Muhammad's New Hobby: Girlfriend Burning

But the sins of Lucifer don't affect the free will of "man" and the original sin of man do they? Take your entire dogma spouting. You have contradicted yourself time and time again just to "prove" you are right. Hard to figure out what you do believe, except Number 10 of Fred's little chart. Get your facts straight and them come at it again, from a rational position.

regs out...

I realize that you may be gettin swamped heer and typing so much dogma is hard, but you mentioned bible age yet the bible seems to support evolution

Genesis 1:24 And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so.

Hmmmm Let the earth bring forth...... Could the bible be agree with Darwin? I think so!

and Im confused which came first, the chicken or the egg? Or Humans and animals????

Humans created after animals
Genesis 1:25-27 "And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and the cattle after their kind ... And God said, Let us make man ... So God created man in his own image."

Or Humans created before:

Genesis 2:18-19"And the Lord God said it is not good that man should be alone; I will make a help-meet for him. And out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air, and brought them to Adam to see what he would call them."

Well which is it?????


And yeah it seems to support multiple gods to boot

1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

"our" image? implies more than one god no? that would explain why it only took 6 days no?

[edit on 12/27/04 by FredT]

Originally posted by regs
But the sins of Lucifer don't affect the free will of "man" and the original sin of man do they? Take your entire dogma spouting. You have contradicted yourself time and time again just to "prove" you are right. Hard to figure out what you do believe, except Number 10 of Fred's little chart. Get your facts straight and them come at it again, from a rational position.

regs out...

I don't care if anyone thinks I am right. The question was "original sin". Yes, man has free will. Man often chooses the wrong path. Sorry if I struck a nerve there regs. I believe in GOD and CHRIST. My "facts" are "straight" you chose not to listen. Your choice - God bless you anyway.

The original "sin" of Lucifer is what got man here in the first place. Without his arrogance there would not have been anyone to "tempt" eve.

Sin is the rejection of Gods Law.

FredT it does no good showing errors in the bible. Its only supports the mystical look that God has. He had the writers do it so the code could be added or something.

Originally posted by DrHoracid
Sin is the rejection of Gods Law.

But are we still being punished by the sins of our fathers?

Originally posted by FredT

Originally posted by DrHoracid
Sin is the rejection of Gods Law.

But are we still being punished by the sins of our fathers?

We are all and will be each punished for our own sins. But there are some sins passed down. Perhaps genetically?

Originally posted by DrHoracid
But there are some sins passed down. Perhaps genetically?

Hmm thats not what the bible says now is it:

Deuteronomy 24:16, �children shall not be punished for the sins of their fathers.�


Hmmm

But God gave man the choice to accept or reject him, therein lies the "problem". Orriginal sin did not come forth through Lucifer, but the choice God planted in each and every one of us.

regs out...

Originally posted by FredT

Originally posted by DrHoracid
But there are some sins passed down. Perhaps genetically?

Hmm thats not what the bible says now is it:

Deuteronomy 24:16, �children shall not be punished for the sins of their fathers.�


Hmmm

Didn't say "punished" just passed down. Alcoholisim for example.

Originally posted by DrHoracid


Hmmm

Didn't say "punished" just passed down. Alcoholisim for example.

So let me see if i get this right, Alcoholisim Is a passed down punishment from god?

[edit on 27-12-2004 by SpittinCobra]

Originally posted by DrHoracid
Didn't say "punished" just passed down. Alcoholisim for example.

Symantics. Also, you failed to comment on the bibles rvelation that there are multiple gods

Originally posted by FredT

Originally posted by DrHoracid
Didn't say "punished" just passed down. Alcoholisim for example.

Symantics. Also, you failed to comment on the bibles rvelation that there are multiple gods

Are you speaking of the Trinity?

Originally posted by DrHoracid
Are you speaking of the Trinity?

allow me to repost:

Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

"our" image?, "our' likeness? Who is he talking to here? Other gods no doubt, the bible states it quite plainly. This clearly implies more than one god no? that would explain why creation only took 6 days no?

Originally posted by FredT

Originally posted by DrHoracid
Are you speaking of the Trinity?

allow me to repost:

Genesis 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

"our" image?, "our' likeness? Who is he talking to here? Other gods no doubt, the bible states it quite plainly. This clearly implies more than one god no? that would explain why creation only took 6 days no?

Our Image refers to the rest of Gods creations. Image does no equal substance. Look at Clinton

The original text uses the work (yhams)sp? It can mean a day, a year, 10,000 years. But God is God so 6 days is possible.

[edit on 27-12-2004 by DrHoracid]

Originally posted by DrHoracid
I have no data on the true age of the earth. There is no time line for between creation and Adam. From Adam down the timeline is approx 6000 years. Adam was not the first 'man' he was the first in a line to David and then to Christ.

What sect are you from Horacid? Methinks you are backing down, because the bible, right or wrong, has a very explicit timeline for creation which spans 6 days and ends with God being all tuckered out and needing a nap.

I cut the bible more slack than almost any non believer, but pardon my punn, I wouldn't take it for gospel. I don't necessarily think its 100% inspired, accurate, or unchanged- there is ample evidence for the whimsical exclusion and inclusion of certain books and changing of interpretations to fix contradictions. There are still contradictions there too.
Did you know that while Jesus was here on Earth he said the son of man "is in heaven" (son of man being a recently popularized term for the Messiah found in the non-cannonical but widely popular (and dead-sea-scroll included) Book of Enoch.)? How could Jesus be the Messiah then?

Now lets get back to the beginning of this little arguement, where we bicker back and forth about worshipping false gods versus being tollerant. The bible advocates neither. The bible advocates personal pacifism, but is not so clear about tollerating other relgions. There were genocides, Elijah slaughtered priests of other gods right and left. Jesus took a whip and ran everyone out of the temple. I had been under the distinct impression as a young baptist that I was to follow Jesus' example of living righteously in the company of all manner of people, but it turns out that my pastor would go verse for verse pointing out (contradictory!) verses which illustrated that I should have nothing to do with sinners apart from telling them about Jesus. Last but not least, as the list pointed out, Christianity believes most of this planet is going to hell, and it is a rare Christian, even among pastors, who mourns or even dislikes the idea that people will end up in a firey eternal damnation. Why is it like this? Because Judeo-Christian beliefs, true or false, have been used as a tool of control and have been modified to be more effective, especially by banishing all other influences.

Originally posted by DrHoracid

Originally posted by FredT

Originally posted by DrHoracid
Sin is the rejection of Gods Law.

But are we still being punished by the sins of our fathers?

We are all and will be each punished for our own sins. But there are some sins passed down. Perhaps genetically?

then the answer is actually yes. I wish I had my concordance with me right now. God punishes sin to the 3rd and 4th generation (or was it further than that?). If you don't believe me I'll quote it later.

Now come on with this original sin stuff; God made the law. There had to be this one arbitrary thing that he wouldn't let us do, just to fork with us, and once we failed to do that, he put dozens more rules on us.
God planted a landmine in the backyard, told the kids where it was, told the kids what it would do, and then sent them out back to play. Sure the kids shouldn't have stepped on it, but why the heck did he do that? It sounds like something a super-villian would do to kill James Bond's kids!
Why was there a tree of knowledge to begin with when God foresaw what would happen? Why was their a lucifer when God foresaw what would happen? Why does God create people who are predestined to reject him and go to hell?

Something doesn't add up here. If the biblical account were true, I would be very eager to hear Satan's side of the story because God's story alone doesn't make any sense.