ISIS overpowers Iraqi Forces at Baiji refinery - Largest refinery in Iraq....

The Iraqi Government only re-took the refinery in November after IS stormed it and the town last June...

This is a worrying development and the next few days will show whether the Iraqi Forces are able to take and keep territory from IS.

originally posted by: woogleuk
a reply to: Vasa Croe

Would it be possible to cause a large explosion in that place? If they are going to commit suicide, I reckon waiting until ISIS were literally outside and making everything go BOOM! may be a good course of action.

I know that sounds cold, but if they are going to go, they may as well take out as many of those little tosspots that they can.

Captured by ISIS is not an option, that can't be pleasant.

This was my thought as well. If you're going to lose the refinery, rather than give it to ISIS, blow it up. Try to time the explosion to kill as many of them as possible, and kill yourselves in it as well. Of course, to those on the ground there things could look very very different.

If these guys are willing to commit suicide, if I were in the Iraqi government I would even ask the US to send a few missiles into the refinery. Adopt more of a Russian mindset towards this whole situation and practice scorched earth. If Iraq can't have it, no one can.

originally posted by: Vasa Croe
This quote from the story, in particular, is very unsettling to me:

"We have very little food and ammunition, and we can't withstand the suicide bombers, snipers and rockets," said the federal police officer, who was trapped inside the refinery along with about 50 other police as of Thursday evening. "All of us now are thinking of committing suicide."

So 50 of them are considering suicide versus being taken prisoner by ISIS....I can't imagine the terror they must be going through right now....that is not a decision I would ever want to be forced to make.

Many people around the world at any time arrives at the same point in life. Doesn't always have to be facing ISIS but a sense of utter hopelessness.

You wouldn't understand it if most of your life, you have lived in relative ease and comfort compared to the rest of the world where life is not beautiful. There's a lot less people in the world with more freedoms than those who don't. We live in an evil world and the status quo had to change soon.

I haven't seen any more recent updates on this story. Guessing they are still holding out on the south gate, but no reports on the 50 inside that were holed up.

Well, as I typed that last post I found another update as of the 2nd of May....not good.

Source

Speaking from inside the facility, an Iraqi officer who asked not to be named because he was not authorized to talk to a reporter said government troops were running low on food, water and ammunition. He said the situation was chaotic after 11 months of nearly unbroken siege.

He said Islamic State fighters control “all the major buildings,” 80 percent of the watchtowers around the facility, and had flanked government positions with “snipers and suicide bombers driving heavily armored car bombs.”

He appealed for the government in Baghdad to send supplies, ammunition and air cover. “We have been under siege for four days without any major coalition air strike assistance inside the facility,” he said.

So they control all major buildings now. The story says there are only around 150 government troops left inside the facility at this point. I think the first story stated about 250, so it sounds like they have lost another 100 troops since then. Sad.

It appears ISIS is going to take full control of this facility and the adjacent train station, essentially cutting off supply transports and controlling a lot of oil production....not good.

Also just saw a tweet that 4 more killed and 5 wounded by a suicide attack there just now....

Seeing some twitter updates claiming ISIS has taken over the refinery now.....guessing this will hit media reports around Wednesday this week if confirmed.

Likely, if it was taken completely by ISIS, it will be flattened from the sky. I can't imagine anyone there would allow them to keep control of this refinery. If ISIS is all that is there, then there is no reason not to bomb it out of existence. There is plenty of money to rebuild it later and they would get rid of quite a few ISIS members in the process....

What is the over riding factor of losing this oil refinery in the wider picture?.

Also as someone that has only loosely been following the Isis crisis would I be right in saying that they started to attack oil fields in or around March 2015?, that is a mear 4 weeks from the "public" announcement that the UK had discovered a (possible) 300+Billion worth of oil in West Sussex is there any inkling that this could be linked?..

I would also be intrigued to view a possible futures timeline for what the end game could look like or be for Isis as lets be honest they do seem to be working towards a "Plan". At what point will they turn their attention to Israel that would seem to be the obvious choice for a enemy in the region.

From having been there before I'd say ISIS is bad news friends. The culture over there worships strength above all else. I remember having a good chat with an Kuwaiti friend in the middle of Nowhere's Ville talking about the arab mentality. (not the Muslim mentality but the Arab mentality....calm down) He told me, "Arabs come in two kinds. The Arabs in the Valley and the Arabs on the Mountain." So basically Arabs on the mountain have it rough. They are tough hombres and they don't mess around. Arabs in the valley have lots of stuff but they're soft. My buddy told me, "Arabs look up to and romanticize and even fear the Arabs on the mountain. The are the strong. When they are hungry they ride down into the valley and take what they want from the Arabs in the valley." The Arab people look up to that. Even the Arabs in the Valley look up to that. Arab nobles used to send their kids into the desert to live with the Bedouins to toughen them up. Check out Saladin some time. Kind of sums it up a bit.ISIS is part of that whole "Arabs on the Mountain". The more you pound them and they keep going the more respected they are in that part of the world. They could really care less about political correctness, the price of Apple stock today (a least the soldiers), or anything beyond what's in front of their faces, what's in their hearts and what they believe with every fiber in their beings. These guys will cut your head off and put it in your hands because they think you are pretty much an animal that should be slaughtered. Welcome to infidel-dom. From my experience the best way to deal with them is not to bomb them into the stone age. That only strengthens them and more specifically their perception of strength by others and their ideology. You defeat them by folding them in on each other. Get a powerful one to roll for money or power or whatever. Once he rolls with his guys let the ones who didn't roll that way know. They eat each other and the ones that are left over go home and go back to hating each other. Problem solved. Until the next Arab comes riding down from the mountain anyway.

originally posted by: termi
From having been there before I'd say ISIS is bad news friends. The culture over there worships strength above all else. I remember having a good chat with an Kuwaiti friend in the middle of Nowhere's Ville talking about the arab mentality. (not the Muslim mentality but the Arab mentality....calm down) He told me, "Arabs come in two kinds. The Arabs in the Valley and the Arabs on the Mountain." So basically Arabs on the mountain have it rough. They are tough hombres and they don't mess around. Arabs in the valley have lots of stuff but they're soft. My buddy told me, "Arabs look up to and romanticize and even fear the Arabs on the mountain. The are the strong. When they are hungry they ride down into the valley and take what they want from the Arabs in the valley." The Arab people look up to that. Even the Arabs in the Valley look up to that. Arab nobles used to send their kids into the desert to live with the Bedouins to toughen them up. Check out Saladin some time. Kind of sums it up a bit.ISIS is part of that whole "Arabs on the Mountain". The more you pound them and they keep going the more respected they are in that part of the world. They could really care less about political correctness, the price of Apple stock today (a least the soldiers), or anything beyond what's in front of their faces, what's in their hearts and what they believe with every fiber in their beings. These guys will cut your head off and put it in your hands because they think you are pretty much an animal that should be slaughtered. Welcome to infidel-dom. From my experience the best way to deal with them is not to bomb them into the stone age. That only strengthens them and more specifically their perception of strength by others and their ideology. You defeat them by folding them in on each other. Get a powerful one to roll for money or power or whatever. Once he rolls with his guys let the ones who didn't roll that way know. They eat each other and the ones that are left over go home and go back to hating each other. Problem solved. Until the next Arab comes riding down from the mountain anyway.

Yes that may be the mentality but that does not answer who is funding these people, it is a fair bit more serious than going into a valley to steal food.. This group has weapons and they are well organised, I almost expect to see them using "stolen" F16's in the near future.. A mentality can only get you so far you need the hard resources to make things happen on a wider scale and this group seems to have that in abundance, I mean they even have "supply drops" if this report is to be believed..

www.iraqinews.com... lanes-airdrop-weapons-isis-southeast-tikrit/

a reply to: Vasa Croe

IS have controlled this refinery before and they didn't obliterate it as it is of such importance to the Oil production of Iraq it is better to try and take it back, no matter the cost. It's not like you can just build a new refinery overnight.

a reply to: slider1982

They originally took this refinery back in June 2014. The Government retook it last November and it would appear IS have mounted a counter attack (as a result of the loss at the battle for Tikrit last month) to retake this refinery. Doing so not only harms Iraq's production and ability to raise cash, but also gives them control over the road to Mosul.

It has nothing to do with the potential oil discovered in the UK.

if libya is any indication next Isil will be creating their own rothschild owned/controlled central bank

originally posted by: Silcone Synapse
a reply to: Vasa Croe

Its a huge facility,so lets hope the south gate is well defended.
There's no real hope of the Allies giving air support here,as the whole refinery would burn.
Evil IS count on that fact.

There is only one other option.
Special forces.

no there is a 2nd option....an all-Arab force go in there and kick their ass.....they have been buying up all these weapons, it's about time they send in their own "boots-on-the-ground", instead of the west doing the dirty work...let them die for their own freedom

so all the intel is asleep huh!
in the old days the good guys would pop some hurt on the heads of the bad guys. I'm curious about the lack of stopping tatics.....lots of options to stop the bad guys....peace through superior firepower....break out the anti-personell dart bombs and sleep chems....hit the perimeter and offices

a reply to: jimmyx

The problem with Arab armies is keeping them in the field. They are notoriously ill-disciplined (I read once this is cultural - they're loyalties are along family/tribal lines and will act as such) and they only stay in the fight if they're winning.

As we've seen in Iraq, whole Divisions will flee the field when faced with a much smaller force simply because their Officer's ran. It's not like they weren't trained or equipped - they just have a real crisis in morale and leadership which has always been a problem for Arab armies for the last 60 years. The only Arab force that actually stood it's ground against Israel was the British trained Arab Legion - the rest folded as soon as an Israeli looked at them.

Papa smurf can over power Iraqi forces. Forces is a stretch. Iraqi leeches is a more appropriate term for their military members.

a reply to: Vasa Croe

seems ISIS is making all kinds of advances today

I dont usually comment on ISIS threads as i really have nothing to add or ask.

However, i spoke to a close friend last night after a long time of no contact. We spoke of the things that had changed while we werent in contact.
He reminded me of how we laughed at ISIS two years ago when we joked about them properly conquering the Mid East... we quickly realized how things had changed and the process is not yet finished.

I ask you this: Not if, but when ISIS finally conquers an entire Syria or Iraq or both, and their 'Caliphate' cannot just be ignored anymore... what then, what will happen next?

I am not patronizing.... i am seriously baffled as to the next move of any country. It would mean boots on the ground and an all out invasion (all over again)!

UN Finds Credible Ties Between ISIS And Israeli Defense Forces
jbuc912 / February 13, 2015

In a new report from the UN, it is revealed that the Israeli Defense Forces (IDF) were maintaining regular contact with members of the so-called Islamic State since May of 2013. Initial reports from the IDF stated that this was only for medical care for civilians, but that story fell apart when the UN observers identified direct contact between IDF forces and ISIS soldiers, including giving medical care to ISIS fighters. Observations even included the transfer of two crates from the IDF to ISIS forces, the contents of which have not been confirmed at this time. Further the UN report identified what the Syrians label a crossing point of forces between Israel and ISIS, a point of concern brought before the UN Security Council. This report from the UN strengthens the claims by the Syrian regime that Israel is heavily involved in operations within the nation.

atlasmonitor.wordpress.com...

if true
it would come as no surprise