schizophrenia or electronic harrasment?

originally posted by: GENERAL EYES
I'd like to clarify that I have no cause to believe this is part of a Government operation.

You might not, but many claiming to be TI do.

I'd bet dimes to dollars it's untoward civilian hobbyists.

I'm willing to bet that those types of people would rather do things up close and personal.

a reply to: daskakik

Up close and personal?

Like the myriad of kids covertly snapping photos of varied people in public without their knowledge in order to make fun of them on the internet?

Imagine if there was a "shock app" available on their smart phones. You don't think they'd go absolutely balls to the walls shock happy just to have a "funny" youtube video to share?

And that's just the younger generation.

Now imagine some jaded and angry guy who was an electronics engineer in the 1970's with a full garage and electronics components dedicated to his little "pet project".

He's retired and upset at society. He has tons of free time. He makes a "device" and plays with the neighbors and random civilians he just has a profound distaste for because it helps him deal with stress and aggression. It gives him a sense of power in situations where he feels powerless and helps him blow off steam.

There are a number of scenarios where Electronic Harassment might play out along those lines....connect the dots if you feel so inclined. There are myriads of news stories of people doing horrible things to one another out there over random perceived slights every damned day.

You really think sadism always requires face to face interaction? Not every methodology is the same, and you have to admit "spooky action from a distance" is a heck of a lot smarter than face to face confrontation. Ask any script kiddy about that M.O. when it comes to SWATTING....and those are child perpetrators.

originally posted by: GENERAL EYES
Up close and personal?

You're equating teenage tomfoolery to implants and voice to skull technology?

It's obvious that people can be mean and some people are targets of these peoples actions but most of the TI claims that I have come across are miles above schoolyard bullying or disgruntled neighbors.

a reply to: daskakik

I'm going to assume you completely skipped over the example of the older, wiser and more jaded electronics engineer.

Human aggression is not unique to the schoolyard.

I've lived in several neighborhoods over the years where such is a daily sideshow.

Direct and indirect violence crosses over to almost every element of society regardless of age, race, or socioeconomic status.

Some people out there just have better skill sets and tech to play with.

a reply to: GENERAL EYES

I'm going to assume that you skipped over the part about people claiming to be targeted by the gov, with groups of people carrying out the harassment.

I'm sure some neighbors can get pretty agressive with each other but there is nothing sinister in that. Just people being people.

ETA: And the OP must have Wilhelm Reich harassing him, since "they" are even using cloud formations.

a reply to: daskakik

I'm not speaking as the mouthpiece for all Targeted Individuals.

I'm also not the all knowing voice of reason for all schizophrenics either.

I'm speaking from my own direct knowledge base.

I'm sorry you are having trouble distinguishing fact from fiction.

Maybe you should see a psychologist?

originally posted by: GENERAL EYES
I'm not speaking as the mouthpiece for all Targeted Individuals.

That's good to know.

I'm speaking from my own direct knowledge base.

Maybe you should try to understand that there are loose, yet established descriptions of what TI/Harassment/Gangstalking are.

I'm sorry you are having trouble distinguishing fact from fiction.

Maybe you should see a psychologist?

Don't see how you got that from anything that I have posted.

a reply to: daskakik

Without devolving into a back and forth insult fest...maybe it would interest you to know that my primary reason for becoming a member of ATS all those years ago was because of this topic in particular.

I'm not claiming I haven't had my one offs and fun with other topics, but I have a heavily invested interest in this subject matter. Feel free to troll my comment history to see the progression of my personal timeline on the subject. I haven't been running around in blind circles during my time here....I've made progress.

I am not claiming to be the defact-o authority on every proclaimed case and manifestation out there, I'm just trying to throw out scenarios that MAY possibly exist in order to shed some light on the issue beyond just poking fun at the mentally ill by reinforcing their claims of "proof" aren't "PROOF ENOUGH" and further pushing an individual suffering from this type of phenomenon further down the obsessive rabbit hole of trying to appease casual internet commentators.

I like to think of it as "stepping up the game" beyond the type of drivel we can read on other websites.

It's easy to sit back and back and forth "nuh-uh" and "yuh-huhs" to the end of days, but if (god forbid) you ever found yourself experiencing these types of things directly, you'd understand why those of us who have direct experience with these matters get a little miffed and excitable when our attempts to stay in focused peer discussion get suddenly sidelined by every well meaning internet psychologist and "proof critic" out there.

The aforementioned type of back and forth gets old and doesn't advance the study or case report examples to any constructive end.

originally posted by: GENERAL EYES
I'm just trying to throw out scenarios that MAY possibly exist in order to shed some light on the issue beyond just poking fun at the mentally ill by reinforcing their claims of "proof" aren't "PROOF ENOUGH" and further pushing an individual suffering from this type of phenomenon further down the obsessive rabbit hole of trying to appease casual internet commentators.

It isn't that they are not "proof enough" they are not "proof at all" and it isn't said to poke fun.

It's easy to sit back and back and forth "nuh-uh" and "yuh-huhs" to the end of days, but if (god forbid) you ever found yourself experiencing these types of things directly, you'd understand why those of us who have direct experience with these matters get a little miffed and excitable when our attempts to stay in focused peer discussion get suddenly sidelined by every well meaning internet psychologist and "proof critic" out there.

The old "god forbid you ever found yourself in our shoes" bit.

Seriously. It gets old and doesn't advance the study and case report examples to any constructive end.

When you have nothing, you have nothing. Accepting any and all claims as valid isn't going to advance things.

Lumping in average every day aggression with claims of orchestrated systematic harassment/torture is also counterproductive.

a reply to: daskakik

Let's agree to disagree in our systematic methodologies.

The reason the severely mentally ill in professional environments are isolated in day treatment centers while they work through their various manifestations is to prevent them from being overburdened with casual curiousity seekers badgering them with questions that have a potential of making their respective conditions worse.

Our local center is a closed ward to everyone barring compassionate family members....granted, this is the internet and an open forum for these situations so the rules don't apply here.

I'm just amazed at how many people who flock to these discussions fail to understand (or else just don't care) about how their interactions with TI claimants usually just devolves into yet another form of harassment.

You'd think the "sane" would be a little more insightful on the cause-and-effect matrix they develop online....sadly, in more than one casual instance and to no benefit for the distressed, the stronger Ego tends to take over and everyone just "has to be right" according to their personal paradigms.

Please don't think I'm attacking you personally - these are more just generalizations of the overall patterns.

Personally, I welcome the engagement from your end - after all, balance is imperative and blind adherence to a one sided perspective is never good in the long run.

The main problem I've noticed in the majority of "proofs" is that the individual doesn't have the level of technologies needed to effectively triangulate broadcast sources. A lot of this could be due to lack of training in those tactics, lack of funding, lack of available resources and the fact that chronic sufferers (real or imagined) tend to be housebound or self-isolating because of their harassment symptoms....all these factors combine for a cocktail of being unable to "go out and get the goods".

Such a person trapped by said circumstances would also would make a tempting target for a perpetrator because their target is unable to defend themselves and has trouble maintaining an effective and supportive social base with which to share their findings.

From a Criminal Psych perspective -all these factors add up in favor of the aggressive and/or sociopathic perpetrator.

Just sayin'....you are, of course, free to pick and choose your conclusions...and so are those claiming harassment.

a reply to: daskakik

Hello,

Do you think, then, that there is nothing to any of this but schizophrenia and "sickness"?

I ask because I see all of this stuff as occuring on a spectrum of human experience that involves human beings, their brains, technology and history, which is to say that I see far from "nothing".

Do you know the story of Paul Bennewitz? He was systematically driven quite mad.

Driving Mr. Bennewitz Insane

originally posted by: GENERAL EYES
Let's agree to disagree in our systematic methodologies.

I can agree that we seem to be talking about different things.

I'm just amazed at how many people who flock to these discussions fail to understand (or else just don't care) about how their interactions with TI claimants usually just devolves into yet another form of harassment.

Unfortunate but that still doesn't make their claims true. It just proves that their situation is selfmade.

The main problem I've noticed in the majority of "proofs" is that the individual doesn't have the level of technologies needed to effectively triangulate broadcast sources. A lot of this could be due to lack of training in those tactics, lack of funding, lack of available resources and the fact that chronic sufferers (real or imagined) tend to be housebound or self-isolating because of their harassment symptoms....all these factors combine for a cocktail of being unable to "go out and get the goods".

Which is why I said that, in the absense of proof, a logical reason why the harassment is taking place would be a good start.

You may have given a couple possibilities but those can't be applied to any particular case. They are just "what ifs".

a reply to: daskakik

Fair enough.

I take it the wealth of personal accounts and troves of systems technologies proving these are actual harassment weapons doesn't factor into your assessment?

Is this just because you don't want to believe human beings can be cruel enough to test such tech on the weaker and (for many) "undesirable" members of the populace? IF so, I can safely assume that you are most likely the exclusive product of the middle class or higher with respect to upbringing and education.

Not trying to get personal or combative here - you have to understand these are very common sociological perspectives.

That being said,

Please don't make me invoke Godwin.
That would just be embarrassing for all involved.

i just met with a few of my health care team members. I mentioned im having discussions here about my experiences.
i know for those of you who need evidence, i didnt record my conversations. But i asked them, "remember my cloud pictures? did you see my celtic name, they said "yes"

I asked "do you remember my videos with the voice saying my name, they said "i couldnt make out your name, but i heard a voice saying something".

So fine, i clearly hear my name in both videos, but others hear a voice thats unintelligeble.
but ive had some people confirm my name being said could be heard.

originally posted by: Bybyots
Do you think, then, that there is nothing to any of this but schizophrenia and "sickness"?

In the case of the OP, I'd say probably.

Do you know the story of Paul Bennewitz? He was systematically driven quite mad.

No, I don't know that story, but if true, I'm sure there was a good reason.

originally posted by: GENERAL EYES
I take it the wealth of personal accounts and troves of systems technologies proving these are actual harassment weapons doesn't factor into your assessment?

Sure they do but I always ask, why use them in this particular case?

Is this just because you don't want to believe human beings can be cruel enough to test such tech on the weaker and (for many) "undesirable" members of the populace? IF so, I can safely assume that you are most likely the exclusive product of the middle class or higher with respect to upbringing and education.

Sorry to disappoint but no.

ETA: Also, the argument that they are testing the tech on the general public is a weak attempt to dismiss the need for a reason why a person in particular was selected.

a reply to: daskakik

In the case of the OP, I'd say probably.

Alright, thanks for your response. I don't. I see this person as an individual that finds him/herself at a point located on that broad spectrum that I was mentioning. So it's difficult for me to imagine him/her as standing alone and definable in such black & white terms.

No, I don't know that story, but if true, I'm sure there was a good reason.

Okay, good enough. Have a nice day, then.

originally posted by: Bybyots
Alright, thanks for your response. I don't. I see this person as an individual that finds him/herself at a point located on that broad spectrum that I was mentioning. So it's difficult for me to imagine him/her as standing alone and definable in such black & white terms.

I'm not sure what you mean by broad spectrum but the OP said that electronic harassment weapons/equipment are being used against him. That is black or white, they either are or they are not.

reply to Daskakik

>I'm not sure what you mean by broad spectrum but the OP said that electronic harassment weapons/equipment are
>being used against him. That is black or white, they either are or they are not.
>edit on 19-2-2015 by daskakik because: (no reason given)

I'm not sure what you mean by broad spectrum but the OP said that electronic harassment weapons/equipment are being used against him. That is black or white, they either are or they are not.

Agreed it is, but perhaps hard to prove to someone who is not experiencing it. That does not mean it is not happening, even though it is hard to explain why anyone would do it. I have experienced heaps of EM attacks of a wide variety. Some are subtle, just a constant unnatural buzz others dramatic like a sudden fierce zapping for a few seconds and then find myself on the floor not able to get up for 20 minutes.

Being targeted in this and many other associated ways can easily drive a person insane and some who have been should get professional help so as to not do anything anti-social. The important thing for a TI is to stay in touch with reality and behave sensibly. I know many now and most are trying to do that. The ones to really worry about are those that are not in communication with others in forums. Sitting online with others helps despite the frequent Trolls with denial agendas.

We can only theorize as to why this is happening. Covert fascism within intelligence agencies since WW2 (Operation Paperclip) experimenting on ways to control all in the population who might be a problem is what seems most likely to me. Not the government as a whole, but being tolerated, or maybe too powerful to do anything about.

a reply to: Jed Stuart

You are just repeating the same old excuses. The answer is simple, stop saying you have proof.

The article you posted made note of the profiling that takes place when targeting someone.

Occam razor and the path of least resistance say that if you are a problem, it would be much easier to kill you than to EM shock you for decades.

Control of the population? Have you looked around this place? They already control everything.