Bradford City Fire Was Deliberate, (Disturbing)

www.theguardian.com...

The blaze that killed 56 football fans at Bradford City’s Valley Parade ground in 1985 was just one of at least nine fires at businesses owned by or associated with the club’s then chairman, according to extraordinary evidence published for the first time.

I draw your attention to this thread and in particular this comment from goldentorch. www.abovetopsecret.com...

"I was there that day and it was very difficult to comprehend. The fire started at the right hand side of the images I think you'll be seeing but I can't watch them again being a part of such a disaster still carries an emotional burden and it's quite upsetting to write this, this is where a few of the rowdier fans were stood and I saw some sort of flash and just presumed someone had set a flare off. Then around that area people started to get a little agitated. As the investigation stated later they considered that the accumulated rubbish under the stands had caught fire and it had spread like a 'wildfire' beneath the stands. The speed of the conflagration then had me dumbstruck. The heat and smoke overcame at least one chap in his seat and he died where he sat.
Another distressing image that sticks with me was that the stands had a small standing area at either side and to see someone walk down there half on fire and then turn to walk back into the flames leaves on with a sense of frustration and the problems inherent in survivors guilt. In all reality though it really did take a grip ever so quickly and the heat was tremendous so I still have to keep telling myself there was nothing I could do.
It was quite an awful day and a trauma that still scars me to this day."

A flash then a fire that spread with astounding speed as told by an ATS member. And now we have a book by a survivor whose research suggests this is typical of a Stafford Heginbotham fire.

It would explain why rubbish had accumulated underneath the stands - he was too cheap to maintain the stands. That was a similar to the fire in the London underground that killed so many. The plastic trash that accumulated underneath an escalator ignited and generated carbon monoxide that killed everyone that went near. Look at all that black smoke - that's definitely plastic.

a reply to: stormcell

Paint as well...

It was when the raging flames hit and ignited the stand's asphalt, tarpaulin and bitumen roof that the grey smoke became jet black.

www.independent.co.uk...

A well known busker went down into the London underground fire to help get people out. He didn't make it back.

We can see constables putting themselves in danger in this video. They don't get as much media attention as the few police who acted badly at Hillsborough. I believe I've found the reason Hillsborough is big and Bradford is "footballs forgotten tragedy". Hillsborough was deliberate murder designed to be used as an emotional tool. Bradford was, it seems, one mans crime.

Many readers are struggling with the idea that Hillsborough could have been a deliberate way to introduce Premier League Football and now attack the Office of Constable. Look at Bradford. Some of those making money out of football will burn you alive if there's profit in it.

originally posted by: stormcell
It would explain why rubbish had accumulated underneath the stands - he was too cheap to maintain the stands. That was a similar to the fire in the London underground that killed so many. The plastic trash that accumulated underneath an escalator ignited and generated carbon monoxide that killed everyone that went near. Look at all that black smoke - that's definitely plastic.

I was only about 8 when this happened, but I remember it, and I remember the anger of my parents. They thought back then that Stafford Heginbotham should have been arrested for massive negligence. It's still shocking now to think that the man ultimately responsible never saw any damn punishment.

These revelations about previous fires do not surprise me one bit. Even without the evidence of the other fires, he was responsible, he was chairman, he was the figurehead. He should have been charged with manslaughter and a full and proper investigation should have been done, maybe then the evidence of the other fires and his financial troubles would have led to a retrial for murder.

I don't believe in hell, but if I did I would wish Heginbotham to be there for eternity.

a reply to: Rocker2013

Suspicious that there never was a proper investigation. Could it fit in with what I've said about Hillsborough? Football grounds had to be prepared for television. Fans had to be tamed so matches would start on time and the masses could be anaesthetized with widescreen TVs in pubs. The money made from televised football has been phenomenal. It's thought that some of the bling stolen in the big raid in London recently belonged to premier league footballers. Vast sums of money and social control are motives that psychos could do anything to achieve. Not suggesting footballers are psychos in on it. They're just useful idiots who can be guaranteed not to think in case it endangers their income. The real money has gone to those pulling the strings, or lighting the fires.

Not knocking football as a spectator sport. The atmosphere, or group spiritual experience if you prefer, is well worth it.

Starred for a great thread.
I find it inconceivable that with a history of fires at premises owned by the chairman, that angle seemingly wasn't investigated or was deliberately covered up. Of course, payoffs and favours would have been necessary for that to happen and it was probably all the deaths and injuries that ensured nobody in the know would ever speak of it, fearing multiple murder or conspiracy charges.

Back then, as today, "pillars of the community" such as the chairman, business leaders, politicians and senior police all moved in the same circles, looking out for each other. So with that in mind, it's likely others were involved in covering up or burying knowledge of the previous fires. After all, if one of their kind goes down, the mud tends to stick and there's usually a mad scramble to distance themselves.

originally posted by: Britguy

Back then, as today, "pillars of the community" such as the chairman, business leaders, politicians and senior police all moved in the same circles, looking out for each other.

So true. During a particularly unpleasant investigation years ago I was told, "He's alright. He plays golf." Just a few days ago I heard one of the teachers at the school central to that investigation has finally been prosecuted. The golfing headmaster is still free.

a reply to: Kester

To be fair, they are not saying that this fire in particular WAS deliberate, they are saying he had been involved in at least 9 similar fires.

So yeah, it certainly doesn't look good and i would say it definitely needs looking at again with this new info but at this stage, there is no evidence to say this was deliberate. In point of fact, saying he deliberately started this fire on a public forum opens yourself up to liable charges in a civil case - and that wouldn't be hard to prove given your opening and subsequent posts (not having a go, more trying to save you from possible future trouble).

As to the fire itself, what a completely terrible event and one i remember vividly. You wouldn't wish it on your worst enemy, never mind innocent people simply going to watch a match. The only positive is that wooden stadiums are now frowned on.

I agree, remember it on Grandstand when all Saturday matches were pundits and the goal ticker tape. Hills borough too.

Those wooden stands were a disaster waiting to happen and people smoked in the stands.

It's a big jump to think that someone would intentionally start a fire underneath 100's of people.

originally posted by: Rocker2013

I was only about 8 when this happened, but I remember it, and I remember the anger of my parents. They thought back then that Stafford Heginbotham should have been arrested for massive negligence. It's still shocking now to think that the man ultimately responsible never saw any damn punishment..

1.) I agree;

2.) "They say that "they hate us for our freedoms!" So I guess our governments are right to destroy all our freedoms for us so were no longer a target? Thanks Obama those pesky freedoms were like a target on my back."

wonderful, puts 911 and everything that's happened since into one sentence. thank you

edit on 16-4-2015 by Azureblue because: typo

edit on 16-4-2015 by Azureblue because: ,

a reply to: Azureblue

Dunno what happened in the above thread but i wanted to say this:

"They say that "they hate us for our freedoms!" So I guess our governments are right to destroy all our freedoms for us so were no longer a target? Thanks Obama those pesky freedoms were like a target on my back."

Wonderful, puts 911 and everything that happened since into one sentence, thank you

I remember seeing the whole thing unfold on TV and years later, having to sit through the video during fire safety training.
The thought it was a deliberate act is even more horrifying than a mere accident.
Good thread OP.

a reply to: Flavian

Thanks for the legal warning. I better make it very clear.

If this wasn't deliberate it was one hell of a cigarette that fan was smoking. And the buildup of rubbish must have been 90% oil soaked rags.

Politicians compromised in various ways are allowing the destruction of our forefathers legacy. Our society. Part of this is the attack on the Office of Constable. Hillsborough was designed to be used as an emotional weapon. This we see clearly by comparing the story available to us through the inquest evidence with the mind controlling media dross. Try it. You'll see what I mean.

I had my suspicions the Bradford fire would be put into the mix but I had no idea a survivors book had been written. We shall wait and see how the spin doctors play it.

What must be very noticeable to an observer is the lack of attention paid to the Bradford fire compared to the Hillsborough Myth Machine. Large numbers of entirely innocent fans died at both. One is a political tool and we hear brainwashing messages connected with it almost every day. The other appears to be an insurance job with numerous interested parties steadfastly not investigating.

Constables getting burnt helping others away is a dangerous visual image we see at Bradford. Dangerous because we're supposed to think ACAB. Not some coppers would burn for you. That doesn't help the anti law and order agenda of the private financiers and their collaborators.

Timing is everything and that fire was around the time a decision was made to tidy up football for television. How many man hours of potential productivity have been lost to televised football? Complain about the state of the country much? Should have switched off the TV and done something. Apart from the billions of pounds there's the social control aspect.

Spooks teach journalism that's why the mainstream media is hopeless. We won't hear a sensible word from the mainstream media on the Bradford fire.

The story will be ripped apart and evidence of larger scale complicity will become obvious. The lack of adequate investigation to date indicates evidence of larger scale complicity is available, we just have to recognise it.

What always bugged me was why would anyone let so much sh1t accumulate under the stands. I used to work at Bloomfield Road and they had wooden stands for years after, used to get nervous thinking there could be a fire brewing underneath the South Stand.

If he was a firestarter, how does no one know that he disappeared to light it?

If he had someone else starting them, wonder who they are....

Look it's a good plug for his book and after his tragic life I hope that if this is founded it come out to givE him closure, but how has no one else picked up on this?

This being ATS I suspect he was illuminati.

a reply to: Kester

its a good point, why to this day do 1000's of Liverpool fans want 'justice' for the 92 and yet the Bradford fans seem silent?

Psyche? Guilt?

I wonder if any ATS amateur shrinks could shed some light (no pun intended).

a reply to: Kester

I think we've got an answer to motive for cover-up, though they don't mention the social control advantages of sanitised, televised football.

The Valley Parade fire was one of a series of terrible events at football grounds that transformed the sport. The Popplewell Inquiry recommended banning the construction of new wooden stands, closing down those deemed unsafe and banning smoking in old wooden stands.

The Bradford fire was shortly followed by the Heysel disaster, when on May 29 in the same year 39 football fans were killed at the Belgian stadium when a wall collapsed before the European Cup final between Juventus and Liverpool. Then on April 15, 1989, 96 Liverpool fans were killed at Hillsborough stadium in Shef-field, crushed to death while their team played Nottingham Forest in the FA Cup semi-final.

After Heysel stricter rules were introduced to keep out the hooligans. After Hillsborough, and the Taylor Report, clubs in the top two divisions were required to have all-seater stadiums while pitchside fencing was removed and CCTV cameras introduced.

In just a few years football was transformed - and not just its grounds. The change in the sport was exemplified by the change from the old First Division to the Premiership in 1992, and the first of the TV deals that has since brought billions of pounds into the game. Whatever started the fire that day it began a chain of events that have made football almost unrecognisable from the sport Martin Fletcher's lost relatives enjoyed so much.

www.express.co.uk...

a reply to: Forensick

This seems to be the primary reason we hear so much about Hillsborough and so little about Bradford.

The footage of the Bradford disaster demonstrates repeated acts of valour by policemen on duty and by the many fans who returned to haul the injured away from the terrible heat.

www.irishtimes.com...

While at Hillsborough we see a line of constables being stopped from helping by Assistant Chief Constable Walter Jackass, cunningly disguised as an off-duty copper. Hillsborough was designed as an anti-constabulary emotional weapon used to convince us ACAB. Then we're meant to accept the bankers private police. Fat chance.

No one ever wants to admit they've been conned. Football fans have been played for years. Those seeking to benefit from these black operations want us to descend into conflict. They will fan the flames of argument. Bad choice of words. No pun intended. People burned here.

The official story is ridiculous. An imaginary fan dropped an imaginary cigarette down an imaginary hole into twenty years of rubbish. This one started a fire although the previous thousands didn't, just before the 77 year old stand was to be demolished. Conveniently billions of pounds worth of social control just happened to grow out of it.

Here we find others are coming forward.

One of the people who has contacted Martin in the past few days did so to tell him his father was working as a painter and decorator at Tebro Toys, Heginbotham’s company, before the blaze that ripped through the building in 1977. On the evening of the fire, his father always remembered Heginbotham telling him it “might be best if he takes all his tools home as they might not be safe left in the building”.

www.theguardian.com...

Here at one minute into the video Raymond 'Shifty Eyes' Falconer tells us he spoke to the fan who dropped the cigarette. www.itv.com...

Why wasn't the verdict so clear?

To McCall, the verdict of inquiry judge Sir Oliver Popplewell, who declared the fire had probably been started by a stray match, cigarette or pipe tobacco slipping through gaps on the floor on to a build-up of litter, remains the most likely cause of the tragedy.

www.dailymail.co.uk...


Over on the medical forum we have outlined the possibility that Stafford was a remorseless psychotic. www.abovetopsecret.com...


Perhaps that could to some extent describe those attempting to continue the cover-up.

Anyone still hoping to somehow support the accident/coincidence version of events should dig into the story about Stafford lying to the Prime Minister about having prepared for the demolition.

Here we have a claim that the coroner chose to withhold the identity of the cigarette dropper. Shame, we could have asked him what made his cigarette so different from all the thousands of others, and with such flawless timing.

I remember the coroner telling me it was obvious how the fire had started. Detective Inspector Raymond Falconer actually identified a man who had dropped a lit cigarette that went down a hole in the stand and started the fire.
This corroborates what I was told at the time by the coroner. He said it was believed the fire had been started by a man, visiting this country from Australia, but his name was never revealed.

www.dailymail.co.uk...

As seen in the OP our ATS witness says this.

....I saw some sort of flash and just presumed someone had set a flare off. Then around that area people started to get a little agitated. As the investigation stated later they considered that the accumulated rubbish under the stands had caught fire and it had spread like a 'wildfire' beneath the stands. The speed of the conflagration then had me dumbstruck.

Possibly some flammable substance was laid down for the cigarette to fall onto.


The story is chopping and changing from possibly a match, pipe tobacco or cigarette to positively a cigarette dropped by a known individual, presumably fleet of foot. I don't trust shifty eyes Falconer with his claim of having met this anonymous individual. And isn't it rather convenient the one innocent but unlucky individual we'd like to talk to is away on the other side of the world? .

bradfordcityfire.co.uk...

The song entered the charts at number four before reaching the number one spot on June 1st 1985. Having decided to collect the money and donate it as a lump sum to the fire disaster fund, Marsden was shocked to discover that the appeal had been closed, and the organisers had told him that they didn’t want the money. In the end, the money was donated instead to the burns research unit in Bradford.


The music publishers of the record refused to waive their royalties, resulting in a much-reduced donation of £132,000.

This is so very different from the massive coverage given to the Hillsborough song. If this is down to character differences in different parts of the country those differences are gigantic. It looks more like Bradford fulfilled its purpose then had to be forgotten.

It's noticeable that different news sources are telling very different versions of the Bradford story, presumably to encourage disagreement.