The Supreme Court Says Unanimously Your Boss Can Make You Work For Free

If you're off the clock, you want to get out of there as quickly as possible.

I you're on the clock, you're not so much in a hurry.

How much would each employee cost the company by diddling around, yakking it up with other employees trying to get those few extra minutes of pay each day?

Well there sure seems to be two different camps here on ATS concerning this issue.....I appreciate everyone's participation. Having been on both sides...working at store level for hourly wages and working my way up to being a salary employee working behind the scenes for that same Co., I have seen first hand how quickly "management" loses their connection to the rank and file workers. One of the first training classes I was sent to made it very clear that your employees are NOT your friends and you should cease to socialize with anyone that you over see at work.

It gets pretty hard to stomach running around making 3 times what your employees do, enjoying very nice benefits and expensive "retreats and training seminars" all the while constantly busting your employees chops for not hitting their goals because they need to CUT Costs !! Unless you've worked in this environment it's hard to understand what BS it all is !!

Security searches have long been common at retail distribution centers. Chances are that when they arrived for a job interview they were searched on their way out. Why does it take upwards of 20 minutes? Sounds like a completely inefficient search pattern to me.

That being said, employees should NOT get paid just because they're on company property. They get paid for working. Not for suddenly deciding they have a problem with something they were aware of when they took the job weeks, months, or years ago.

If the searches were implemented a week who, different story. Given how successful Amazon is, I would bet those searches have been around quite a while (just like pretty much any other retailer with a DC)

a reply to: Shamrock6

Why does it take upwards of 20 minutes? Sounds like a completely inefficient search pattern to me.

There are 3 shifts at Amazon during the off season. During peak season (Christmas) there are 2 shifts. During the winter months, all the way to February, there are roughly 2000 people working at the Fernley warehouse. PER SHIFT.

20 minutes is actually pretty good.

Misleading title. They are not working for free as they are not "working". Still threadworthy, just a really bad title.

originally posted by: MountainLaurel

It gets pretty hard to stomach running around making 3 times what your employees do, enjoying very nice benefits and expensive "retreats and training seminars" all the while constantly busting your employees chops for not hitting their goals because they need to CUT Costs !! Unless you've worked in this environment it's hard to understand what BS it all is !!

Didn't you put your time in to be in position and educated (formal or not) to get that manager job?

You didn't just walk into it off the street.

Business is business --- it's about making a profit (yeah, took me a real lifetime to understand).

Your position is not guaranteed. There's always someone in the wings ready to take your place. Do you give up what you worked for to those who didn't? Just cuz you're a nice guy?

I've been following this litigation and I'm not surprised at the decision. The decision is WRONG but I'm not surprised by it.

The governing bit of law is the Portal-To-Portal Act of 1947. The circumstances of the Amazon case (to be more precise, the Integrity Staffing Solutions, Inc. v. Busk case) pretty much parallel the 1947 circumstances: Miners were forced to spend unpaid time in the company premises.

My personal belief is that if my employer requires me to be on-premesis then he should pay me for it. SCOTUS and Congress believe otherwise.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
Misleading title. They are not working for free as they are not "working". Still threadworthy, just a really bad title.

Then they are tresspassing on private property...and should be arrested...

Å99

a reply to: TinfoilTP

this argument makes no sense....they are on company property, in an official capacity as employees...they're not there visiting, they're not hanging out. they're still on duty, waiting to be dismissed....if the security check is mandatory, and is part of the job, they should be paid...

originally posted by: Annee
If you're off the clock, you wa1*-*0.
nt to get out of there as quickly as possible.

I you're on the clock, you're not so much in a hurry.

How much would each employee cost the company by diddling around, yakking it up with other employees trying to get those few extra minutes of pay each day?

Perhaps Annie...but then again how much time and money is wasted on executives yakking it up at expensive lunches and parties? It just seems unfair that the one's that always seem to have to sacrifice the most, make the least and have to put up with the most crap.

originally posted by: TinfoilTP
So they were working while standing in line?

Obviously you've never paid attention when driving through road construction.

originally posted by: MountainLaurel

originally posted by: Annee
If you're off the clock, you wa1*-*0.
nt to get out of there as quickly as possible.

I you're on the clock, you're not so much in a hurry.

How much would each employee cost the company by diddling around, yakking it up with other employees trying to get those few extra minutes of pay each day?

Perhaps Annie...but then again how much time and money is wasted on executives yakking it up at expensive lunches and parties? It just seems unfair that the one's that always seem to have to sacrifice the most, make the least and have to put up with the most crap.

...and if they weren't 'yakking it up', the company would have money to pay for a decent security system that doesn't imposte the employee...or employees could rock up to work 90 seconds late...shouldn't be a problem...

Å99

a reply to: MountainLaurel

This is where Amazon could learn a thing or two from coc aine cutting factories

Solution:
Nude employees - preferably female and good looking



25 minutes of your life back per working day

a reply to: UmbraSumus

but think of the occupational hazards.....wangs and/or boobs caught in machinery, cuts, torn off toenails, the crushing of feet.....

no, no....OSHA would have a fit...this just won't do...

originally posted by: MountainLaurel

originally posted by: Annee
If you're off the clock, you wa1*-*0.
nt to get out of there as quickly as possible.

I you're on the clock, you're not so much in a hurry.

How much would each employee cost the company by diddling around, yakking it up with other employees trying to get those few extra minutes of pay each day?

Perhaps Annie...but then again how much time and money is wasted on executives yakking it up at expensive lunches and parties? It just seems unfair that the one's that always seem to have to sacrifice the most, make the least and have to put up with the most crap.

True, but what did they have to do to get there?

I got promoted once because I hid my bosses mistress when she and the wife showed up 5 minutes apart. Wasn't a big promo, but got it for loyalty to the boss.

You do what you do. Took me years to understand the difference between personal integrity and work politics.

I see it as decisions you make. Get the education, don't pump out kids you can't afford, don't put yourself in a financial position where your job owns you.

Anyway, back to subject. No ones gonna rush to exit if they're being paid by the time they stand in line. That is not working, and it affects profit.

a reply to: Annee

I really do understand your point Annie, and yes I worked hard and have a college education. I will say that at the time I really did not completely understand what my new job would require in terms of an adjustment to my "humanity" and how quickly you can become indoctrinated into the whole "It's not Personal, it's Business" way of thinking. At the end of the day it wasn't for me and after 15 years I resigned.

a reply to: MountainLaurel

I took a similar route. Just because I understand it, doesn't mean it's right for me.

I'll take poor and happy if that's my only option. It's amazing what you can give up when you get your priorities straight. 😄

The dangerous thing about this ruling is that it doesn`t matter if your skilled or unskilled the ruling effects everyone.

Taken to extremes this ruling could mean that you work from the moment you clock in until the moment you clock out.
setting up to begin a job and cleaning up after the job can now be postponed until before and after you are off the clock when you`ll have to do it on YOUR time without pay.

Trade workers in particular could be affected by this ruling,for example if you are concrete worker the boss can make start pouring at 8 A.M. exactly and stop at 4 P.M. exactly cleaning up the equipment at the end of the day will now be done after 4 PM on YOUR time without pay,and of course you`ll need to get to work an hour early to set everything up on YOUR time without pay so that you`re ready to start pouring at 8 AM on the dot.

originally posted by: Tardacus
The dangerous thing about this ruling is that it doesn`t matter if your skilled or unskilled the ruling effects everyone.

Taken to extremes this ruling could mean that you work from the moment you clock in until the moment you clock out.
setting up to begin a job and cleaning up after the job can now be postponed until before and after you are off the clock when you`ll have to do it on YOUR time without pay.

No it can not. Cleaning up and setting up is work. Waiting in line to leave is not work. The ruling can not be used at all for that purpose.

Trade workers in particular could be affected by this ruling,for example if you are concrete worker the boss can make start pouring at 8 A.M. exactly and stop at 4 P.M. exactly cleaning up the equipment at the end of the day will now be done after 4 PM on YOUR time without pay,and of course you`ll need to get to work an hour early to set everything up on YOUR time without pay so that you`re ready to start pouring at 8 AM on the dot.

If you are cleaning up you are working. This ruling has nothing to do with what you are saying and it's simple fearmongering based on limited understanding.

The ruling is saying you can NOT make someone do work, and waiting in line to leave is not considered work.

a reply to: MountainLaurel

I agree. The court got this ruling wrong. If security searches are mandatory then its integral to the job. Sorry but time is money, and the court is ruling that workers time has no value. So a corollary ruling must be then the security searches can't be mandatory. AND any termination resulting from refusal to submit to the search is illegal and unfounded. Ju