Dead Teen Comes BACK TO LIFE as Mom Prays.

a reply to: Eunuchorn

my point is that several groups exist simply to pray for children with no belief in god and are sick.

it would be a very rare event for a person to be around a group of people and not have at least one praying they get well and even if that happened word spreads fast these days and prayers are on the ready. God is everywhere and in the end it is a battle of will against your spirit. You know this as most can hear there spirit cry out to them saying this sucks>

a reply to: deadeyedick

Yes, I agree with you on that point.

Jesus, and the Bible talks about the battle between flesh and spirit. You make the leap to asserting that means people in near death situations sometimes choose to die. Unless I misunderstood your point? In which case my apologies. Perhaps you could reiterate.

I can use scripture to show that isn't Satan, and also history.

But as this isn't the topic of the thread I don't want to do that.

I've been thinking about making a thread about it, in which case you are more than welcome to participate.

a reply to: deadeyedick

lolol!! *gasps to get breath from laughing*

Okay, dick. Aherm....
*forces lips into serious mode*
"cats have nine lives." Okay - it would appear so from my experience. So

Let's go with that....

HUMANS have THOUSANDS of lives!

a reply to: TechUnique

Fine... let's provisionally accept that "God" created everything. He/she/it put into motion the laws of the universe, and nothing is up to chance.

With that as a starting point, why does he/she/it have a need to intervene? It's one or the other... god either created everything, pressed the "start" button and has never had an influence again (making devotion to it a self-serving mechanism)... or it makes it up as it goes along, which is contradictory to a "grand plan".

The thing is you don't know.

You might believe 100% (though I would doubt even that... if we look really deep, there is likely a kernel of doubt in there somewhere, which is where your need to proselytize comes from)... but belief does not necessarily equal knowledge or truth.

a reply to: WakeUpBeer

It gets way complicated from there. We have a reason for being here. It is too suffer and when that is done death is the door but you do not want to leave unless you know you have fullfilled your duty. Most spirits never wanted to be here in the first place but often we get caught up in life and have forgotton what it is like where we left.

a reply to: deadeyedick

At this point I'm not sure what to say.

Since I'm not sure what your version of God or the afterlife is,

Or the.. beforelife?

At any rate, as deep and poetic as your last post was it still didn't answer the question which initially started this little conversation.

Well, I guess it did.

God believes in assisted suicide.

Edit:

It still didn't answer why the only people God saves (at least as far as medical things go) are the ones already in the hands of the doctor.

a reply to: deadeyedick

Where do you get this stuff from???

The purpose of life is to suffer?... and most "spirits" don't want to be here?

What a dismal mindset to experience life through...

a reply to: deadeyedick

Most spirits never wanted to be here in the first place but often we get caught up in life and have forgotton what it is like where we left.

Spirits/souls come here because they need some more schooling. Whether or not they were 'here' on Earth before doesn't matter. "We" bits of God keep going round and round on the carousel of life and death until we get it - that we are ALL connected.

Yes, we get caught up in life - because this is our school.
Yes - we have forgotten what it is like, because that's the whole thing. If we remember, then we don't have to come back anymore. We can CHOOSE to come back, to help.

But - until we are ready for that choice, we have to come back over and over (only nine lives?! SCORE! Well-done! It took John Doe 4,721 tries!) until we get it right. But deep down, in our deepest souls, we KNOW that we still have things to learn. When we have graduated from serial lifetimes, we get to rest with the Source.

"It had been raining for days and days, and a terrible flood had come over the land. The waters rose so high that one man was forced to climb onto the roof of his house. As the waters rose higher and higher, a man in a rowboat appeared, and told him to get in. "No," replied the man on the roof. "I have faith in the Lord the Lord will save me." So the man in the rowboat went away. The man on the roof prayed for God to save him. The waters rose higher and higher, and suddenly a speedboat appeared. "Climb in!" shouted a man in the boat. "No," replied the man on the roof. "I have faith in the Lord the Lord will save me." So the man in the speedboat went away. The man on the roof prayed for God to save him. The waters continued to rise. A helicopter appeared and over the loudspeaker, the pilot announced he would lower a rope to the man on the roof. "No," replied the man on the roof. "I have faith in the Lord the Lord will save me." So the helicopter went away. The man on the roof prayed for God to save him. The waters rose higher and higher, and eventually they rose so high that the man on the roof was washed away, and alas, the poor man drowned. Upon arriving in heaven, the man marched straight over to God. "Heavenly Father," he said, "I had faith in you, I prayed to you to save me, and yet you did nothing. Why?" God gave him a puzzled look, and replied "I sent you two boats and a helicopter, what more did you expect?

The Big Flood

a reply to: TechUnique

Yeah, that's a good one. One of my favorites.


And -
your point?

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

originally posted by: TechUnique

"It had been raining for days and days, and a terrible flood had come over the land. The waters rose so high that one man was forced to climb onto the roof of his house. As the waters rose higher and higher, a man in a rowboat appeared, and told him to get in. "No," replied the man on the roof. "I have faith in the Lord the Lord will save me." So the man in the rowboat went away. The man on the roof prayed for God to save him. The waters rose higher and higher, and suddenly a speedboat appeared. "Climb in!" shouted a man in the boat. "No," replied the man on the roof. "I have faith in the Lord the Lord will save me." So the man in the speedboat went away. The man on the roof prayed for God to save him. The waters continued to rise. A helicopter appeared and over the loudspeaker, the pilot announced he would lower a rope to the man on the roof. "No," replied the man on the roof. "I have faith in the Lord the Lord will save me." So the helicopter went away. The man on the roof prayed for God to save him. The waters rose higher and higher, and eventually they rose so high that the man on the roof was washed away, and alas, the poor man drowned. Upon arriving in heaven, the man marched straight over to God. "Heavenly Father," he said, "I had faith in you, I prayed to you to save me, and yet you did nothing. Why?" God gave him a puzzled look, and replied "I sent you two boats and a helicopter, what more did you expect?

The Big Flood

In other words, God sent doctors and medicine to help and save people. The people ignoring and waiting for a miracle to save their children were idiots and not a true example of what it means to be Christian. Stopping your kids from receiving medical care that is proven to treat whatever specific condition is stupid.

They sound like a cult more than anything.

a reply to: WakeUpBeer

It still didn't answer why the only people God saves are the ones already in the hands of the doctor

that is statistically not true.

I have saved a few in my day and the closest i have come to being a doc is listening to dr. feelgood by motley crew.

where was the doc during all those near death exp. you had? I know where God was and most of the time you did not get a scratch on you then you write it off as a close call just so you could live to come here and talk to me. i am glad you made it here.

originally posted by: TechUnique

"It had been raining for days and days, and a terrible flood had come over the land. The waters rose so high that one man was forced to climb onto the roof of his house. As the waters rose higher and higher, a man in a rowboat appeared, and told him to get in. "No," replied the man on the roof. "I have faith in the Lord the Lord will save me." So the man in the rowboat went away. The man on the roof prayed for God to save him. The waters rose higher and higher, and suddenly a speedboat appeared. "Climb in!" shouted a man in the boat. "No," replied the man on the roof. "I have faith in the Lord the Lord will save me." So the man in the speedboat went away. The man on the roof prayed for God to save him. The waters continued to rise. A helicopter appeared and over the loudspeaker, the pilot announced he would lower a rope to the man on the roof. "No," replied the man on the roof. "I have faith in the Lord the Lord will save me." So the helicopter went away. The man on the roof prayed for God to save him. The waters rose higher and higher, and eventually they rose so high that the man on the roof was washed away, and alas, the poor man drowned. Upon arriving in heaven, the man marched straight over to God. "Heavenly Father," he said, "I had faith in you, I prayed to you to save me, and yet you did nothing. Why?" God gave him a puzzled look, and replied "I sent you two boats and a helicopter, what more did you expect?

The Big Flood

well done case closed.

a reply to: TechUnique

All right then. We are agreed on that point.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: TechUnique

All right then. We are agreed on that point.

But it also shows that God works through things people take for granted. Just because something doesn't come out of the clouds gloriously, and with trumpets sounding, doesn't mean that it's not from God.

Just because we can explain something with Science does not mean that God has nothing to do with it.

This is the main point I am trying to make.

a reply to: TechUnique

And I agree with you. What I disagree with is the notion that this particular thing happened ONLY because the mother was praying.
That without her having prayed, it would not have happened.
Saying it is impossible for it to have happened without someone praying is what I take issue with.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: TechUnique

And I agree with you. What I disagree with is the notion that this particular thing happened ONLY because the mother was praying.
That without her having prayed, it would not have happened.
Saying it is impossible for it to have happened without someone praying is what I take issue with.

Ohhhh.. well then I think there has been a misunderstanding somewhere along the lines. Glad we got that cleared up.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs

The more i learn the more i do not like knowing.

I no longer share the view that we are here to learn but to realize that it will never be enough.

a reply to: deadeyedick

The only near death occurrence in my life was appendicitis. The sucker exploded and my folks thought I just had a bad case of the flu. When I didn't recover they took me to the doctor where I was immediately sent to the ER and hooked up to IVs and all that fun stuff. I attribute my direct recovery to the doctors. At the time, I was a Christian. So I can say that my faith and belief in God comforted me and helped me through it. That is not the same thing as God being responsible for saving my life though.

It is just your opinion that God is responsible for every good thing.

I disagree obviously and see that as nothing but confirmation bias.

I am very interested in your stories about saving people however.

Saved them from what exactly? What were their conditions etc?

a reply to: deadeyedick

Don't have any response for that.
Sorry you are suffering?

You can CHOOSE to suffer - or you can choose to take what comes, endure it, let it wash over you, and keep going, recognizing that suffering is PART of life.

No amount of 'faith' in some unproven idea ("God", "Jesus") can take that away, any more than if you simply meditate. Learn the way of Zen. Bad things will happen. We all suffer. But we don't suffer ALL OF THE TIME.
The trick is to be mindful of what you are enduring at the moment, and realizing that in the next moment, this moment will have disappeared. The only moment we have is RIGHT NOW.