Republican Congress Strips Women and Gays of Rights Under Guise of ‘Religious Freedom’

originally posted by: Deaf Alien
a reply to: Lgbtlivesmatter

Oh no no no he was not referring to you. He was talking about the pity party by certain Christians.

yeah, the icky ones with religious beliefs.

Where those beliefs are supposed to be protected, but hey! Fagedaboudit!

American politics really is like an extremely long Monty Python skit.


I think I can hear other countries laughing.

originally posted by: Deaf Alien
a reply to: Lgbtlivesmatter

Oh no no no he was not referring to you. He was talking about the pity party by certain Christians.

Sure every group has that.

But I'm for religious freedom just as much as I'm for gay freedom, neither is mutually exclusive


But for those two people to sit and try to tell those of us in the community we should be outraged and then ostracize us when we refuse to do so is the hight of bigotry.

It makes them no better then those they accuse of it

a reply to: Lgbtlivesmatter

I started this discussion with a thought about respect, and how respect was dead.

Those that favoured a more extremist approach mocked my idea that Christians needed to respect those in the LGBT community and those in the LGBT community needed to respect religious folks.

It was, to put it politely, highly dismissed, because (apparently) respect is no longer a function in society today.

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: mOjOm

I know, it's just. . . um. . how did you put it.. "religious pricks" have all these icky "faith" issues that must be repressed, denied, ignored.

So I called them "Religious Pricks". I didn't include you with them did I?? I'm assuming you're not one of the few who are hiding behind their religion in an effort to hide their bias. I didn't say All Christians are part of that group either. In fact, I think they are a minority within their own Faith. But they are a very loud and powerful minority.

I don't have any problem with your religion or those who follow it most of the time. However, every now and then some members of one Religion or another goes out and does some real "prickish" stuff in the name of their god and it's BS.

I'm actually counting on Good Christians to ultimately put an end to all of this also. So I'm more for your side than you might think. If that is in fact the side you're on.

a reply to: beezzer

Oh believe me we do respect others' religious beliefs.

But a business is not a church. It is secular. Businesses serve the public.

originally posted by: Lgbtlivesmatter

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: Lgbtlivesmatter

originally posted by: Annee
a reply to: Lgbtlivesmatter

It would be interesting to know your age group.

What generation you're a part of.

Why does my age group matter? Does it somehow make my viewpoints less relevant?

I can already sense what is about to happen .

People who aren't gay or aren't part of the culture are going to try to downplay my viewpoint

It happens a lot which is why it's so hard for gay people like myself to speak the truth and common sense of the issue.

And for the record I'm 40 and my partner is 35

So you're from a younger generation then me.

Reminds me of the woman who fought for equal rights, and the young women today who take it for granted.

Discrimination today is mild compared to what it used to be. The reason for that is laws preventing it. It's taken fir granted.

I'm 40 and have spent my whole life rallying do my cause...

And you have the nerve to try and discredit me?

Please.

Are you part of the LGBT community?

You just don't like what I have to say because it doesn't tow the "hate anyone who doesn't like us" line


I'm sorry that myself, my partner, and our group of people not only push for tolerance, but also lead by example

I think we do a huge credit to those who came before us by doing so.

An eye for an eye leaves the whole world blind

We just won't stand for it equal rights means freedom for everyone to live their life and their businesses as they wish, so long as it harms none.

Hurt feelings don't count. Honestly many out there could stand to toughen up a little bit and learn to love through their own intolerances

No, I sm not discrediting you. That is your interpretation.

It's natural to live in your own generation.

But, would you be free today to be an openly LGBT business owner if non-discrimination laws hadn't come before you?

originally posted by: Lgbtlivesmatter
a reply to: mOjOm

Pitty party?

Let me ask. Are you part of the LGBT community?

If not then don't presume to tell me how I should handle this, we have done it our whole life.

You're a prime example of how bad this is gotten, when those of us in the community choose to stand up for those we don't agree w on the grounds the intolerance has no place on either side.

And you don't like it?

Ask yourself if that's so offensive to you, maybe it is YOU who have your head wrong about the issue

No I'm not part of your group and when did I tell you how to do anything???

I'm asking you questions because you're both a Business Owner and LGBT. I'm not attacking you at all so ease up a bit.

a reply to: mOjOm

I'm actually counting on Good Christians to ultimately put an end to all of this also. So I'm more for your side than you might think.

RIGHT ON!!!!

originally posted by: beezzer

originally posted by: Deaf Alien
a reply to: Lgbtlivesmatter

Oh no no no he was not referring to you. He was talking about the pity party by certain Christians.

yeah, the icky ones with religious beliefs.

Where those beliefs are supposed to be protected, but hey! Fagedaboudit!

Beez, I'm not against faith or people of faith. Hell, I actually find Religion interesting from a philosophical POV. I also think that there is some wisdom to found in it as well.

But I also know how when it's abused and used in terrible ways it causes so much suffering and despotism and war. I don't like that part of it, but it's there.

a reply to: Lgbtlivesmatter

Being gay doesn't put you above the law. Discrimination laws exist for a reason and discriminating based on gender, race, religion, or sexual orientation is against the law.

Christians must serve gays and gays must serve Christians. Yes, tolerance works both ways, and luckily discrimination laws enforce it to make sure society stays fair.

a reply to: Annee


Have non discriminatory laws stopped discrimination? Answer is no

The point is trying to destroy other people and other busienesses for wanting to operate in a way that is in line w their belief system should not be an issue

As that rabbit said up. There "respect"

It doesn't do anyone any justice to target businesses and families and people to destroy because other people tell us in the gay community we should be outraged.

No what outrages me is those in my own community determined to destroy people for their beliefs, KNOWING that not that long ago in history we were targeted to be shunned and destroyed.

It's hypocritical and it's wrong

It was wrong to do it to us and it's wrong to do it to them. How can that even be debated

a reply to: arpgme


Should I have to bake a cake for an anti-gay rally?

originally posted by: arpgme
a reply to: Lgbtlivesmatter

Being gay doesn't put you above the law. Discrimination laws exist for a reason and discriminating based on gender, race, religion, or sexual orientation is against the law.

Christians must serve gays and gays must serve Christians. Yes, tolerance works both ways, and luckily discrimination laws enforce it to make sure society stays fair.

Let's not leave out the Handicap.

That's the discrimination I grew up with. People were not accomodating, or polite about it either.

Sad that people had to be forced to treat a disabled person equally.

a reply to: Lgbtlivesmatter

You keep saying that there are many in the LGBT community who are wanting and trying to destroy those types of businesses. I have not heard anything about that.

originally posted by: Lgbtlivesmatter
a reply to: arpgme


Should I have to bake a cake for an anti-gay rally?

I think by law you would have to. You just can't be forced to decorate it with anti-gay slogans.

It is the same for grocery stores they can't discriminate who they sell food to in that way.

originally posted by: arpgme
a reply to: Lgbtlivesmatter

Being gay doesn't put you above the law. Discrimination laws exist for a reason and discriminating based on gender, race, religion, or sexual orientation is against the law.

Christians must serve gays and gays must serve Christians. Yes, tolerance works both ways, and luckily discrimination laws enforce it to make sure society stays fair.

That's exactly right. I would tell a Gay Business owner who didn't want to serve Christians to "stop being a dick and serve them like you would anyone else." Their money is just as good as every one else money and they aren't asking for any service that you wouldn't give to anyone else so there shouldn't be a problem.

To me this isn't just about Christians vs. Gays. This is about plain old fashioned Bigotry and attacking people simply for who they are. While I admit I'm neither Gay nor Christian that doesn't mean I haven't experienced exactly the same treatment myself for different reasons and it's BS. It's one thing for people to do it in their personal lives, but when you start to allow such practices within Commerce or Business it's another story. It's one thing to have someone say they won't personally work with me on something. But when you start having businesses do that to people it's a whole different thing and much more harm can come from it.

a reply to: arpgme

I don't think this person is going to run around discriminating against everyone.. but some of us enjoy freedom... just that.. the freedom to say yes, and the freedom to say no if we feel its warranted..

the government doesn't have to dictate everything to us.. we are adults, and CAN act like adults (usually) but if Westboro came into my place of business.. I would not want to serve them.. I would not want to smile at them, and offer them anything - to be honest..

sometimes I can see a reason to want to choose who we do business with.. it doesn't mean suddenly anyone is going to have whites only restaurants.. but I can see why a private religious school feels like they should be able to admit whoever they would like into their private school, and I can see why Hooters wants to discriminate to an extent during employment..

the government doesn't have to dictate everything to us.. we CAN choose, and that equally means choosing who we give our business to..

all business stays open with the consent of the communities they are in.. if someone makes a business decision that is not acceptable, it is the community who will stop doing business there..

and I for one couldn't imagine working at a place who was forced to employ me, or giving my hard earned money to someone who didn't want my money..

originally posted by: Lgbtlivesmatter
a reply to: arpgme


Should I have to bake a cake for an anti-gay rally?

Yes.

But that would be distasteful and disrespectful.

But that's the world we all live in now.