Drugs - Prison or Treatment

I can cover this topic in so many ways but I think in the example I am providing really points to the importance of Treatment in the case of Drug Addiction:








Watch all of these and you can actually understand how spending Money on treatment instead of a "War" is much more meaningfull to a Persons life. Chris Herron was one of the best guards I have witnessed playing. Tarkanian also considered him like a Second Son. He was special, just like many others before him.

a reply to: hoochymama23

Chris Herron is a great example of the benefits of treatment programs over prison. The recidivism rates for relapses during and after imprisonment are astronomical compared to treatment. The entire "war on drugs" is a sham and a huge part of the for profit prison industry in the US. If someone is getting paid to keep people locked up there mid little incentive to give them the help and treatment they need which in many cases will save lives. No matter what though, nobody is going to get clean unless they want to and are personally ready to stop using. One of my best friends lost his battle with addiction this past November and he was in a court ordered outpatient program 5 days/ week with random piss tests.

I think another salient comparison regarding treatment vs jail would be European countries like
Portugal who have decriminalized nearly every illicit substance, have places where people can go to use be supervised by medical personnel, have access to clean needles and not have to worry about driving under the influence, ODing or getting arrested. They also have free access to treatment for those who want to get clean. A lot of people in the US avoid checking themselves into a detox or rehab because of the stigma attached to it.

Portugals recidivism rates for relapses or nearly nothing compared to the US, they have greatly reduced the transmission of hepatitis HIV and other blood born pathogens, cut down on overdoses prison populations are down. They treat is as a puic health issue as opposed to a stigmatized criminal issue and now people who aren't ready to quit yet are able to safely use and those who are ready have easy access to treatment and don't have to be afraid of the stigma attached to it following them around for years to come. Even Mexico has decriminalized small amounts of various substances for personal use.

The US could learn a thing or two from these countries and save a few bucks as well as not making people who have a legitimate disease felons who go away to college for criminals and when they get out the felony conviction makes getting a straight job rather difficult leaving them with few legitimate options aside from utilizing what they learned while locked up. It just created a cycle of perpetuity and does neither the individual nor society any good whatsoever.

a reply to: hoochymama23

If society were person centred then treatment would be widespread, for addiction and many other issues requiring rehab.

Unfortunately we live in a business, prison is most economically viable. I love the world!

In the case of marijuana, neither in almost all cases. Shouldn't be illegal, so mandated prison or treatment constitutes punishing something which doesn't need punishing (unless you give it to someone under 21, which crosses a line that society might now be rightfully setting).

We don't send people to prison or to treatment or rehab if they feel like having a beer now and then, I doubt we need to do that for weed either. Drug prohibition is a big thing because it takes an otherwise cheap commodity and puts a black market price on it. Guess who profits, the Opium Traders who made their fortunes a couple hundred years ago haven't likely given up the game but just taken it to the next levels.

Neither. Most people are not abusers. The system is.

Treatment. Police are not trained to deal with people who have severe (and even mild) mental health issues. Consider that the majority of people in prison are on a medication for a mental condition--and how high the recidivism rate is in many areas--not to mention the lack of funds and resources to train police to manage the mentally ill who are also criminals.

Therefore treatment must be a part of prison. Like rehab--to try to help you even if you never leave the prison. Because it's the right thing to do for nonviolent offenders. The violent ones can stay in prison. Reap what you sow. lol

a reply to: hoochymama23

Prison is the worst place to send a drug addict because they can get drugs whilst in there. It exists, apart from keeping murderers and genuine criminals away from society, as the example of how the police are doing and their number of arrests. Anyone visiting a prison will tell you over a period of time you will see the same faces popping up again and again because its easier to arrest an ex offender than a new criminal.

Prisons are run on such low budgets they even struggle apparently for printer ink cartridges and the courses that use to run to occupy prisoners have all been cut out. Ther eis precious little rehabilitation given because if there were, we wouldn't be seeing the regular reoffenders in there.

There is no rehabilitation for offenders due to the budget cuts so whatever the couch politicians think, they are sadly missing reality.

For marijauna- no penalties .. for all other drugs - execution as drug users are worthless destroying everyone and everything around them. .

I'll opt out of the whole paradigm. That's the only thing Nancy Reagan had right. Just say no. Do you think better on drugs or when you are straight? Do you alter your chemistry and become something else or do you want to be healthy? Call me a control freak. The bullgod died a long time ago for me. Who knows what damage was caused experimenting. I cannot add insult to injury by condoning it. I understand the topic but this is context. I choose to be free from mind and body altering drugs. I may not be able to get away from some but if I find out they are in something I buy, it's replaced.

There's enough people in life that you can watch and come to that conclusion. I think life is the best teacher. Do I really want to turn out like Mike down the street. Look at that sad guy living in a box with burns on his lips. Look, another story about steroid use and how it created roid rage. Chris Benoit comes to mind. Was that learning the hard way? I'll pass. I've seen lives destroyed up close and personal. It sticks with you. I was never one to pull punches or believe what a drug user has ever told me. It's always about chasing the high and everything else is just in the way. Prison isn't going to change the mindset. Preaching isn't either. You have to want to quit within yourself. You have to have a reason to do so. Your reason might have left you because you chose the wrong path one too many times. People do what they want because they wanted to. Go talk to a crack addict. They will tell you all the things you want to hear but are still going to chase that next high.

Drugs: War on the enablers, the hope stealers that prey on the weak, the merchant who peddles misery. Here's a video from Easy Rider.

I say none.


Let people decide with there own bodys.


I would however say rehab facilities should be open on a volentary basis.

a reply to: hoochymama23

I'm not going to watch all your videos, but I agree treatment is the way to go. End the War on Drugs. It is a huge failure and GIANT money sink.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Treatment has been around for a long time. The problem is getting worse. The war on drugs isn't the war I'd fight. I wouldn't have troops guarding poppy fields or let the # in the country. I would tool to that effect. I would bring the wrath of the whole US arsenal to make it so. I might even bring back napalm and have a cookout wherever it grows. Toleration isn't working anymore. The cash cow is creating civil unrest. Time to put it all down and get tough on it for real.

I know from the Iran-Contra era and prohibition that you'll say it won't work. Greed and choice. I'll kill both. The world would be better off. No need for a star. The only need I have is to get this # off the streets. You can chose something else that doesn't destroy yourself or your community. Make it a law if it'll make you feel better.

originally posted by: LOSTinAMERICA
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Treatment has been around for a long time. The problem is getting worse. The war on drugs isn't the war I'd fight. I wouldn't have troops guarding poppy fields or let the # in the country. I would tool to that effect. I would bring the wrath of the whole US arsenal to make it so. I might even bring back napalm and have a cookout wherever it grows. Toleration isn't working anymore. The cash cow is creating civil unrest. Time to put it all down and get tough on it for real.

Yea, that doesn't work. For one, it requires us to invade a foreign nation, and you are even suggesting using devices that are banned in the Geneva Conventions.

I know from the Iran-Contra era and prohibition that you'll say it won't work. Greed and choice. I'll kill both. The world would be better off. No need for a star. The only need I have is to get this # off the streets. You can chose something else that doesn't destroy yourself or your community. Make it a law if it'll make you feel better.

So let me get this straight. War, destruction and violence haven't worked to stop the usage of drugs (in fact drug usage is at an all time high) and as a response, you want to double down on the violence and destruction? What was the definition of crazy again? Then we have working examples like Portugal, where drug usage has dropped in HALF, that show that less violent methods (including treating the addicted like people instead of criminals) work MUCH better.

Don't worry, no stars will be forthcoming from me. You are still brainwashed by 1980's anti-drug propaganda.

treatment is useless if the person doesn't want to stop, sure they may go through the motions and pretend, but the want it is still there.

also many people replace one addiction with another that may not be as lethal, but fill the whole left from the other.

originally posted by: crazyewok
I say none.


Let people decide with there own bodys.


I would however say rehab facilities should be open on a volentary basis.

I agree. What a person puts in their body is no one else's business unless that person makes it someone else's business by telling them. Treatment should be offered to all, but not forced. Legalize it all, offer free treatment to anyone who wants it and let people choose for themselves.

We could take all the money we waste fighting drugs and put it to good use offering free treatment to those who actually want it.

First time you get caught you get to go to treatment free (at tax payers expense)
Second time you get caught you pay half of the treatment cost.if you can`t afford to pay half you go to jail.
Everytime after the second time that you get caught you pay for all your treatment, if you can`t afford it you go to jail.

The purpose should be to protect society so whether people are in jail or treatment they are off the streets and no longer a potential threat to society.

a reply to: hoochymama23

you can actually understand how spending Money on treatment instead of a "War" is much more meaningfull to a Persons life

That is common sense.

Unfortunately common sense from observing gov't actions also states , its not about helping the people its about the easiest way to increase profits for the Oligopolies influencing our laws who are also benefactors.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: LOSTinAMERICA
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Treatment has been around for a long time. The problem is getting worse. The war on drugs isn't the war I'd fight. I wouldn't have troops guarding poppy fields or let the # in the country. I would tool to that effect. I would bring the wrath of the whole US arsenal to make it so. I might even bring back napalm and have a cookout wherever it grows. Toleration isn't working anymore. The cash cow is creating civil unrest. Time to put it all down and get tough on it for real.

Yea, that doesn't work. For one, it requires us to invade a foreign nation, and you are even suggesting using devices that are banned in the Geneva Conventions.

I know from the Iran-Contra era and prohibition that you'll say it won't work. Greed and choice. I'll kill both. The world would be better off. No need for a star. The only need I have is to get this # off the streets. You can chose something else that doesn't destroy yourself or your community. Make it a law if it'll make you feel better.

So let me get this straight. War, destruction and violence haven't worked to stop the usage of drugs (in fact drug usage is at an all time high) and as a response, you want to double down on the violence and destruction? What was the definition of crazy again? Then we have working examples like Portugal, where drug usage has dropped in HALF, that show that less violent methods (including treating the addicted like people instead of criminals) work MUCH better.

Don't worry, no stars will be forthcoming from me. You are still brainwashed by 1980's anti-drug propaganda.

Yes, I'm for invading any nation peddling drugs into this nation. A piece of paper I'll wipe my ass on. I won't have my hands tied while you destroy my nation. That being said, our nation allows it. The money from it is the main reason. You infiltrate them and make it go away. Your way only creates more dope fiends and your house being broken into.

You think violence doesn't work because they are making money off the drug trade. The CIA has been caught with Cocaine. You know the helicopter crash a few years ago. Ollie North said as much. You think he steamrolled that whole thing? I'm not into turn a blind eye on evil and if that means wiping my ass on a piece of paper, so be it. You can watch the progression and you'll live it. I stand with my stance. Toughness is what this nation needs. It needs the balls to say it, It need the balls to do it.

The problem with going all-in one way or the other is the presumption that simply sending someone to treatment will make it work.

Treatment only works if the addict wants it to work, and sometimes not even then. Until the addict really wants to be treated, you can make them go to treatment until pigs fly and they'll just go right back to using again as soon as they can.

That is why they always say the first step to treatment is just admitting you HAVE a problem.

a reply to: ketsuko

You deal with the things you let go. If not now, soon.