The Civil War Was About Slavery, Seriously

As a lurker on the internet, I see many things. In the wake of the act of domestic terrorism in Charleston perpetrated by a racist extremist, which claimed nine innocent black lives, there has been much discussion about the Confederate Flag and whether or not we should get rid of it as a society. Many argue that it is a piece of history. Others argue that it is a symbol of enduring racism in the South. And with that argument comes a second one: what was the Civil War really about?

The obvious, and correct, answer is: It Was About Slavery, Are You Serious? But there are those who claim that the continuation of slavery as an institution was not the primary reason the Southern states seceded from the Union and began the Civil War. Amongst the "real" reasons, states rights sits at the top of the heap of justifications for a war about whether or not actual human beings were property or not.

To begin, I will provide quotes from the declarations of causes of a few Confederate states.

Georgia:

For the last ten years we have had numerous and serious causes of complaint against our non-slave-holding confederate States with reference to the subject of African slavery.

That is literally the second sentence in Georgia's declaration of causes for secession.

Mississippi:

Our position is thoroughly identified with the institution of slavery-- the greatest material interest of the world.

The second sentence in the declaration and first sentence of the second paragraph. Not kidding.

South Carolina:

South Carolina's declaration takes a little more delving. However, it should be clear from the first paragraph that the specific states' right in question is the right of white men to hold slaves and retrieve those slaves if they escaped to a free state. The following two paragraphs drive that point home:

The Constitution of the United States, in its fourth Article, provides as follows: "No person held to service or labor in one State, under the laws thereof, escaping into another, shall, in consequence of any law or regulation therein, be discharged from such service or labor, but shall be delivered up, on claim of the party to whom such service or labor may be due." 
This stipulation was so material to the compact, that without it that compact would not have been made. The greater number of the contracting parties held slaves, and they had previously evinced their estimate of the value of such a stipulation by making it a condition in the Ordinance for the government of the territory ceded by Virginia, which now composes the States north of the Ohio River.

Texas:

Texas abandoned her separate national existence and consented to become one of the Confederated Union to promote her welfare, insure domestic tranquility and secure more substantially the blessings of peace and liberty to her people. She was received into the confederacy with her own constitution, under the guarantee of the federal constitution and the compact of annexation, that she should enjoy these blessings. She was received as a commonwealth holding, maintaining and protecting the institution known as negro slavery-- the servitude of the African to the white race within her limits-- a relation that had existed from the first settlement of her wilderness by the white race, and which her people intended should exist in all future time.

Taken from: www.civilwar.org...

For those with the desire, there are thousands of letters by Confederate leaders to be read online, free, which further confirm slavery as the primary reason for the Civil War. 

And, one final piece of information: in 1863, the governor of North Carolina, Zebulon Baird Vance, wrote a fine letter to Jefferson Davis, regarding the trampling of states' rights in the Confederacy.

The content of the letter can be found here: history.ncsu.edu... .

Wikipedia has this to say on it:

In September 1862, Vance won the gubernatorial election. In the Confederacy Vance was a major proponent of individual rights and local self-government, often putting him at odds with the Confederate government ofJefferson Davis. For example, North Carolina was the only state to observe the right of habeas corpus and keep its courts fully functional during the war.

Obviously, there are tons of other sources, because it took me less than an hour to source and write this brief post. There was once a time when I believed the states rights lie. Then I actually read about it.

Just trying to be helpful.

ETA: Here's a Washington Post article from 2011: www.washingtonpost.com...

a reply to: Phototropic

Very true... To claim otherwise is an attempt at rewriting history.

"There are none so blind as those who will not see. The most deluded people are those who choose to ignore what they already know." ~John Heywood

You are correct.

Another one is the "Heritage not Hate" debate. That's hogwash too. The flag is an absolute symbol of hate and racism.

originally posted by: SgtHamsandwich
The flag is an absolute symbol of hate and racism.

I would say that, like beauty, that's in the eye of the beholder. Some people genuinely see that symbol as a positive thing, while others see it very negatively. For that and other reasons, it should be available to those who want to display it, but not flown on a building where government bodies are at work making laws.

All those black people in the governmen and the court rule that they are subhuman... That's why they secretly dont even view black people as their equaland never will and black people in their government right there smiling in their face. I dont understand why the people with the jucie of my black people just dont separate themselves from america. Its like what the heck??? That's crazy... Soon black people will be FORCED to separate from america, at that stage they are gonna flee from america...

It's my belief that if you want to fly the Confederate flag, you may do so at will. You can also join the KKK, or write racist things on your local news station's Facebook page. However, I also believe that it should be no shock when you get shunned for making those choices.

That's what freedom is. Making a choice, and living with the fallout.

And the Vietnam war was "to stop the spread of Communism".

Let me ask you this, regarding The Civil War:
If it was about slavery, why was Europe (translation: European banks )so interested?

One of the most important aspects of a HSS is the illusion of freedom and choice.

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: SgtHamsandwich
The flag is an absolute symbol of hate and racism.

I would say that, like beauty, that's in the eye of the beholder. Some people genuinely see that symbol as a positive thing, while others see it very negatively. For that and other reasons, it should be available to those who want to display it, but not flown on a building where government bodies are at work making laws.

I won't post it again, but feel free to check out my post over on Ghost147's thread about the flag.

I hail from Alabama and know exactly what the flag represents. I also agree it should not be a stripped right of the individuals that wish to fly it. Being white, that's easy for me to say. I cant speak for the folks on the other side of the debate.

a reply to: Phototropic

Our history books were scrubbed of an entire kingdom. The "Golden age of Islam" just happens to coincide with the "dark ages" of Europe.

But the entire history of Islam is ignored in our schools. All we read is the Catholic version of European History, minus all the details that make them look like murderous tyrants.

From our history books you would think that white Greeks, Europeans and Jews were the only intelligent people to ever walk the earth. And that men of color merely followed along in ignorance.

If people knew the real history of Islam it would be hard for a white man to feel superior.

en.m.wikipedia.org...

The war was about white supremacy, and the white man's right to enslave all men of color.

People around here love to romanticize the Confederacy because they stood up to the bad evil U.S. Government, and it goes well along with their irrational and pathological fear and mistrust of the Government.

But what these people don't realize is that the Confederate Government was much more oppressive towards it's citizens than the Union ever was.

a reply to: ColeYounger

Why are banks ever interested in the outcomes of war?

YES...The civil war was fought over slavery. Many of my ancestors died fighting to end slavery.

Point of Education:
Watch this very short and informative youtube video detailing the actual history of the actual confederate flag.

NOT the Confederate Flag:
www.youtube.com...

The Confederate flag isn't what you think it is, according to actual facts

Oddly enough, history can be a little tricky when it comes to actual facts.

YouTuber CGP Grey explains the history of the controversial flag and its misattributed past. As it turns out, the age-old banner of the South during the American Civil War was never actually an official flag of the Confederacy.

So maybe all this debate is a moot point considering it is widely considered to be a modern-day symbol of racism.

The more you know.

mashable.com...

a reply to: Isurrender73

That is a subject for a whole different thread. I didn't learn about the Golden Age of Islam until 8th grade Algebra. Algebra! Not history. I learned about the British conquest of India in English Lit, and I learned about the trail of tears at a public flippin' library. I love it when people complain about "WELL WHEN IS WHITE HISTORY MONTH?" and I'm like "lol all of them". I'll be polite and say that history as taught in school in is skewed.

a reply to: ColeYounger

If it was about slavery, why was Europe (translation: European banks )so interested?

Because like in every war there was money to be made.

originally posted by: Phototropic
a reply to: ColeYounger

Why are banks ever interested in the outcomes of war?

Money and power.

Not peoples' rights or freedoms.
Not "democracy".
Not morality.
Not slavery.

originally posted by: SgtHamsandwich

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: SgtHamsandwich
The flag is an absolute symbol of hate and racism.

I would say that, like beauty, that's in the eye of the beholder. Some people genuinely see that symbol as a positive thing, while others see it very negatively. For that and other reasons, it should be available to those who want to display it, but not flown on a building where government bodies are at work making laws.

I won't post it again, but feel free to check out my post over on Ghost147's thread about the flag.

I hail from Alabama and know exactly what the flag represents. I also agree it should not be a stripped right of the individuals that wish to fly it. Being white, that's easy for me to say. I cant speak for the folks on the other side of the debate.

It has been posted many times if you want to fly the flag then you have that right but it's doesn't belong on any government building.

a reply to: ColeYounger

You do realise at that time one of the biggest economic powerhouses was Slavery, right?

originally posted by: buster2010
a reply to: ColeYounger

If it was about slavery, why was Europe (translation: European banks )so interested?

Because like in every war there was money to be made.

Which is precisely why it wasn't as much about slavery as the OP might think.
Read a detailed history of the Fort Sumter attack.

It sure was.

And think of all the thousands of brave white citizens that gave their lives fighting to gain freedom for their black brothers and sisters.

Brave men.