Russia's Ghost Army in Ukraine

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: DeadSeraph

But can we really excuse Putin's actions simply because the west has made similar or even worse decisions?

"Putin" isn't trying to dominate the world.

Perhaps not, just his neighbors.
I assume you're trying to claim that America is attempting to dominate the world? Funny how there are hundreds of countries where the US has not "dominated" when they could so easily have done so.

I think what you're seeing is actually a common desire to progress as societies and nations, and you seem to think that because we all believe in democracy we've somehow been "dominated" by America.

I think this adequately shows the nonsensical notions many Russian's have about government and leadership. Opposing democratic views and having common goals politically is not a threat.

originally posted by: Flatcoat
a reply to: Shadow1024

So your point is that if Russian hired snipers shot a few dozens during Maidan, then its OK for Russia to invade Crimea and East Ukraine?

You see, that's where logic fails in these sort of threads. There is no evidence that Russia was behind the snipers. It's just the trend to blame them for absolutely everything. Why would they help overthrow their own puppet?

How does shooting protesters and attacking the revolution damage their own puppet?

Who wins here? Are you seriously suggesting that murdering protesters in the streets is not beneficial to the regime in place or its allies in Russia?

That's just NUTS!

a reply to: Rocker2013

Perhaps not, just his neighbors.

More like defensive posturing. You could compare it to what the US reaction would be if a Russian alliance equivalent to NATO were encroaching upon the Americas, surrounding the US with military bases (including nukes).

History reflects that kind of US reaction during the 'Cuban Missile Crisis' in the early 60's. I don't expect Russia or China to behave any differently.

a reply to: noeltrotsky

The senseless shelling started already much earlier, Ukraine wasn`t able to do anything anymore back then.

There were Russians who were asked if they wanted to go the Ukraine and they got paid regular salaries a day, but because Russia knew of the backlash it might give, they were told not to talk about it to their families...they were actual volunteers, however special troops have been send in also to do some stuff, the same as US/UK has been doing in the Ukraine and does all over the World all the time.

Some regular battalions are probably only have been send in late August and late January.

Why do you think the Ukrainian Army General talked about there were no "regular" Russian troops fighting in the Ukraine in January, the same as The West is denying they are involved in the fighting...because special forces are not being considered as actual involvement (they know better, but that`s how dirty Politicians and media are playing it nowadays).

a reply to: Rocker2013

So you admit that this is what happened in Crimea? Good, it's about time.

And aside from the actions of one country not being an excuse for the actions of another, nope, that's not what happened.
Iraq was a failed state with no functioning government.
Although I disagree with ever going in there, it was nothing like what happened in Crimea.

Again, saying "but 'merika did this!!!!" is not an excuse for ignoring what Russia did.

No, the huge difference here is that the US had just finished bombing the living crap out of them, and installing an american governor, whereas the Crimean parliament asked Russia to intervene.

Okay, you're clearly irrational.
There were no credible observers in the Crimean referendum, so where you pulled that BS from is anyone's guess.
The OSCE were forcibly rejected from entering Crimea and shots were fired at them when they attempted to get access.

I believe many countries refused to send observers because they wouldn't acknowledge the legitimacy of the referendum. The observers that did attend were from the EU parliament. BTW, my 'irrationality' is just your unfounded opinion, nothing more.

a reply to: Rocker2013

How does shooting protesters and attacking the revolution damage their own puppet?

Who wins here? Are you seriously suggesting that murdering protesters in the streets is not beneficial to the regime in place or its allies in Russia?

That's just NUTS!

Because the blame was immediately placed on the sitting government.

eta. We can all see now just how beneficial it was to the 'regime' and Russia....

originally posted by: LotToTell2
a reply to: Shadow1024

Since you ignored or didn't see my post to you, let me repeat it


****************
Let me tell you something REAL as opposed to Internet fake stuff

Ukraine is about to economically collapse because they listened to US and EU criminals who destroyed the country

Where are now those 5 billion dollars Victoria Nuland sent to Ukraine to foster the anger and revolution against the government

Can that money help them now ?

Ukraine was already collapsing financially under Yanukovych (corruption, but also just the crisis). Even if you have some holes in your memory - do you remember emergency loans that Russia gave to save Yanukovych? Later Russian invasion only damaged already ill country.

a reply to: Shadow1024

It was already going on much earlier...

2008–09 Ukrainian financial crisis

a reply to: BornAgainAlien

Indeed. Many of those who accuse Ukrainians of being Nazis seem to forget about the orange revolution. The desire to break away from Russia and embrace the west is nothing new in Ukraine.

a reply to: DeadSeraph

The Orange Revolution was also US orchestrated.

Georgia is now also back in the cross-hairs of the US again

And Armenia and Azerbaijan

You seriously think this has anything to do with the will of the people ?

a reply to: BornAgainAlien

Georgia is now also back in the cross-hairs of the US again

So I guess we should see governments fall in other countries she visits since she is supposed to be one of the masterminds of the supposed coup in Ukraine and now Georgia.

Maybe she really runs the world and there is no NWO, or PTB because she is both rolled into one.

Speculating is fun isn't it?

news.vice.com...

The last in the series. Thanks again to the OP for posting this thread. Great job by Vice.

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien
a reply to: DeadSeraph

The Orange Revolution was also US orchestrated.

What was I thinking... Of course it was!



You are so predictable

originally posted by: DeadSeraph
I feel it's necessary to share this important piece of journalism with the ATS community, because regardless of your views on the crisis in Ukraine, these soldiers are not being honored.

I'm curious if you believe that the US/UK had military advisors in Ukraine and is involved with or is responsible for the new Ukrainian government prior to some of these actions by Russia?

a reply to: DeadSeraph

You are so predictable

So you knew, but decided to act like you didn`t know...that`s also very predictable from the anti-Putin crowd.

US campaign behind the turmoil in Kiev

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien
a reply to: DeadSeraph

You are so predictable

So you knew, but decided to act like you didn`t know...that`s also very predictable from the anti-Putin crowd.

US campaign behind the turmoil in Kiev

It's called sarcasm.

originally posted by: thepixelpusher

originally posted by: DeadSeraph
I feel it's necessary to share this important piece of journalism with the ATS community, because regardless of your views on the crisis in Ukraine, these soldiers are not being honored.

I'm curious if you believe that the US/UK had military advisors in Ukraine and is involved with or is responsible for the new Ukrainian government prior to some of these actions by Russia?

No, I don't believe that. I believe the military advisers likely entered the country after the Russian military started taking over Crimea. I do not think the west was completely uninvolved, however. There is enough evidence to suggest they were supporting Yanukovych's opponents. But I don't think the west had anything to do with the snipers at Maidan, or that they personally orchestrated a coup. There are enough pro western Ukrainians in Kiev and western Ukraine that the revolution was going to happen one way or another. It's my belief that western elements simply encouraged it. That dynamic changed once Russia became involved militarily.

originally posted by: DeadSeraph

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien
a reply to: DeadSeraph

You are so predictable

So you knew, but decided to act like you didn`t know...that`s also very predictable from the anti-Putin crowd.

US campaign behind the turmoil in Kiev

It's called sarcasm.

...and I wasn`t.

a reply to: BornAgainAlien

that`s also very predictable from the anti-Putin crowd.

And you are pro-Putin.

Putin is hiding those poor soldiers corpses.
Putin didn't attended funeral of B. Nemtsov.
Putin even denied entrance into Russia for several European politicians to the funeral.

But You like Putin, good boy.

a reply to: kitzik

I don`t like Putin, I don`t care for him at all.

I just care about things being called for what they are...there was an US coup in the Ukraine, and the US and Russia are in another proxy war, a war which the US knew was going to happen and which Russia didn`t wanted to happen.

And I`m not the one who keeps ignoring facts, selective memory seems to be the norm in a certain group of people.