seen on this site in 5 years. thank you. be careful.

a reply to: lambros56

There was no damage to ....what...?... eighty odd floors in one tower.
Yet it went down at a speed that resembled a demolition.

I don`t know what helped them come down but any demolition company would have been proud to execute such a feat !

There were demolition experts and engineers working on projects in the area at the time and none of them heard demolition explosions. Review the video I posted and you will see from the close-up video that no explosions are heard as the WTC buildings collapsed.

No resistance in any of them.....just straight down to the ground..no slowing down, no stopping halfway or whatever....
The whole masses just dropped as if there was nothing underneath.

Look at this photo and tell us why the WTC building is not collapsing at free-fall speed.

contrailscience.com...

Could it be that dust plumes and debris, which are falling at free-fall speed, are outpacing the collapse of that WTC building, which is an indicator that the WTC building is not collapsing at free-fall speed at all?

Yes indeed.

originally posted by: ForteanOrg

originally posted by: scottyirnbru
Who did it?

Our alien buddies. We provided a half-decent coverup.

Why did they do it?

To warn us once and for all to stay out of their way and stop trying to reproduce their technology. They made an agreement with us and kept their part of the bargain, we're supposed to do likewise. They are very peculiar about keeping agreements, you'd better not break one you made with them. So, they punched a hole in the recently reinforced part of the Pentagon (just to show they could) and brought down at least 2, probably more of the most significant buildings in America's most significant city (just ot show they could). They deliberately choose these locations, choose the date too - come on, 911.. - and changed the weather conditions to ensure it would be a nice, clear day with 100 percent vision.

How did they do it?

Alien Ray. Told ya.

Those 3 questions are where the conspiracy falls apart.

I believe I just gave a very plausible explanation - which makes sense as it is the truth - and the only thing I saw falling apart are a number of buildings with near free fall speed.

Top tip. To start a war for oil doesn't work as an answer. Iraq was the wmd / no wmd debate. Nothing to do with 9/11.

And no WMD either. Correct.

I haven't heard the US Government side of the story, but because the aliens told our government IN ADVANCE what would happen - not years before, but weeks before, but still, in advance - the Government had some time to think out a strategy. They knew that they would not be able to stop the attacks, so a coverup had to be thought out. They already knew about some cells planning to fly airplanes into the towers - something they had discovered in an early stage and monitored closely so they could stop it if need be - and decided to use this. After all, there would be plenty of proof availalble that such cells existed - they did! OBL had not received the information until after the attacks so denied being the masterbrain behind it - but when he heard the truth, he agreed to be the American scapegoat, given they would let him off the hook. Which they did.

So, there's the story.

Alien ray. Told ya.

This alien ray garbage is not even remotely funny. Hey mods, aren't there rules about derailing threads and continually posting garbage that contributes nothing?

a reply to: ForteanOrg

Behold a REAL intense fire, which burned for 5 hours. Look at the intensity of the fires.

Was that building struck by an B-767? If not, what is fueling that fire?

Unlike the WTC buildings, fire protection remained intact, whereas, the lack of fire protection for the WTC buildings allowed their steel frames to be exposed directly to the fires, not to mention that they suffered massive impact damage unlike the building you posted.

Here is a building engulfed in a fire in Spain, but what if fueling that fire?

richardedmondsondotnet.files.wordpress.com...

This is what the building looked like after the fire was extinguished.

richardedmondsondotnet.files.wordpress.com...

As you can see in the last photo, the only thing of that building left standing is the concrete core. The outer steel frame of the Windsor building had collapsed during the fire leaving only the concrete core standing.

a reply to: ForteanOrg

OBL had not received the information until after the attacks so denied being the masterbrain behind it - but when he heard the truth, he agreed to be the American scapegoat, given they would let him off the hook. Which they did.

OBL was part of the 9/11 planning process. In 1995, the Philippine government warned the United States that terrorist were planning to use aircraft to kill thousands of people, and the plot included flying an aircraft into CIA headquarters under the Bojinka Plot.

The Bojinka Plot

Another plot that was considered would have involved the hijacking of more airplanes. The World Trade Center (New York City, New York), The Pentagon (Arlington, Virginia), the United States Capitol (Washington, D.C.), the White House (Washington, D.C.), the Sears Tower (Chicago, Illinois), and the U.S Bank Tower (Los Angeles, California), would have been the likely targets.

Abdul Hakim Murad said that this part of the plot was dropped since the Manila cell could not recruit enough people to implement other hijackings in his confession with Filipino investigators, prior to the foiling of Operation Bojinka.

This plot eventually would be the base plot for the September 11 attacks which involved hijacking commercial airliners as opposed to small aircraft loaded with explosives and crashing them into their intended targets. However, only the World Trade Center (which was destroyed) and The Pentagon (which suffered partial damage) were hit.

en.wikipedia.org...

The mastermind of 9/11 was Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, whose nephew, Ramzi Yousef, was the terrorist who built and detonated that huge bomb beneath WTC 1 in 1993.

1993 WTC 1 Bombing

en.wikipedia.org...

a reply to: ForteanOrg

Assuming the beams were weakened, they would be weakest during the time the kerosine still burned - why then did the towers not collapse at that moment?

It takes time for temperatures to fully satuation a steel column.

Why did they hesitate (and cooled down, regaining their strenght)?

When steel is heated to a point of weakening, it does not regain its strength.

And how come that the entire construction came down in the blink of an eye - regardless that 90 floors below the impact zone hadn't even been damaged at all?

That is simple. The floor attachment brackets at each floor level were unable to arrest the downward momentum of the upper floors, so as each floor level collapsed upon the next lower level, the total mass of the collapsing floors continued to increase the collapsing mass at each floor collapse and so on. Remember, WTC 1, WTC 2 and WTC 7 suffered massive impact damages whereas, structural loads were redistributed to undamaged steel columns, which are now bearing additional structural loads. The impacts dislodged the fire protection for the steel columns, which exposed the steel structures directly to fire. Before 9/11, inspections were conducted on the WTC towers and photos had shown that fire protection on the steel structures were seriously lacking in many areas. Let's do a review.

FIREPROOFING" AT THE WTC TOWERS

APPLICATION DEFICIENCIES

Fireproofing was applied directly to the long joists that supported each of the floors. Inspections of the floors with asbestos-containing fireproofing (up to the 38th floor in the North Tower) found that there were numerous areas where the fireproofing had never been applied. Top and bottom chords and truss web members were exposed, and the red lead on the trusses was clearly visible in many locations. Photo 1 shows a truss with fireproofing missing from its end where it meets the outside wall. Also, the fireproofing was frequently thinner than the 3/4 inch described in the Federal Emergency Management Agency-funded ASCE BPAT report on the collapse of the towers. Many of the problems observed were clearly the result of poor workmanship.

However, the nature of the structures that were fireproofed and application methods used could also contribute to the problem. Applying fireproofing to a long-span or any type of joist construction is difficult. The round rods and small angles making up a truss are difficult targets for the installer. Spray fireproofing materials are typically applied from the floor with an extended spray nozzle. The installer may be unable to reach or see certain areas of the trusses that must be covered. This frequently results in thin or absent fireproofing on surfaces hidden from the floor by the bottom of steel members (photo 2). In the WTC, this resulted in sections of the top surface of the bottom chord of the trusses receiving an inadequate coat of fireproofing. These are deficiencies that would have been easily discovered by the ASTM field quality assurance tests for adhesion, cohesion, thickness, and density had these test methods existed at the time of construction.

LACK OF QUALITY ASSURANCE TESTING

The WTC was built before there were accepted standards for determining if the fireproofing as applied in the field would perform properly. Would the material remain on the steel (adhesion), resist physical damage (cohesion), insulate properly (thickness and density), and behave as a fire retardant? Architects relied on the "testing" undertaken by Underwriters Laboratories. However, without field quality assurance tests, there was no way of knowing if the properties of the applied fireproofing matched those of the material subjected to the UL test. The previously discussed tests would not become available until years after the completion of the WTC. For example, the ASTM test for adhesion would have detected the bonding defects of the fireproofing on core columns. This test and the ASTM test for thickness and density would have determined the adequacy of the spray fireproofing on the floor joists.

The WTC should not be considered unique in this regard. The fireproofing in any building constructed before the ASTM standards became available in 1977 should be considered suspect.

Photos

images.pennnet.com...

images.pennnet.com...

ACCUMULATED DAMAGE TO FIREPROOFING

There is another important aspect to this issue. There is no existing requirement in any building or occupancy code to inspect the fireproofing in a building periodically to determine if it has degraded through gradual physical damage. This is even true for new construction where the fireproofing is installed and tested early in the construction process. Successive work by many trades often damages and removes whole sections of fireproofing. In the WTC, the fireproofing coatings had been damaged by later construction and renovation in many locations.

LESSONS LEARNED

In considering the possible causes of the collapse of the WTC towers, the possibility that the initial application of fire-resistive coatings was deficient must be considered. The implications of this are far ranging. The fire safety of buildings depends on the fire-resistance ratings' successfully resulting in buildings that stay standing despite fire damage. Prior to the collapse of the WTC towers, it was thought that adherence to the fire-resistance ratings in the building codes would result in buildings that were safe for occupants and for those who fight fires. However, the entire scheme currently used to make these determinations must be called into question. If the WTC towers were properly protected but fell anyway, then this would indicate that the fire-resistance ratings and structural reliability of buildings as they are now built are insufficiently protective. However, if the buildings failed because the fireproofing was improperly applied, then the standards for fireproofing application and maintenance need to be strengthened. Peoples' lives depend on properly analyzing these issues and then taking appropriate corrective action.

Deficient firestopping

Deficient firestopping provides an avenue for fire spread. Columns, girders and beams are commonly protected with spray asbestos insulation or a composition material. Spray insulation has been tested to offer four-hour test ratings on columns, three hours on beams and girders.

Test conditions, however, do not match actual conditions in the field. Insulation adhesion may be ineffective because of rust. Frequently, insulation is applied to rusted metal that has not been properly treated before application; the insulation's consistency may vary; its application may be inconsistent; or it may be dislodged during original and new construction and maintenance.

www.fireengineering.com... -the-wtc-towers.html

a reply to: ForteanOrg

Nothing changed, no new plane flew into the building, the trusses weren't broken - the fires were actually mostly out.

The fires were not out. Check out this video and you will see the corner of WTC 2 buckle just before it collapsed.

www.youtube.com...

a reply to: jaffo

Ah, despair strikes

No, I'm not derailing this thread at all. I merely responded to another members questions. I provided a story - like you provide a story - to explain what happened that day. Like your story, mine fits the facts. Like your story, mine is true - of course it is.

Alien Ray. Told ya.

originally posted by: skyeagle409
a reply to: ForteanOrg

Nothing changed, no new plane flew into the building, the trusses weren't broken - the fires were actually mostly out.

The fires were not out. Check out this video and you will see the corner of WTC 2 buckle just before it collapsed.

Again, thanks for your continuous serious attempts to add substance to the discussion

Yes, I see the corner of the building sway as the ray is switched on. Note the HUGE clouds of dust that emerge. Also check how the materials simply fall down as if nothing withheld them - as if there weren't 80+ floors with solid beams in their core to stop them. Note how the upper section of the building is totally invisible behind a cloud of dust. But what you CAN see is actually quite disturbing: we see the top of the tower (this was the South tower) topple and sway to the outside. But then it simply falls down, free fall speed.

Alien Ray. Told ya.

originally posted by: skyeagle409

Could it be that dust plumes and debris, which are falling at free-fall speed, are outpacing the collapse of that WTC building, which is an indicator that the WTC building is not collapsing at free-fall speed at all?

Could it be that said plumes and debris, which were slung away over a great distance as the collapse started, actually prove to be an excellent indicator for a controlled demolition?

Yes indeed.

The little parts seem to be expelled further away (due to their weight), which prolongs their way down. Then Aerodynamics and Gravity played their part in the play, nothing unusual with this outpacing. Except maybe with regards to the distance, over which the debris initially got slung away.

Whatever, hope that explanation clears this up for you. But except from that, your photo can't tell us anything about the free fall.

a reply to: ForteanOrg

es, I see the corner of the building sway as the ray is switched on. Note the HUGE clouds of dust that emerge. Also check how the materials simply fall down as if nothing withheld them - as if there weren't 80+ floors with solid beams in their core to stop them. Note how the upper section of the building is totally invisible behind a cloud of dust.

Each floor is supported by steel supports, and each floor have its own weigh limitations. Check it out.

WTC Floor Supports

debunking911.com...

debunking911.com...

Now, let's take another look at the WTC buildings and understand that the WTC buildings are not solid objects and that their interiors are mostly air.

WTC Towers See Through Perspective

algoxy.com...

But what you CAN see is actually quite disturbing: we see the top of the tower (this was the South tower) topple and sway to the outside. But then it simply falls down, free fall speed.

It would have been impossible for the top of WTC 2 to topple over because there was no support beneath the hinge point. You might want to also review this video.

Video

www.youtube.com...=125

a reply to: Shadow Herder

This is what it takes to demolish a steel frame building with explosives. It is a very noisy and dusty process that generates tons of waste material and is a process that takes many months of hard work around the clock to complete.

9/11 Brent Blanchard outlines the requirements Controlled Demolition of Steel Frame Building.

Video

www.youtube.com...

How Building Implosions Work

The first step in preparation, which often begins before the blasters have actually surveyed the site, is to clear any debris out of the building. Next, construction crews, or, more accurately, destruction crews, begin taking out non-load-bearing walls within the building. This makes for a cleaner break at each floor: If these walls were left intact, they would stiffen the building, hindering its collapse. Destruction crews may also weaken the supporting columns with sledge hammers or steel-cutters, so that they give way more easily. Next, blasters can start loading the columns with explosives.

Demolishing steel columns is a bit more difficult, as the dense material is much stronger. For buildings with a steel support structure, blasters typically use the specialized explosive material cyclotrimethylenetrinitramine, called RDX for short. RDX-based explosive compounds expand at a very high rate of speed, up to 27,000 feet per second (8,230 meters per second). Instead of disintegrating the entire column, the concentrated, high-velocity pressure slices right through the steel, splitting it in half. Additionally, blasters may ignite dynamite on one side of the column to push it over in a particular direction.

science.howst...g-implosion.htm...

In other words, it would have been impossible to rig the WTC buildings with explosives for demolition and not attract a lot of attention.

Obviously it was a controlled demolition. I don't buy the angle that the government recruited different airplanes than the ones hijacked to kamikaze the buildings. Everything leaves a paper trail. Those four planes could not disappear with any kind of ease without leaving a huge trail that could be investigated very easily.

a reply to: Illumina233

I don't buy the angle that the government recruited different airplanes than the ones hijacked to kamikaze the buildings. Everything leaves a paper trail. Those four planes could not disappear with any kind of ease without leaving a huge trail that could be investigated very easily.

We can take a look here.

American Airlines, B-757-223, N644AA, (American 77)

Reserved N-Number "Mode S Code" - 52072030
was reserved on 9/15/2006
by Greenway, Jonathan James
PO Box 714
Frederick, Maryland

Deregistered Aircraft
Serial Number 24602
Mfgr - BOEING
MODEL 757-223
Year Manufactured 1991
Reason for Cancellation - Destroyed
Type Registration - Corporation
Certificate Issue Date 05/08/91
Mode S Code 52072030
Cancel Date 01/14/2002

Aircraft registration prior to Deregistration
Wilmington Trust Company Trustee
Rodney Sq North Attn Corp TRT ADM.
Wilmington, Delaware

Airworthyness
Engine Manufacturer ROLLS-ROYC
Engine Model RB.211 Series
Classification Standard
Category Transport
A/W Date 05/08/1991

registry.faa.gov...