Can you link a harmful effect of government spying?

First off, I am against spying on citizens, I don't believe it's been helpful and it's just infringing on our rights, I am against it.

That being said, does anyone have any news, articles, links, etc - from any source, mainstream or alternative - showing the negative effects of said spying? I've never looked into it myself but I'm sure there must be something.

How about the virtually endless list of people that now have to think about everything they say, and who they say it to, simply because they are aware that the government is listening in. Feels like a pretty harmful effect to me.

Easy Peasy

www.faqs.org...

Gestapo agents were charged with rooting out foreign agents and resistance fighters, but they also expanded their role as an internal police force. Gestapo agents and informants concentrated on finding suspected political dissidents of the Third Reich. Spying on citizens became pervasive, and the Gestapo encouraged people to turn in "suspect persons" to local authorities. While victims of the Gestapo were subject to both civil and criminal prosecution, the secret police themselves operated above the law. On February 10, 1936, the Nazi government officially decreed that the organization was not subject to judicial review. There were no legal restraints on detention of suspects, evidence collection, or police violence. This lack of legal restraint, paired with the Gestapo's tendency to attract and employ Nazi extremists and former criminals in its ranks, permitted the brutality for which the force became infamous.

a reply to: deadlyhope

I actually think you have a point... I think however it could go south in a minute with a crappy administration.


That whole absolute power thing.

a reply to: VictorVonDoom

Learning from the past type of thing, sure. I meant a literal - as in unlawful arrests, etc - - and modern impact. As I say, I'm against it and believe your source is the eventuality, I just wonder if anyone has any links that show a current impact.

a reply to: deadlyhope

It infringes on our rights.

Why do you need links and stories when you already know it's an infringement? I mean you obviously do know it, that's not my point. I just don't see the need for anecdotal stories to support that statement....?

a reply to: Legman

I don't have a point! I believe only evil governments would spy on all their citizens, though. No good men in DC, nope.

originally posted by: deadlyhope
a reply to: Legman

I don't have a point! I believe only evil governments would spy on all their citizens, though. No good men in DC, nope.

Buddy if I could just tell you what we do to other countries.

Use your imagination and expand it by 100000 times... we do it.


I lived in mexico and south america and would call my old coworkers asking them where I should NOT be that particular day.

a reply to: Shamrock6

I'm thinking of some arguments for a debate I have, but have none, other than infringement of rights. It's a big one, but counterterrorism efforts is also big. How do I debate this for the side of the people? Examples work best.

Examples where the government over stepped and illegally arrested people, for instance. Or used information against a person in smaller crimes, or manipulated information they supposedly overheard.

The Fourth Amendment (Amendment IV) to the United States Constitution is the part of the Bill of Rights that prohibits unreasonable searches and seizures and requires any warrant to be judicially sanctioned and supported by probable cause.

It is harmful when we allow warrant-less searches and ignore the Constitution of the United States. I am not sure there can be a more harmful consequence than allowing Government to ignore our founding document.

originally posted by: deadlyhope
First off, I am against spying on citizens, I don't believe it's been helpful and it's just infringing on our rights, I am against it.

That being said, does anyone have any news, articles, links, etc - from any source, mainstream or alternative - showing the negative effects of said spying? I've never looked into it myself but I'm sure there must be something.

WE KNOW from historic cases in other countries, including Stalinist Russia and communist East Germany.. There have been police and surveillance abuses across history, with those used as instruments of power not justice.

a reply to: Metallicus

I'm just looking for an example of this happening. I already know how bad it is and how much it's against our rights.

a reply to: deadlyhope

NSA=NoseySpyingAsholes

originally posted by: deadlyhope
a reply to: Shamrock6

I'm thinking of some arguments for a debate I have, but have none, other than infringement of rights. It's a big one, but counterterrorism efforts is also big. How do I debate this for the side of the people? Examples work best.

Examples where the government over stepped and illegally arrested people, for instance. Or used information against a person in smaller crimes, or manipulated information they supposedly overheard.

Aren't there examples already of some NSA using the tech to spy on opponents or ex-girlfriends? That's already an abuse and illegal I believe.

The CIA was caught spying on Congress.

The biggest issue is that such spying is a profoundly slipper slope, that can lead to greater abuses, as it has in many other countries.

The real fundamental issue here is that the NSA consider themselves above the law.

Clearly, the highest law in the land has been swept aside. They take no notice of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights.

This is Government anarchy at its worst. Because they get away with it, so do other agencies and we see these effects on a daily basis. Police shooting unarmed children. Police shooting unarmed civilians. No knock raids. Pets slaughtered. The list is endless and it is getting worse.

You need to look no further that the Government, supported by the Courts, becoming Anarchists.

There is one law for all. Not one for the plebs and none for them.

The fact that they collect this mountain of data means little. They cannot use it to stop anything from happening. But, they get your name, for any reason, and they can dig through your history and find damaging writings even if you were just joking around.

That they break the law is more than sufficient and where it leads is very easy to see as others have pointed out. This is the way of the Nazis, the KGB and the FBI. Just look at what the FBI did in the name of taking out communists.

P

Bad enough the US gov. spys on us, the worst part is trying to get us to spy on each other.

signs signs, everywhere the signs...

a reply to: deadlyhope

These 4 links below are websites of the most harmful entities in the history of the human race - even before spying BECAME PUBLIC KNOWLEDGE. Spies, murderers, thugs and kings of entrapment - and lords of war and death.

www.fbi.gov...

www.nsa.gov...

www.cia.gov...

www.dhs.gov...

Check out the intercept . Com. Glen greenwald has a lot to say about how it impacts us as a nation, and you as a person.

Government blackmail and selling of secrets..

a reply to: deadlyhope

Read the book 1984 by George Orwell or watch the movie based on it if you haven't already. It's a blueprint on government spying.