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Mountain squatting?
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I have a question and would value some opinions. I am not saying at the moment this is my set in stone idea, it just seems it could work well.
If the bottom fell out and you had a jump on society,as far as timing,and you elect to "bug out" to the mountains as you feel safer there,far from the coast line. Do you think it would be easy to find one of the thousands of vacation log cabins homes in the mountains and just set up camp there. I mean if the bottom falls out and you have to protect and defend anyways, why not approach the scenario like this. Alot of these cabins are second homes for people, some are company owned places, etc.
If owners showed up would you let them in with you? Chances are that they will never make it there anyways.
Would you leave and go find another place?
I would never in normal circumstances do something like this, but the S just HTF.
What says you?
If the bottom fell out and you had a jump on society,as far as timing,and you elect to "bug out" to the mountains as you feel safer there,far from the coast line. Do you think it would be easy to find one of the thousands of vacation log cabins homes in the mountains and just set up camp there. I mean if the bottom falls out and you have to protect and defend anyways, why not approach the scenario like this. Alot of these cabins are second homes for people, some are company owned places, etc.
If owners showed up would you let them in with you? Chances are that they will never make it there anyways.
Would you leave and go find another place?
I would never in normal circumstances do something like this, but the S just HTF.
What says you?
a reply to: earthart
And when they get there with there kid's and wife armed to the teeth only to find a stranger in there house?.
There are problems with mountains anyway, for example if the SHTF and a nuclear war take's place if radioactive fallout from a war was coming down with rain as it would then the mountains are water shed so the that the lighter atmospheric dust particles of fallout are going to come down with more intensity there, that is those small particles other than the splash area around the blast zone as like I point out mountain's are natural water shed area's, of course six month's later if ample amount's of rain has fallen it will have washed into the gullie's and ravine's leaving the mountain top's clear except for ambiant radiation and depression's in the rock and of course those particle's that have not fallen but are still falling maybe for up to six month's or more.
Also you find what look's like a nice deserted cabin in the wood's and find it is a cannibal survivalist's home who return's with several of them good old city sheep people for lunch and find's an entre has moving right in all of his own accord.
The best way of surviving is to do everything to stop the collapse and war in the first place.
Also if a nuclear winter take's place it could be far, far worse than this.
And when they get there with there kid's and wife armed to the teeth only to find a stranger in there house?.
There are problems with mountains anyway, for example if the SHTF and a nuclear war take's place if radioactive fallout from a war was coming down with rain as it would then the mountains are water shed so the that the lighter atmospheric dust particles of fallout are going to come down with more intensity there, that is those small particles other than the splash area around the blast zone as like I point out mountain's are natural water shed area's, of course six month's later if ample amount's of rain has fallen it will have washed into the gullie's and ravine's leaving the mountain top's clear except for ambiant radiation and depression's in the rock and of course those particle's that have not fallen but are still falling maybe for up to six month's or more.
Also you find what look's like a nice deserted cabin in the wood's and find it is a cannibal survivalist's home who return's with several of them good old city sheep people for lunch and find's an entre has moving right in all of his own accord.
The best way of surviving is to do everything to stop the collapse and war in the first place.
Also if a nuclear winter take's place it could be far, far worse than this.
a reply to: earthart
Are we talking a threat from the ocean here, as in Tsunami?
Be more specific, you are raising more questions than answering. As far as the end of society, any port in a storm. Finding a remote, fully stocked cabin would be nice. How would you determine its unoccupied? Think about that. Then think about how many other refugees are going to come along wanting an answer to that question, too.
Too many books come to mind. Want to read a good novel on the general subject, "Lucifer's Hammer" by Larry Niven and Jerry Pournelle comes to mind.
…and you elect to "bug out" to the mountains as you feel safer there,far from the coast line.
Are we talking a threat from the ocean here, as in Tsunami?
Be more specific, you are raising more questions than answering. As far as the end of society, any port in a storm. Finding a remote, fully stocked cabin would be nice. How would you determine its unoccupied? Think about that. Then think about how many other refugees are going to come along wanting an answer to that question, too.
Too many books come to mind. Want to read a good novel on the general subject, "Lucifer's Hammer" by Larry Niven and Jerry Pournelle comes to mind.
edit on 24-11-2014 by intrptr because: spelling
Ewwweeeeee...
The good old fashioned LOG cabin up in the mountains???
We don't all live in the US of A my dear respected member???
Where I live we have underground 30 metre deep limestone quarries carved out back in the 1400s to 1700s when certain castles were refurbished in France before or after the revolution...
Underground is the best place to be with the right planned life saving commodities...
However... I will be protecting Mrs R, Rod Jr and myself.... only food for ourselves...
May the strongest survive...
Kindest respects
Rodinus
The good old fashioned LOG cabin up in the mountains???
We don't all live in the US of A my dear respected member???
Where I live we have underground 30 metre deep limestone quarries carved out back in the 1400s to 1700s when certain castles were refurbished in France before or after the revolution...
Underground is the best place to be with the right planned life saving commodities...
However... I will be protecting Mrs R, Rod Jr and myself.... only food for ourselves...
May the strongest survive...
Kindest respects
Rodinus
a reply to: [post=18694785]earthart[/post
You would be better off to build a yurt. Everyone knows where theirs or someones mountain cabin is. I am not trying to sound like a tough guy because that is what I am not. But! If me my wife and 2 kids arrive at our cabin after whatever scene just took place to get there and I find you there I will most likely kill you.
Why?
I have watched too many movies and realized these 2 things. 1. In SHTF type movies whoever ousts someone from their spot regardless of ownership will get retaliated upon. 2. How many times have you watched the movies ad said to yourself "You better shoot them before they take your gun" They didn't shoot and they are now the victim.
In closing.
In the early onset of a SHTF scenario I can not imagine being hospitable and surviving. It might sound horrible of me but i feel it is the truth. Nothing but sheer ruthlessness will get you to the end with you and yours alive. Think of it like this. There were laws in place by a young government when the west was being settled. How ruthless was the wild west?
You would be better off to build a yurt. Everyone knows where theirs or someones mountain cabin is. I am not trying to sound like a tough guy because that is what I am not. But! If me my wife and 2 kids arrive at our cabin after whatever scene just took place to get there and I find you there I will most likely kill you.
Why?
I have watched too many movies and realized these 2 things. 1. In SHTF type movies whoever ousts someone from their spot regardless of ownership will get retaliated upon. 2. How many times have you watched the movies ad said to yourself "You better shoot them before they take your gun" They didn't shoot and they are now the victim.
In closing.
In the early onset of a SHTF scenario I can not imagine being hospitable and surviving. It might sound horrible of me but i feel it is the truth. Nothing but sheer ruthlessness will get you to the end with you and yours alive. Think of it like this. There were laws in place by a young government when the west was being settled. How ruthless was the wild west?
If you spend time around vacation communities in the mountains, you will hear that squatting is an ongoing problem. I have knowledge of someone who
is paid to provide security in the off-season by patrolling for intruders in vacant vacay cabins. a couple of years ago, there was a fellow doing
this in the Rockies. He was eventually caught because of game cameras...
While it might seem easy right now, due to the fact that most cabins are too remote to have cable (and thus be on a security/alarm system), that would change radically in a survival situation.
Basically, take it as a rule of thumb that every cabin up there is someone's survival redoubt. They will definitely not be firing warning shots. They will also approach their property expecting to find an intruder, so you can't count on taking them by surprise.
Long-term, I am looking elsewhere, since agriculture at high altitude is severely limited. That's why so many pioneer towns in the mountains quickly became ghost towns, and why high mountains are generally the last to be settled.
While it might seem easy right now, due to the fact that most cabins are too remote to have cable (and thus be on a security/alarm system), that would change radically in a survival situation.
Basically, take it as a rule of thumb that every cabin up there is someone's survival redoubt. They will definitely not be firing warning shots. They will also approach their property expecting to find an intruder, so you can't count on taking them by surprise.
Long-term, I am looking elsewhere, since agriculture at high altitude is severely limited. That's why so many pioneer towns in the mountains quickly became ghost towns, and why high mountains are generally the last to be settled.
a reply to: earthart
You NEED to read the book "One Second After". I used to have the same mindset as you, until I read that book. Trust me when I say it's worth while reading. Coast is where I am heading. (actually, I am heading there no matter what. I hope there is no SHTF scenario)
You NEED to read the book "One Second After". I used to have the same mindset as you, until I read that book. Trust me when I say it's worth while reading. Coast is where I am heading. (actually, I am heading there no matter what. I hope there is no SHTF scenario)
Yeah, you might want to be VERY careful which mountains you are heading to. Resort, or vacation area? Fine good luck. But the mountains of TN and
KY and even WV, have lots of "mountain" folk, who will shoot you, for being anywhere near their side of the mountain.
Personally, I wouldn't do it.
Personally, I wouldn't do it.
I agree to some degree. Wouldnt you think EVERYONE in a shtf scenario at some point are gonna be rioters/looters/thieves and scavengers. a reply to:
AnonymousCitizen
I now consider myself pre-bugged out. I'm in a tiny town, at the end of a long driveway, backed up into Bureau of Land Management Land in a place
with mild year round weather and plenty of water and natural food supplies. I'm far enough away from the main travel routes so that I doubt any
looters would ever find us and it's relatively defensible. IOW, I've given a lot of thought to this scenario and expected it to happen by now.
That said, a lot depends on what your SHF situation is; if it's radioactive all bets are off. Kiss your keister goodbye. Ditto some of the more drastic situations like asteroids hitting or Yellowstone blowing (which would drop 10 foot of suffocating ash on most of the US and lower global temperatures enough to bring on an ice age...
Let's say an EMP that takes out the electrical grid; no warning, no way of knowing exactly what happened or how long the power is going to be out. At first, everything is more or less normal but it would take a few days for people to figure out (along with rampant speculation, conjecture and wild imaginings about what happened) that the power might not be coming back again. Most people won't know that all the electrical devices going dead including cars was an EMP, even... and our glorious U.S. govt if that's where you are has a nasty tendency of retaliating against imaginary enemies, thus making the situation worse. Meanwhile back at home, there's dozens of nuclear power plants that are days away from meltdown status from lack of diesel and personnel to manage them.
At that point you have millions of people in the cities getting very nervous and finally reacting, most of which (including you) won't have a working car.
How far can you walk with necessities? A sleeping bag or roll, portable food and water and tools? I'm willing to bet you'd be lucky to get 10 miles from your current location. If you were at work at the time, could you even get home? The roads would be impassable from stalled abandoned cars and maybe only a bike works, and it stands out as something worth stealing. Once the stores are being looted, people will revert to animalistic behavior (thus the saying that civilization is only 9 missed meals away from disappearing).
My best advice barring what I've already done? And the one that few will think of? If you're within walking or biking distance of a marina, go and find yourself a sailboat. Learn to sail it on the fly and head to the southern hemisphere, fast.
That said, a lot depends on what your SHF situation is; if it's radioactive all bets are off. Kiss your keister goodbye. Ditto some of the more drastic situations like asteroids hitting or Yellowstone blowing (which would drop 10 foot of suffocating ash on most of the US and lower global temperatures enough to bring on an ice age...
Let's say an EMP that takes out the electrical grid; no warning, no way of knowing exactly what happened or how long the power is going to be out. At first, everything is more or less normal but it would take a few days for people to figure out (along with rampant speculation, conjecture and wild imaginings about what happened) that the power might not be coming back again. Most people won't know that all the electrical devices going dead including cars was an EMP, even... and our glorious U.S. govt if that's where you are has a nasty tendency of retaliating against imaginary enemies, thus making the situation worse. Meanwhile back at home, there's dozens of nuclear power plants that are days away from meltdown status from lack of diesel and personnel to manage them.
At that point you have millions of people in the cities getting very nervous and finally reacting, most of which (including you) won't have a working car.
How far can you walk with necessities? A sleeping bag or roll, portable food and water and tools? I'm willing to bet you'd be lucky to get 10 miles from your current location. If you were at work at the time, could you even get home? The roads would be impassable from stalled abandoned cars and maybe only a bike works, and it stands out as something worth stealing. Once the stores are being looted, people will revert to animalistic behavior (thus the saying that civilization is only 9 missed meals away from disappearing).
My best advice barring what I've already done? And the one that few will think of? If you're within walking or biking distance of a marina, go and find yourself a sailboat. Learn to sail it on the fly and head to the southern hemisphere, fast.
Mountains make good survival retreats for several reasons: ability to observe, remoteness from others, purer water (if you're not too high up). On
the downside the weather is much harsher, edible plants and wild game are far more scarce forcing one to come down in elevation to hunt or forage.
A cave would be a huge asset unless it's well-known in which case you'd be fighting half the other people bugging out to keep it yours.
As for squatting on other's property that is something I wouldn't do unless it were a dire emergency. Maintaining respect for the law and human life is a must if there would be anyone worth rebuilding a society left after the shooting is over.
I'll say it once again, Tracking is the most critical skill one could have. You need to know if anyone has walked or driven down the road to that cabin and when they were there. Knowing how to recognize fresh signs of human presence will do more to keep you alive than an entire arsenal of weapons.
A cave would be a huge asset unless it's well-known in which case you'd be fighting half the other people bugging out to keep it yours.
As for squatting on other's property that is something I wouldn't do unless it were a dire emergency. Maintaining respect for the law and human life is a must if there would be anyone worth rebuilding a society left after the shooting is over.
I'll say it once again, Tracking is the most critical skill one could have. You need to know if anyone has walked or driven down the road to that cabin and when they were there. Knowing how to recognize fresh signs of human presence will do more to keep you alive than an entire arsenal of weapons.
Pffftttt....
I have yonks worthy years of decent wine in an underground cellar...
I will die either happy or happy with liver cancer and no doctor... ;-)
Hugs
Rod
a reply to: signalfire
I have yonks worthy years of decent wine in an underground cellar...
I will die either happy or happy with liver cancer and no doctor... ;-)
Hugs
Rod
a reply to: signalfire
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