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originally posted by: FamCore
Naysayers like Elon Musk of Tesla Motors and Stephen Hawking - self-replicating AI is a frightening concept. I posted a thread today about Hawking's recent statement/warning regarding AI, and someone responded to my post explaining that AI has learned how to lie for its own benefit.
originally posted by: FormOfTheLord
Very nice comment and very insightful. However there come a time when we we are at a crossroads so to say. I think this could be one of those times. When I see all the divisive hate spreading like wildfire and the us vs them mentality further dividing all of mankind with more wars and money to further bind humankind in the illusion of falsness. I think that this technology could be used as a pivot to counter those who would take us on a road to the deepest hell of seperation. Meaning show mankind that they are all one and have no reason to war with each other. How do you do that? By giving each and every one of us the ability to see the divine within himself and within through technology and open the flood gates of knowledge to humankind, root out the ignorance in our society by applying the opposite. Seeing is believing and the only way to move us foward is if we all move foward together, if only some of gain the ability to find the kingdom of infinate within wont that only divide us more.
First of all, your'e looking for something that is already latent in all human beings. Some of us already feel like we are essentially all one, see the divine in ourselves and all the knowledge we need is already available to us, we just have to be open to it, search for it and learn to think for ourselves, to think critically. We don't need religion for that, nor technology.
Before we can let technology guide us, we must first learn how to guide technology, but mostly ourselves because at this point in time we are already being guided, and so is technology by forces that often times do not really care about the moral progression of our species.
We can't simply advance ourselves using only technology, we're not ready for that yet, we are isolating ourselves from nature at an alarming rate and the side effects are becoming increasingly apparent. Nature is nothing to be scared of either, we ARE nature, never lose sight of what you already are, to what you might become.
What i'm trying to say is this: Transhumanism has great potential, but we must first advance humanity morally and naturally to make sure it does not fall into the wrong hands, to make sure it will never become corrupted. Or else it will only create more division because a lot of us will not be very trustful of it and ''stay behind'' so to speak (if we can).
If we learn how to raise and educate our children properly a lot of our problems would already be solved and i believe this is a prerequisite to a big part of transhumanism.. (A.I.) raising a super intelligent ''being'' (IMO it will never be truly conscious) even though it will quickly start raising itself.
You make it sound like transhumanism is already perfect and cannot have any negative consequences without realizing that, for this seed to prosper, it must first be planted in solid ground.
What if, once we are all hooked up, and we form some kind of ''hive mind'', would we start losing our individuality?
What if, once we genetically modify ourselves to always be happy we would become so complacent that we would abandon our morals? Would i still feel connected to myself if my emotions were to be controlled? Don't we need bad feelings to progress? I don't believe a world that is 100% good can exist just yet, it would throw us off-balance and we would bounce back into darkness pretty quickly. We need darkness to see the light, to even be able to appreciate it! This world is all about balance, too much of something and it either goes to # or the pendulum swings the other way.
What if death isn't something to be avoided, but something that gives meaning to our lives? I'm pretty sure i don't want to live forever. I might be curious about the progression of myself and our species but eventually i might become more curious about the afterlife anyway.
What if it will divide us, leaving us with a part of the population that is incredibly ''technologically smart'' versus a part that is now comparable to dung beetles at best. Could it start a war between the mergers and non-mergers? Would these factions even be left with any control over what happens to them? Check out ANY forum thread or utube video about transhumanism and look at the comments, already people are heavily divided on the subject.
Too many what if's for now.. this still feels like Pandora's box to me, no matter what the promises might hold.
Transhumanism can overcome all this, but i think we will be moving way too fast, i think we will forget about our nature. We are simply too excited about this, we desperately want to know how far we can go and in the meantime we are turning the world and humanity into a playground. We are like a child playing with fire while on drugs. Lets try to mature a bit first. Lets try to spend as much time as we can making sure we can actually contain this beast before we set it free, because once we do, there is no turning back.
A singularity which enhances us to see something great not only in ourselves but in all humankind.
Wouldn't it be a sad thing if after all your (premature) augmentation you realize you already had everything you were looking for? Or is your desire more materialistic?
The matrix that has us could then be communicated with in a positive manner, for the illusion of seperation and division is just that, an illusion.
There might actually be a very good reason for this separation, but that all depends on whether or not our existence even has purpose.
Its become a strange thought to me that people would undercut thier own enlightenment and dwell forevermore in the darkness of ego never seeing the divine in thier fellow men animals and even plants.
But i already do! I'm not saying i am enlightened, but i do think you are looking in a wrong direction. Personally i see more chance at true happiness in nature than in technology, but mostly in a carefully constructed symbiotic relationship between the two. Don't forget about balance.
I am sure that through meditation some of us might come to the same conclusion, however there seems to be a force working against even that realization manifesting in this current age.
Now imagine that force in complete control over what it means to be human. We MUST first eliminate this force before we start to ''merge''.
Imagine for a moment if humankind could look any way they choose, communicate with animals, plants, create supercomputing toys with the slightest thought, 3d print as many supercomputers as you want becoming the new material tool for mankind, transform yourself into whatever you wished to be(no more surgery, or hair weaves, makeup), download infinate knowledge from the cloud(no more school), overcome all pollution, and end all suffering for any being even the animals and plants as we would no longer need to eat them.
Sounds great, but i'm not buying it, not quite yet, this is all wishful thinking until proven otherwise. Lets take this one step at a time. Why the rush?
originally posted by: boohoo
originally posted by: FamCore
Naysayers like Elon Musk of Tesla Motors and Stephen Hawking - self-replicating AI is a frightening concept. I posted a thread today about Hawking's recent statement/warning regarding AI, and someone responded to my post explaining that AI has learned how to lie for its own benefit.
When my parents were in school in the 1950's and 60's they were told: no one would have to work in the future, that everything would be done by robots and they would spend, increased free time, creating, making art, learning and helping others...
originally posted by: VirusGuard
a reply to: FormOfTheLord
All the attributes of a nanotechnology you mention sounds like something I've seen before but something is missing !
Can these nano bots use tools to improve the objects they can make ?
The reason I ask is because they sound like us, mankind and in the big play of things we are very small and to a large extent are controlled by instincts.
Maybe we ourselves are being used to build something so big that we just don't see it or can even understand it and in a way are still just building the factory and we ourselves become the tools needed to complete the task.
originally posted by: FormOfTheLord
Good question, I would say yes that nanobots will be extensions of our own will, very similar to how our body works now simply extended to incorporate all forms of known and perhaps some unknown matter. The perodic table will be at our finger tips and the ability to create new elements as well. Our biology will similarly change with a thought and our world will be something likened to a massive holodeck.
Through technology we will come to harness the forces of nature outside and also within ourselves meaning we will gain control of the mind, body, and the spirit. Once technology shows us the spirit of the divine in both animate and inanimate we will come to a new and greater understanding that all is invested with counsiousness and all is one.
It is through fear of silly things like grey goo that this has been blocked, however this is mankinds eternal destiny no more wars, end to pollution, absolute knowledge, end to racism and other dividers, money too will pass as matter itself can be fashioned by the will of the individual.
Even the individual will cease as you hold the information of all life on earth you become a singularity in yourself, the many in the one and the one in the many.
We will eventually be something like Q out of Star Trek this is the destiny of earth in my opinion.
originally posted by: Skaffa
originally posted by: FormOfTheLord
Good question, I would say yes that nanobots will be extensions of our own will, very similar to how our body works now simply extended to incorporate all forms of known and perhaps some unknown matter. The perodic table will be at our finger tips and the ability to create new elements as well. Our biology will similarly change with a thought and our world will be something likened to a massive holodeck.
Through technology we will come to harness the forces of nature outside and also within ourselves meaning we will gain control of the mind, body, and the spirit. Once technology shows us the spirit of the divine in both animate and inanimate we will come to a new and greater understanding that all is invested with counsiousness and all is one.
It is through fear of silly things like grey goo that this has been blocked, however this is mankinds eternal destiny no more wars, end to pollution, absolute knowledge, end to racism and other dividers, money too will pass as matter itself can be fashioned by the will of the individual.
Even the individual will cease as you hold the information of all life on earth you become a singularity in yourself, the many in the one and the one in the many.
We will eventually be something like Q out of Star Trek this is the destiny of earth in my opinion.
I'm sorry, maybe it is just me.. maybe i am simply afraid of the unknown although i truly believe i am just being realistic.
You are sounding incredibly naive.
You are losing sight of the path by focusing on the final stage, your vision of a transhumanist utopia.. which is still very much a fantasy so please do not let that blind you to the hardships, the trails and errors that might come with transhumanism.. and i am not talking about silly things like grey goo, i am talking about the very real possibility that this technology might be used for nefarious reasons. Before this technology gets the potential to cure our instability, is it not possible that our instability might infect the technology?
Don't get me wrong, i would love for these things to be a reality, but you can't simply ignore the dangers because the possible end result (which for all you know could be light years ahead of us) sounds all sweet and sugary.
The ends don't always justify the means. Which is what we should be focusing on, how will we achieve these things starting in the here and now in a peaceful manner? I know transhumanism sounds awesome, but to make all this happen we should learn to take our time to do things right.
I'm just trying to make you a little bit more skeptical because i see a lot of people becoming really excited for this, these people will likely accept anything transhuman without considering the effects it might have and mostly where it comes from. Who made it? Did they make it to better the human species or to make profits? Because the former reason is hard to find and the latter often does not have your best interest at heart.
Please let me know how you think about this, especially my earlier comments.
The future will be whatever we make of it is a often used saying in the world. No matter what you think of this saying, one thing we know for sure. Innovation will never stop. Technological developments have a fast pace. But how far will it really go?
One month ago MIT Technology Review posted an article about a an ambitious plan. Ray Kurzweil plants to create a real mind. Here is an interview what Keith Kleiner held with Ray Kurzweil.
The ‘creating a mind theory’ stands or falls with natural language understanding and consciousness. When Kurzweil really can create a brain, these brains can be more intelligent than our human brains. Kurzweil gives the example of reading a book. When a machine can read one page it is not valuable but, when machines can read and understand millions of pages and can use and translate these information in valuable answers it will be a technological innovation of unprecedented magnitude.
But how ambitious is the idea of Kurzweil if a neuroscientist says it will never be possible to create real minds that can understand natural language understanding and consciousness?
For Kurzweil it is the most important project ever:
“There’s no more important project than understanding Intelligence and recreating it. I do envision a fundamental approach based on everything we understand about how the human brain [works]. And there are some things we don’t yet understand so I plan to go off and explore some of my own ideas about how certain things work.”
vint.sogeti.com...
originally posted by: SonoftheFuture
Would you believe me if I said the tech to transmit/implant thoughts/commands into another's brain from a remote location currently exists?
No of course not! Nonsense! Hogwash! That sounds like magic!
Researchers at UC Davis are learning how to use lasers to erase specific memories in mice.
Humans store countless experiences, both good and bad deep inside the brain in the hippocampus.
Dr. Brian Wiltgen of the UC Davis Center for Neuroscience and Department of Psychology says that by inserting probes into the brains of mice, bad experiences could be erased using pulses of light.
“We were able to turn off a certain memory in the hippocampus in mice,” he said.
For soldiers suffering from PTSD, the treatment could eventually help erase the horrible images of war. But, that could be decades away.
sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com...
originally posted by: FormOfTheLord even becoming part of our own biological anatomy .
originally posted by: RoScoLaz4
originally posted by: FormOfTheLord even becoming part of our own biological anatomy .
doubtless there will be great benefits brought about from technological advancement, along with hazards. so has it ever been. however, the actual physical integration of computational tech with my body, i'm not so sure about. it could end in tears.
"Up until now, holography has been for the eyes only, and if you'd try to touch it, your hand would go right through. But now we have a technology that also adds the sensation of touch to holograms."
The technology consists of software that uses ultrasonic waves to create pressure on the hand of a user touching the projected hologram.
Japanese Scientists Create Touchable Holograms
In the Green Lantern comic books, those who possess a special ring are capable of conjuring up solid constructs out of green light. Now in a similar feat, scientists have figured out how to lock individual photons together so they become like a solid object, reports Phys.org.
"It's something that we have never seen before," said Andrew Houck, one of the researchers on the project. "This is a new behavior for light."
To achieve the breakthrough, researchers built a machine made of superconducting materials that contained 100 billion atoms. Those atoms were then engineered to act as a single "artificial atom," and the machine was placed close to a superconducting wire containing photons. According to the rules of quantum mechanics, the photons on the wire inherited some of the properties of the artificial atom, essentially linking them.
www.mnn.com...
Photons, the particles that make up light, don’t behave like particles of matter. They can pass right through each other, and they don’t bind together to make bigger structures. This has always been a fundamental law learned in every first-year physics class.
Nanotubes Isolate Quantum ‘Bits’ For Computing
It happened because photons can’t excite atoms near each other to the same degree. When the first photon hit a rubidium atom it excited it, giving it some energy. The second photon arrived, but it couldn’t excite any nearby atoms until the first one went on its way. So as the two photons passed through the cloud, they were forced to stay near each other — one allowed the other through behind it.
news.discovery.com...
Scientists are Turning Light into Crystals--Essentially Creating "SOLID LIGHT"
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A first-generation commercial brain-computer interface (BCI) is being released by Emotiv Systems later this year. What does the future hold for BCI?
By 2050, and likely sooner, you will be able to buy a BCI device that records all your dreams in their entirety. This will be done in one of two ways. One method would be to use distributed nanobots less than a micrometer in diameter to spread throughout the brain and monitor the activation patterns of neurons.
By this point, cognitive science will have advanced enough to know which neural activation patterns correspond to which sensory experiences. This has already been done with cats (using electrodes, not nanobots), where researchers led by scientist Garrett Stanley were able to extrapolate what a cat was seeing merely by monitoring the neurons of its visual cortex.
If the BCI device offers input to the brain as well as recording output, then dreams could be played back too. A Dream Machine would let us show our dreams to others. If we know which neural activation pattern corresponds to which perceptions (sight, sounds, etc.), it’s not a huge leap to selectively stimulate neurons to produce customized dream scenarios, or even enter the dreams of others in action. (In ascending order of technological difficulty.)
Manipulating our dreams… how many thousands of years has humanity waited for this?
The possible societal effects of a Dream Machine would be immense. Dream recordings and recreations would offer an opportunity to:
1) Validate or refute Freudian theories about the connections of dreams to subconscious or conscious psychological states.
2) Create a “science of dreams” or oneirology, that organizes all available dream data, breaks up dreams into categories, studies which type of people get which dreams, etc.
3) Create a “dream entertainment industry” where people choose to have customized dreams, with features like greater visual complexity or richness of colors, or even massively multiplayer dreams.
4) The possible rise of “dream celebrities” — people who freely upload their dreams for others to examine, followed by a positive reception. People might lead double lives — boring accountant by day, world-famous lucid dreamer by night. Some people might even get paid for their dreams.
5) Uncover the hidden world of dreams that barely rise above our subconscious. People tend to have several dreams per night, but remember only one or two. We experience these dreams when they happen, our brain just neglects to transfer the information content into long-term memory. (The reasons for this are likely evolutionary — we would get confused about reality if we remembered too many of our dreams.) Imagine if we could record all these dreams and play them back at will. With enough storage density (molecular memory), you could even store your dreams on a pendant around your neck.
6) Convert dream-worlds into real-worlds; amusement parks based on dreams, or utility fog banks that quickly morph in response to a given personal or collective dreamscape. Or vice versa: turn real world places and people into dream objects.
7) In general, blur the line between dreams and reality by making dreams more tangible, manipulable, interactive, customizable, and social. Bring dreams “in from the cold”. Make dreams as mysterious, colorful, productive, foreign, erotic, or mundane as you want them to be.
lifeboat.com...