David Marrow - The Monarch Project - MKULTRA

I've noticed a pattern on ATS where everyone is all about debunking things until these type of threads come up then all you hear are crickets. I find it very peculiar. I mean where are they? It's not like threads in The Gray Area haven't been flooded with debunkers before, so why is it these threads are so quiet? And Springer, if you could enlighten me as to why the GOP logo was changed I'm all EARS. It's also important to know, though slightly off topic, that In-Q-Tel bankrolled both Google and Facebook, In-Q-Tel is a CIA front investment firm.

originally posted by: Flesh699
I've noticed a pattern on ATS where everyone is all about debunking things until these type of threads come up then all you hear are crickets. I find it very peculiar. I mean where are they?

Yes I know, its very strange.
I would have thought debunkers would be all over this at least.
I can understand them not getting involved with the paedophilia aspect, thats getting to the point of undeniable.
But this, I thought they would be on it like flies to the proverbial.

originally posted by: Flesh699
I've noticed a pattern on ATS where everyone is all about debunking things until these type of threads come up then all you hear are crickets. I find it very peculiar. I mean where are they?

This question provoked me to think- because I see this subject come up often, and my own reactions are ambivalent.

On one hand, I find the subject interesting- it doesn’t seem so far fetched to me. I almost would be surprised if research into these things like mind control didn’t happen!
Yet, I don’t ever go into trying to read more or find out what is being said on it.
Today, I asked myself- why? Why does it make me slightly uncomfortable?

Partly because I found out both of my grandfathers were involved in some sort of experimentation and research by the US military, in Los Alamos. I know nothing else about it.

Because my mother had strange experiences while young.
Because my own life is filled with some strange experiences I am not sure what to make out of (though nothing like what this guy in the OP describes- he just sounds mentally ill).

Because I had a period of “awakening” which was fraught with weird dreams, in which I was calling myself a “butterfly” and trying to keep that a secret, and not let others know, and one in which I was given a key, and put on a robe, with the idea that I was to start a “mission”, in which others too would be involved in (though I do not know, consciously what that was).

And because I have repeatedly had the experience of people I had interacted with on all parts of the globe have dreams in which they saw me, had meetings with me, in which I explained things to them, and in three cases, showed them a tree. Two of those people described what I look like, and it was accurate- except they had never seen a picture of me (this was before Facebook). I have no memory of doing any such thing, or dreaming of doing such a thing, so tend to write it off as their own “stuff”.

But I think I am afraid that this hypothesis would be too attractive an explanation, for these things that I have chosen to just shrug off and not think about. I could probably easily become convinced that I was used in some sort of experimentation of that sort.
Memory is a strange thing, and we can deform it to conform to our ideas of reality through suggestion.

Like I recently heard in some lecture, experiments have shown that if you photoshop the photo of someone when they were little, riding in a hot air balloon, and have some relative claim they had a balloon ride at that age, they will eventually describe their memory of having done so- even if it never happened.

This subject focuses on false memories, and at the same time, I am afraid it could be a provoker of false memories, so want to stay away from it!

a reply to: Bluesma

It's like we are stranded on an island surrounded by a sea of craziness. Your butterfly reference is crazy. Be careful out there man.

originally posted by: Bluesma

originally posted by: Flesh699
I've noticed a pattern on ATS where everyone is all about debunking things until these type of threads come up then all you hear are crickets. I find it very peculiar. I mean where are they?

This question provoked me to think- because I see this subject come up often, and my own reactions are ambivalent.

On one hand, I find the subject interesting- it doesn’t seem so far fetched to me. I almost would be surprised if research into these things like mind control didn’t happen!
Yet, I don’t ever go into trying to read more or find out what is being said on it.
Today, I asked myself- why? Why does it make me slightly uncomfortable?

Partly because I found out both of my grandfathers were involved in some sort of experimentation and research by the US military, in Los Alamos. I know nothing else about it.

Because my mother had strange experiences while young.
Because my own life is filled with some strange experiences I am not sure what to make out of (though nothing like what this guy in the OP describes- he just sounds mentally ill).

Because I had a period of “awakening” which was fraught with weird dreams, in which I was calling myself a “butterfly” and trying to keep that a secret, and not let others know, and one in which I was given a key, and put on a robe, with the idea that I was to start a “mission”, in which others too would be involved in (though I do not know, consciously what that was).

And because I have repeatedly had the experience of people I had interacted with on all parts of the globe have dreams in which they saw me, had meetings with me, in which I explained things to them, and in three cases, showed them a tree. Two of those people described what I look like, and it was accurate- except they had never seen a picture of me (this was before Facebook). I have no memory of doing any such thing, or dreaming of doing such a thing, so tend to write it off as their own “stuff”.

But I think I am afraid that this hypothesis would be too attractive an explanation, for these things that I have chosen to just shrug off and not think about. I could probably easily become convinced that I was used in some sort of experimentation of that sort.
Memory is a strange thing, and we can deform it to conform to our ideas of reality through suggestion.

Like I recently heard in some lecture, experiments have shown that if you photoshop the photo of someone when they were little, riding in a hot air balloon, and have some relative claim they had a balloon ride at that age, they will eventually describe their memory of having done so- even if it never happened.

This subject focuses on false memories, and at the same time, I am afraid it could be a provoker of false memories, so want to stay away from it!

In my own research into this subject all I can recommend to someone that suspects they maybe an MK-ULTRA type survivor, dont pursue hypnosis, and if possible try to keep the memories locked away. These memories could mess up anybody and uncover a whole world of hurt.

I personally am coming to the conclusion that many people that actually have suffered have been manipulated and used by "Black Witches"(their belief system, not mine) and intelligence agencies(using magic aka deception and slight of hand) as a form of counter intelligence and disinformation to cover up for the satanism aspect.

I think people like Miles Johnston and "the Swerdlows" are disinformation agents, and possible(I think highly likely, its just a view) controllers and re-programmers of MK ULTRA victims if they should ever start remembering.
The stories of all of the "victims" I have seen so far pushed by the aforementioned likely lads have many similarities, suggesting a highly organised effort like a psy-op campaign to put satanism into the same "ridiculous" pigeonhole as many of their "crazy" claims.

One common trend I have found is an extreme right wing agenda. Of 4th Reich aliens(the nordics aka the aryans) vs the Zionist aliens(the reptilians aka the jews), in an age old battle of the alien races that continues to this very day.
Another trend seems to be many are in the "psychic" community, which brings everything into question knowing that that trade is full of snake oil salesmen.

My summary is starting to pan out that I think some of these highly damaged and highly suggestive people are being used to push the "New Age Agenda" while making any theories like elite paedophiles and satanic cults appear ridiculous. And should not be trusted at all.
If you do start to remember things and need to see a therapist, be sure NOT to get involved with ANY abuse specialist hypnotherapist, and make sure you have a witness you can trust to sit in to make sure nothing untowards takes place.

I still believe MKULTRA to be true, just the work of Ewan Cameron alone is enough to prove that to me.

This is my current honest opinion.
I know satanic ritual abuse is true, there are many court cases, I know that not all satanists are murderers or child rapists, like not all muslims are terrorists, but some of them are seriously messed up. And some of them are making our laws.

I know these sick cults to exist, as in McMartin Preschool, the kids didnt make up their STD's, and the tunnels that were denied turned out to be there too.
When I was a teenager, we lived near a jewish cemetery, satanic cults would hold rituals in that cemetery. Animal remains and pentagrams were found on numerous occasions and it ended up in the local papers.

originally posted by: elementalgrove
So to add to this list, here is Brice Taylor being introduced by Ted Gunderson, Gunderson is a former FBI chief who spent the last 30 years of his life trying to expose the dirty deeds of MK Ultra and child satanic ritual abuse.

To add some more to the list, I was poking around this situation some time ago and came to the conclusion that Gunderson was hinkey. Now, I entered that rabbit hole just a bit, and decided that it was still a pretty scary place and backed out carefully. But I will say that there is at least as much disinfo being scattered as in the UFO field. Any serious inquiry requires a great deal of caution...I'd go so far as to say it's dangerous.

Cathy O'Brian cannot be trusted and i'm not too sure about Mark Phillips either. For those that know of the reality of the reptilians watch the video of Cathy O'Brian speaking in the church along with Mark Phillips and Roseanne Bar.

a reply to: JohnnyCanuck

Could you elaborate as to what you found out about Gunderson that helped you come to that conclusion?

It is a rabbit hole they know most will stay out of, do you doubt that they would be capable of using mind control for the purposes these victims have claimed?

a reply to: OneManArmy
Thank you for starting this thread.

I have no doubt this evil exists. Personal experience.

I am going through the videos posted that I haven't seen.

I will add to it when I can.
S&F
ETA: This case I always suspected mind control, I have never seen a satisfactory explanation for the truly bizarre behavior.
If you have never seen this you MUST watch. Madness in the fast lane

If you are unfamiliar with this case, this link has the full story and some of the theories connected to it.
disinfo.com...
Truly bizarre.

originally posted by: elementalgrove
a reply to: JohnnyCanuck
Could you elaborate as to what you found out about Gunderson that helped you come to that conclusion?
It is a rabbit hole they know most will stay out of, do you doubt that they would be capable of using mind control for the purposes these victims have claimed?

Just off the top of my head, it had to do with some contradictory evidence, along with the company he keeps. It's a matter of getting to know who the players are, and standing back enough to see the patterns that develop.

a reply to: JohnnyCanuck

I suppose it is difficult to know the truth in the se matters, however I went to this thread that was referenced above

Good old ATS

and this information in particular, sort of validates what alot of these victims are stating.

Straight from the horses mouth!

Hey guys I came to a conclusion months ago no one has seemed to connect. Does anyone remember John Todd? This guy: en.wikipedia.org...
I found a document on ATS written by a preacher or preachers where they were investigating John's claims, but one thing stood out and was witnessed by a preacher with a group of church people: John Todd was shot at outside of a church after he 'lectured.'
Now what I'm getting at is that I think John Todd was a CIA asset to instill fear into the Church Community and get them all wrapped into thinking everything is the devil and magic is real. I'm really good at reading people, and the way John could instantly give information to any question asked spoke, to me, volumes. But to me what he was trying to do, if my theory is correct, was to lead the Church People off the Mind Control scent. . . and it seemed to work very well.

If anyone is interested in seeing what I'm talking regarding the way he could answer questions so fluently, go here: www.youtube.com...

Also Madness in the fast lane is one of the creepiest things I've ever seen, it's creeping me right out just thinking about it -- think I need to go pet a cat or something.

For later

Very interesting how he suggests the satanic symbolism seems to be psychological, rather than practical... do they throw that in to expedite dissociation, or to make telling the story sound absurd? Perhaps both?

originally posted by: dreamingawake
The Mantauk project's mind control is more sweeping than MKUltra. Been looking more into, Al Bielek's Montauk Project information-such as the video below. He claims 9/10 Americans have been affected by this(during it's active time-to the 90s).

Three hour long vid: description as explained is the most in-depth compilation of interviews with survivors of the Montauk project to date(Philadelphia experiment included too).

Oh yeah Al's in da house!

You know what time it is!

MK ULTRA TIME!

Seriously Al Bielek's stories are hard to top, best out there on MK Ultra by far.

There are some mars guys saying they time traveled too but still Al Bielek is da man!

originally posted by: stosh64
a reply to: OneManArmy
Thank you for starting this thread.

I have no doubt this evil exists. Personal experience.

I am going through the videos posted that I haven't seen.

I will add to it when I can.
S&F
ETA: This case I always suspected mind control, I have never seen a satisfactory explanation for the truly bizarre behavior.
If you have never seen this you MUST watch. Madness in the fast lane

If you are unfamiliar with this case, this link has the full story and some of the theories connected to it.
disinfo.com...
Truly bizarre.

Thank you for posting that video, I watched it for the second time about 2 days ago and was seriously considering posting it myself.
That case is so fantastical and just nuts, I mean to get run over by an articulated lorry and then be running away punching coppers just a few minutes later, is unbelievable. I just cannot understand why they let her go, only to go and murder a poor guy the very next day. 4 f**king psychiatrists assessed her, which supports my belief that psychiatrists are not worth #. Sorry for the bad language, but it beggars belief.

originally posted by: Ridhya
Very interesting how he suggests the satanic symbolism seems to be psychological, rather than practical... do they throw that in to expedite dissociation, or to make telling the story sound absurd? Perhaps both?

Interesting point, Im coming to believe that all "Magic" is simply mind control.
It is manipulating others to believe what you want them to, through trickery and deception.

Im not sure if the satanic aspects are part of an obfuscation of the reality of elite child pornography rings, there are certainly court cases in which inter generation child abuse including satanic aspects does exist. As do the sexually transmitted diseases of the child victims.

Whats thrown the whole satanism thing up in the air for me is the fact that during the "satanism scare" of the 90's, both organized paedophile rings and satanic cults were investigated, and they claimed there was no evidence for either.
With the truth of elite paedophile rings becoming plain to see, it begs the question, so what of the satanism?

Im going to go through some court cases to find interesting tidbits, I might even do a thread on it, depending on what I dig up. Many times though the satanic aspects are left out of the public record deliberately. Just the same way the paedophile ring aspects were kept out of the Franklin scandal. But the $1 million payout to Paul Bonacci from Larry King shows us the truth of all of that.

I listened to the interview with Al Bielek last night, and researched a bit- his story is hard to swallow entirely. It seems pretty far fetched.
At the same time, there were some things that struck me deeply and troubled me. Made me not want to dive any deeper into that rabbit hole......

originally posted by: Bluesma
I listened to the interview with Al Bielek last night, and researched a bit- his story is hard to swallow entirely. It seems pretty far fetched.
At the same time, there were some things that struck me deeply and troubled me. Made me not want to dive any deeper into that rabbit hole......

I dont believe Al Bielek, he is sort of a pioneer in this field of "deception". Besides, I just dont believe time travel will ever exist. Hey I may be wrong, I know that much.

Trust no one, question everything.
If you are uncomfortable with this subject then do walk away, but always keep it in mind, it takes an organized effort of many to deal with the darkest parts of human society. Alone we have no power, in a group we can be unstoppable.
Im just a butterfly in Africa flapping its wings, hopefully a tornado will reach the west and not just a breeze. I wouldnt hold my breath though.

I found this on the twins, Ursula and Sabina Eriksson from Madness in The Fast Lane: disinfo.com...