The Koch brothers and the Republican Party go to war — with each other

originally posted by: amazing
How can any conservative like the Koch Brothers or any big corporations that value profits over people?

It's always mystified me that conservative people...The sterotypical conservative cowboy, metal worker, farmer, chevy/ford commercial type people with family values, hard workers, simple country people can get behind a big corporation like this? Also how a conservative...a stereotypical, tough as nails guy could listen to a whiner like Sean Hannity or someone who's never worked a day in his life and is ultra smug, like Bill O'Reilly.

It's because they solicited appeal to their religious tendancies and fears, morso than human morality/ethics. And you've got to admit, religion hasn't necessarily been synonymous with morality/ethics across the board.

They've also twisted libertarianism into "total corporate amnesty". Resulting in corporations being above the law, and free to inject corruption into the democratic system. Of course multinationals want you to believe in less restriction on certain liberties. It's because they can afford to pay from their own laws and protections through lobbying. Which ultimately results in less freedom because in order to obfuscate their sleight, enacting harsh legislation like what we've currently been labored with, ranging from censorship of speech and sharing of information via internet, to language used for classifying persons, or Orwellian collection of every atom that encapsulates a citizen.

The RNC is now openly arguing, however, that the Kochs’ political operation is trying to control the Republican Party’s master voter file, and to gain influence over — some even say control of — the GOP.

Gasp!

The horror!

“I think it’s very dangerous and wrong to allow a group of very strong, well-financed individuals who have no accountability to anyone to have control over who gets access to the data when, why and how,” said Katie Walsh, the RNC’s chief of staff.

LOL.

Good doom porn. Worthy of American Politics.

Oh my god them evil Kochs!

Two lone guys controlling the GOP!!!!

And their critics eat it up like 'Hope, and Change'.

When you don't keep those backdoor bonuses flowing, people feel the urge to talk about things...

Look at history, always blows my mind that people with underhanded agendas always think they are smarter than the guys before them, and their scheme will stay afloat.

You treat people like crap, pee on them and say it's raining and then stop providing this and that as promised, you're going to loose your fanboys and girls.

Silly rabbit, trix are for kids.

a reply to: neo96

Nice commentary and opinion neo - if only it weren't for the fact that, well, facts.

originally posted by: Hefficide
a reply to: neo96

Nice commentary and opinion neo - if only it weren't for the fact that, well, facts.

Facts eh ?

Ok why is it the only billionaires that ever get mentioned buying elections, and policy just happen to be 2 named Koch, and Republican.

The flip side of that coin never seems to get mention. Like Soros,Gates,Buffet,Zuckerberg.

Dunno why but I expected more from Yahoo. Chalk that up to just another media source loosely using the term 'news'.

We can talk 'facts' like every election cycle it's the same thing.

Kochs, and Republicans 'at war'.

a reply to: neo96

My OP doesn't say that there are only two. Neither does the article the OP is based upon. What the OP does say is that the RNC is actually outting the issue - openly and publicly. Not Huffpo. Not a liberally bias media portal. Not a blog. The freaking RNC.

Seems relevant to me.

a reply to: Hefficide

Yeah well it's pretty hard to take the source seriously when YAHOO itself is just as guilty as them evil Kochs.

www.opensecrets.org...

The only difference is they are playing both ends against the middle.

The national mainstream GOP has some axes to grind with the Koch's it seems.

One in particular is probably considered ironic.

Efforts against the PATRIOT Act

The Koch brothers each made $10 million grants to the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) to fight the Bush administration over the PATRIOT Act.[67][68] According to Reason magazine that $20 million is "substantially more than the Kochs have contributed to all political candidates combined for at least the last 15 years."

Political activities of the Koch brothers

and some more irony....

Koch Industries Inc., which spent $1.2 million in 2010 to help elect governors who oppose collective bargaining for public employees, won praise from a labor union official for backing the rights of factory workers.

Koch’s Georgia Pacific unit “has positive collective bargaining relationships with its unions,” Jon Geenen, international vice president of the United Steelworkers union, wrote in a blog post on the group’s website.

“The company’s workforce is highly unionized,” Geenen wrote. “It is not inaccurate to say these are among the best-paid manufacturing jobs in America.”

Koch Industries Wins Labor Praise for Collective Bargaining Role

a reply to: neo96

The story is being carried by way more than Yahoo. Is the Washington Post a left wing rag or questionable source for you?

That is actually something of a redundant question as you've not really given me anything to debate neo. You aren't arguing the facts - so far you've only mocked the story in general and then attacked the source. Funny, I never figured you for a fan of the Koch brothers.

a reply to: Hefficide

All politics deserves to be mocked.

Every cycle we are put forward a false choice to choose 'coke' over 'pepsi'.

Truth is neither one is 'good' for us.

Supposedly 'Republicans and the kochs' are fighting each other.

The GOP is bad.

The Koch's are bad.

Ad infinitum.

Ain't people happy they are supposedly at each other throats?

Especially when their critics don't like either one.

It would be nice to the GOP go back to being the party of Reagan in fact instead of just name. No secret Reagan would be called a RINO now most likely be in the DNC. Hell I was Republican before the party lost its damn mind. I went indie and that is where I stay. Screw the parties. However it would be nice to a GOP that was capable of doing something besides blocking everything. You know back when the parties would talk and come to a compromise. The left and the right ending up with an answer in the middle where most Americans are at.

Indy as well. At one time I was a registered libertarian as that was as close to small, non existent governemnt except for the basics that you could go.

I do lean left a lot but anytime I feel like a democrat, I see Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi and raising taxes and I run away...then I'm like....I like guns and small government and America and apple pie but...then I ran far away from the insanity of the republican party too.

I'll never understand when there's a problem. The KOCHs are a big problem. That instead of taking care of that it instantly goes to mocking and deriding the "other side".

take Neo for instance. Why can't he admit the Kochs are a problem and why can't we all get together to take them down and them move on to Soros ...together.

No sense.

originally posted by: neo96

The GOP is bad.

The Koch's are bad.

Yup. Bang on neo. For once I agree with you politically.

Thing is, I think the Dems are just as bad once elected. Citizens United did that for America.

originally posted by: SubTruth
a reply to: Hefficide

This is just the tip of the real truth.........Conservatives are split 50/50 by my estimation with many seeing the cold hard truth. Ron Paul really did change things and until the Republican party gets rid of progressive masters they will never win a presidential election again.



The people are waking up...........Conservative minded people will not follow progressive masters.

Problem is, the hierarchy / establishment Progressive Republicans are the ones in positions of power (McConnell, Boehner, McCain, Lindsey Graham, Bush, Romney, etc.)

I think it’s very dangerous and wrong to allow a group of very strong, well-financed individuals who have no accountability to anyone to have control

He's right, too bad he doesn't realize he just condemned everyone he supports and everything he believes in.

a reply to: neo96

Ok why is it the only billionaires that ever get mentioned buying elections, and policy just happen to be 2 named Koch, and Republican.

Because billionaires are the only ones that are able to spend hundred of millions of dollars trying to buy elections.

The flip side of that coin never seems to get mention. Like Soros,Gates,Buffet,Zuckerberg.

Read the thread before posting.

Dunno why but I expected more from Yahoo. Chalk that up to just another media source loosely using the term 'news'.

Like FOX huh?

We can talk 'facts' like every election cycle it's the same thing.

Not this time this is new because before this the RNC could have told you what the Kochs bros (pbut) shoe polish tastes like.

Kochs, and Republicans 'at war'.

With the pansies we have in government getting mad is about the same as going to war.

a reply to: Hefficide

ad hominem. What policies do the Koch brothers promote that are harmful?

Less whining, more facts. Get your cards on the table... have a small pocket pair?

a reply to: wayforward

"Small pocket pair"... Poker term, cheap shot or both? I'm not a gambler so I am honestly curious.

As for whining? Not my style. If it reads as such, then it's your interpretation and not the intended tone.

As for the Koch brothers and what they've done wrong? The article pretty well explains it without me having to spell it out. But since that seems to have been missed, I'll go ahead and do so. They are circumventing our Republic and the very basis of our laws through legalized bribery - legalized bribery that I firmly believe will one day be outted as having been paid for by people like the Koch brothers. They say everyone has a price - I'm guessing that includes those sitting on the US Supreme Court as well. Time will tell.

To make it more simple - my Senator is supposed to go to Washington and argue for MY region. He is supposed to be there to represent me, my neighbors, and our common interests. But thanks to the Koch's and the Soros' of this world - that is no longer happening. Because of Citizens United and the untraceable and unlimited money that SuperPACs can donate to politicians, combined with an almost utterly unrestricted lobby my Senator is no longer doing his job - he is too busy being paid by special interests to vote in their best interest to give two shakes about what he was sent to Washington to do or the people who gave him that privilege.

If you don't see the inherent wrong in that? Then I suppose you and I have different ideas about what Government is supposed to do. It's "of the people, by the people, for the people"... not "Of the people, by a few of the people, for even fewer of the people".

ETA: As far as "ad hominem" goes - you might want to look up the meaning. Discussing the fact that the RNC is warning about the Koch brothers - their primary benefactors ( which is what is happening ) is not resorting to attacking character. It's reporting real events and providing a venue for opinion.

a reply to: Hefficide

It was pretty obvious this was going to happen at some point. I won't forget when earlier this year McConnell closed the Senate while they were in the middle of passing a bunch of bills through with no opposition, because almost every single member had to go meet with the Koch's and they couldn't be late.

Whatever you think of politicians most of them are at least committed to our system of government, and when it gets to the point that the Senate is closing so they can hold private policy setting meetings with their financiers there is a major problem going on.

I would also bet good money that behind closed doors each and every one of them are pretty uncomfortable with the levels of money they're throwing around. It's one thing for candidates to get billions of dollars from a group of people with varied interests. It's quite another for it to be coming from a single person, because that single person becomes the de facto head of your party.

originally posted by: Southern Guardian
This is the most important question out of all this in my opinion. I find it interesting that the Kochs had solid support within the party until recently? And of all times, during election season when they need the Kochs financial support the most. Something put some in the RNC off.... something big.

What if one was demanding the VP slot and the other Secretary of State?