If Mariupol falls, we could end up at war with Russia.

a reply to: ScientificRailgun

The thing looks like an air whale on radar.

Then a couples ARM against those radars may possibly make the whale quite invisible...

a reply to: spy66

Russia aint doing something the US havent already done more than once. Its just that the propaganda machine is printing a different story when Russia is doing it. That is the only difference.

And the fact that the US hasn't annexed any of the countries, or even part of those countries is the difference.

Russia can't say they have that distinction now can they?

The US have attacked soverign nations based on lies. And killed their head of state and braged about it to Our amusment.

I am guessing your talking about Gaddafi and Hussein correct?

Well the US didn't kill either one of them...the people they oppressed for so long are the ones who killed them.

But let's look at what they have done shall we...

One killed many of his own citizens in chemical weapons attacks, not to mention torturing innocent civilians.

The other ordered the bombing of Pan Am 103.

But I can see where you would consider them as respected heads of state...

The good thing about Ukraine...People are starting to Wake up, probably because this can become really serious for all of us.

And so are the Russian people when seeing their family members in the military come home in a coffin from a war they supposedly aren't involved in.

There wont be any discussions on ATS while this event is rolling.

Want to bet on that?

You understand that we had first hand info coming in from Ukraine from the earliest days of this conflict, so don't think the ATS members won't discuss something like that as it happens.

The gap in military technology isn`t big enough.

Both the US and Russia were not able to defeat a lesser technology military in Vietnam and Afghanistan.

Report: Chinese Air Force Closes Gap With U.S.

Even if nuclear weapons aren`t used it won`t be that easy.

The missile technology from the Russians and now also from Chinese is excellent...ICBMs, Air-to-Air missiles, Surface-to Air and Anti ship missiles are all top notch, and together with the jamming equipment, good radars and other stuff, it`s not going to be a walk in the park conventional either.

a reply to: tsurfer2000h

I dont really care about Your argument. THe US killed more People in 10 years in Iraq than Sadam did in 30 years. Broke into Peoples houses and raped and killed small Girls. Jeeses. Do you really suport this crap. Soldiers cheering as they shoot up People. It is discusting.

And more People are being killed in Iraq today than when Sadam was the head.

The US dont have to annex Iraq or Afghanistan they already have full political controll.

Sadam wasnt killed by the US but was captured by the US and handed over. In my eyes that is the same thing. Sadam was doomed the day he was captured.

Mariupol WILL fall, and all defenders will have hard times. If NATO dare to go officially it will be destroyed. Dont mess with will of the nation that fight for his land. I dont advice anyone to go there - you will find your death. And all warmongers calm down or your dirty world can end prematurely.

a reply to: spy66

If the B2 cant deliver its goods, but the Russian bomber can. You would know who spent their Money well.

And the B2 has proven it can deliver it's goods...and do it better and more efficiently than a Russian bomber. Obviously the US, or Russia wouldn't be trying to produce radars that can find it.

Not to mention they wouldn't be trying to produce their own stealth bombers.

a reply to: tsurfer2000h

Not to mention they wouldn't be trying to produce their own stealth bombers.

What is your obsession with B2 ?
Any serious conflict will be about cyber neutralization, sattelite killers first, after ICBM, and only after this may be some aircrafts will fly.

originally posted by: petar258
Mariupol WILL fall, and all defenders will have hard times. If NATO dare to go officially it will be destroyed. Dont mess with will of the nation that fight for his land. I dont advice anyone to go there - you will find your death. And all warmongers calm down or your dirty world can end prematurely.

Fight for THEIR land?

I think you're mistaken. They're fighting for a land bridge between Crimea and Russia. If it goes exactly as you see it going, Eastern Ukraine will simply become a new territory for the Russian Federation. In fact, I'll go ahead and make this prediction now. If Ukraine says "fine, you rebels can have Eastern Ukraine for yourselves.", it won't be three months before another "referendum" happens and suddenly Eastern Ukraine "decides" to join Russia.

Count on it.

a reply to: spy66

I dont really care about Your argument.

Because you can't refute it.

THe US killed more People in 10 years in Iraq than Sadam did in 30 years

Care to provide evidence for that because Saddam has the number in the millions, I guarantee the US doesn't have that number, and I will say way less. But feel free to provide the numbers...

The US dont have to annex Iraq or Afghanistan they already have full political controll.

And if we did they wouldn't have asked us to leave.

Sadam wasnt killed by the US but was captured by the US and handed over. In my eyes that is the same thing. Sadam was doomed the day he was captured.

To the Iraqi people whom he had oppressed for decades.

Explains a lot.

Saddam was doomed when he used chemical weapons against his own people.

a reply to: ScientificRailgun

Yes their land...

a reply to: ScientificRailgun

They're fighting for a land bridge between Crimea and Russia. If it goes exactly as you see it going, Eastern Ukraine will simply become a new territory for the Russian Federation.

Except the Russian government says they can't afford the east and think it should stay as part of Ukraine...

According to the left-leaning Russian daily newspaper Novaya Gazeta, which cited officials within the Kremlin, sources within the cabinet of ministers and pro-Russian insurgents, Russia has abandoned the idea of either war-torn region becoming an independent state, instead preferring that both remain autonomous regions within Ukraine.

www.ibtimes.com...

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien
a reply to: ScientificRailgun

Yes their land...

Using that logic, Latvia, Belarus, East Germany, etc are also Russian land.

Would you agree with them rolling in and taking those lands back as well?

a reply to: ScientificRailgun

Sure, we want Belgium back so I`m all for it.

But first I want my freaking country back from the EU !

a reply to: BornAgainAlien

There are times I honestly can't tell if you're serious or just playing around.

Help.

a reply to: ScientificRailgun

Using that logic, Latvia, Belarus, East Germany, etc are also Russian land.

This just shows how little you know about the history of those regions. Each country have different logic, especially East Germany

About this map, there is some logic in dates and general line, but the borders are fictional.
Even to say that in 1654 there was Ukraine is dubious attempt.

The official name of the Cossack Hetmanate was Zaporizhian Host (Ukrainian: Військо Запорозьке, Viys’kо Zaporoz’kе). Its inhabitants referred to it in Ukrainian as "Ukraine" or "Vkraine". In Russian diplomatic correspondence it was called the Little Russian State (Russian: Малороссийское государство, Malorossiiskoe gosudarstvo);[6] in Polish, Ottoman, and Arab sources - as Ukraine or Cossakia. The historiographic term Hetmanate (Ukrainian: Гетьманщина, Het’manshchyna) was coined in the late 19th century. It derives from the word hetman, the title of the general of the Zaporizhian Army.

The founder of the Hetmanate, Bohdan Khmelnytsky, declared himself as the ruler of the Rus' state to the Polish representative Adam Kysil in February 1649. He also called the Hetmanate as Rus' state (Ukrainian: Государство Російське, Hosudarstvo Rosiyske) in his letter to the Tsar on February 17, 1654.[7] His contemporary Metropolitan Sylvestr Kosiv recognized him as the leader and the commander of our land. In his letter to C. Şerban (1657) he referred to himself as Clementiae divinae Generalis Dux Exercituum Zaporoviensium.[6]
en.wikipedia.org...

After 18-th century, what is today called East Ukraine was firmly within Russian Empire and all big cities and towns were build by Russian Imperial orders.

a reply to: ScientificRailgun

I adapt quite easily to circumstances.

originally posted by: spy66
a reply to: tsurfer2000h

THe thing is. The old Russian bombers dont have to be lesser than the B2. It all Depends on how the Tools are being used.

No one knows if the B2 is any good against Russian Technology. We only know that the B2 Works against Ours.

If the B2 cant deliver its goods, but the Russian bomber can. You would know who spent their Money well.

Um wrong!!!

Saddam had the best that russia was selling at the time the B-2 mopped them.

Sure russia keeps its best stuff for itself, but that tech is in small supply.

Most of Russias weapons are the ones they sell.

Which gas been up against US tech....and failed miserably, on a scale if hundreds to one or more many times.

Including their tanks...lol ahahahah . Bwahahahaha ahahahaha...in Iraq the kill ratio was unprecedented, our Sherman's had hundreds of times better odds against tiger tanks in ww2 than Russian tanks vs Abrams.

The Germans gave a better tank, the English have a better tank, the French have a better tank than the Abrams.

Our aircraft are much better, our everything is much better.

Russia us a pissed off Chihuahua attacking a car in comparison.

originally posted by: kitzik
a reply to: tsurfer2000h

Not to mention they wouldn't be trying to produce their own stealth bombers.

What is your obsession with B2 ?
Any serious conflict will be about cyber neutralization, sattelite killers first, after ICBM, and only after this may be some aircrafts will fly.

I disagree, America can fight just fine with or without, we were trained in the new way and the old way...because tech will always fail when you need it most.

Our artillery still manually does the numbers on a chart with an RDP(range deflection protractor) and a TFT( TABULET FIRING TABLE) as the computer guy runs the numbers on the computer.

Not to mention we literally have stealth satellites that can't be detected, and backups that can be orbited in less than 2 days if they get hit.

Everything in the american arsenol still has a lowtech backup.

We don't have to have high tech to fight and win.

a reply to: infinityorder

I see Your not up to date on this stuff.

a reply to: infinityorder

No you need a bunker that can room 300 million People.