Navy's P-8 Poseidon Plane Can See Underwater, Has 'Magnetic Anomaly Detector'

www.businessinsider.com...

HOW THE NAVY'S NEW ANTI-SUBMARINE AIRCRAFT SEES UNDER THE WAVES
"The P-8 Poseidon, the most advanced search aircraft in the world, has been a part of the US Navy for just a year now. This infographic lays out the converted Boeing 737's capabilities in detecting enemy submarines, surface ships, and other aircraft.

"Large metal objects like submarines create variances in the Earth's magnetic field, which the Poseidon P-8 is tuned into, thanks to a tailpiece called the Magnet Anomaly Detector (MAD).

"Alternatively, the plane can drop sonobuoys (that's sonar buoys) from on high, allowing the crew inside to measure the sound propagation that surrounds these underwater units, just as a submarine or warship typically would. The P-8 can send out more than 100 of these yard-long sonobuoys in a single flight.

(Magnetic anomalies have been linked to everything from vortices, to ancient settlements built on top of these anomalies.)

Sweet. Fire that baby up and go find MH370.

Second line.

Makes me wonder what the Russians and Chinese are going to do to counter this technology. If this tech can see disturbances in the magnetic feild, i wonder how sensitive it is. There are natural minerals in the earth that dont act like the surrounding rock when it comes to magnetic feilds. Still this is pretty sweet, and has to put submarines from other countries on their toes. They'll be making subs nonmetallic, lol

MAD has been an important sensor on all US ASW Aircraft, since the early 50's. The P-2 Neptune was the first to have it permanently incorporated into the stinger on it's tail, and the P-3 Orion had it as well, mounted in a long boom in the tail.

MAD is considered a secondary sensor, and used in the attack phase for deploying torpedos and depth charges. The aircraft would fly very low over the water, usually down to 200 ft on an already pre-determined course by extrapolating the underwater target position from the sonobuoy plots. As soon as the MAD detector signaled an anomaly, the weapon would be dropped.


The MAD sensor itself, was a copper wire coil that was suspended in a gimble, much like a gyroscope. The coil would align itself with the Earth's magnetic lines of flux. It would be disturbed and physically move if there was a disruption in the magnetic field, and that would be sensed by an amplifier that fed an analog (now digital) meter.

Almost all dedicated ASW platforms have one. It is a great tool for finding areas to refine your search for subs.

They've also been able to drop sonobuoys for decades too.

Got to love articles that seem to talk about an old technology as if it was some tremendous advance in capability.

Advances in electronics probably make it more accurate in providing positioning info.

Decades is right for the use of sonobuoys. They first used them over 70 years ago.

a reply to: Glassbender777

Apparently China is going for speed with supercavitation.
I suspect we have HAD such a capability in orbit as well,in restricted use.

It's not really any one of the P-8s core detection technologies that offers a breakthrough, but rather, the sensitivity and the fusion of all the sensors and the ability to bring a lot of complex, diverse information together, process it and give a real world picture to the crew. That's what is a huge breakthrough: the technology fused together to give an amazing "single view".

As others have said, this is old technology. The UK's old Nimrod ASW maritime Patrol aircraft had MAD as well as sonar buoys... Must be a slow news day at the www.businessinsider.com...

a reply to: Borys

"It's not really any one of the P-8s core detection technologies that offers a breakthrough, but rather, the sensitivity and the fusion of all the sensors and the ability to bring a lot of complex, diverse information together, process it and give a real world picture to the crew."

Very true! And the Navy has a Broad Agency Announcement looking for "Superconducting Materials", including super sensitive electromagnetic sensors:

heron.nrl.navy.mil...
NAVAL RESEARCH LABORATORY BAA
"(1) Innovative ultra-sensitive electromagnetic sensors and sensor arrays which respond to frequencies from dc through the microwave and millimeter wave regions of the spectrum through the infrared, the visible and into the ultraviolet region of the spectrum with particular emphasis on applications in the areas of Magnetic Anomaly Detection (MAD), mine countermeasures, corrosion detection and Non-Destructive Evaluation (NDE) of materials."

Although I'm a little puzzled by this line near the end:

"Projects ranging from short duration to several man-years will be considered."

Man-years??? As opposed to ... dolphin-years?

a reply to: Glassbender777

"Still this is pretty sweet, and has to put submarines from other countries on their toes."

Yes, and these "other countries" probably sat up and took notice of this too:

www.nrl.navy.mil...
(Dec. 2013) U.S. NAVY LAUNCHES UAV FROM SUBMERGED SUBMARINE
"The U.S. Naval Research Laboratory (NRL) with funding from SwampWorks at the Office of Naval Research (ONR) and the Department of Defense Rapid Reaction Technology Office (DoD/RRTO) demonstrated the launch of an all-electric, fuel cell-powered, unmanned aerial system (UAS) from a submerged submarine. From concept to fleet demonstration, this idea took less than six years to produce results at significant cost savings when compared to traditional programs often taking decades to produce results.

"The successful submerged launch of a remotely deployed UAS offers a pathway to providing mission critical intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance (ISR) capabilities to the U.S. Navy's submarine force.

"Operating under support of the Los Angeles class USS Providence (SSN 719) and the Naval Undersea Warfare Center-Newport Division (NUWC-NPT), the NRL developed XFC UAS—eXperimental Fuel Cell Unmanned Aerial System—was fired from the submarine's torpedo tube using a 'Sea Robin' launch vehicle system. The Sea Robin launch system was designed to fit within an empty Tomahawk launch canister (TLC) used for launching Tomahawk cruise missiles already familiar to submarine sailors."

a reply to: stumason

"As others have said, this is old technology. The UK's old Nimrod ASW maritime Patrol aircraft had MAD as well as sonar buoys... Must be a slow news day at the www.businessinsider.com... "

Hey, "old technology" can sometimes fit right in with "young minds" and "new research":

www.nrl.navy.mil...
NAVY RESEARCH LAB RESTORES WWII-ERA EQUIPMENT FOR TODAY'S RESEARCH NEEDS
"It sounds like the ultimate recycling project - the Naval Research Laboratory and the Office of Naval Research through its INTOP Program have taken a 96,000-pound piece of equipment that was used in the 1940s and are refurbishing it for use in research today.

"This World War II-era equipment, a three-axis tilting platform, now called the Ship Motion System (SMS) is located at NRL's Chesapeake Bay Detachment, along the shores of the Chesapeake Bay in Calvert County, Maryland.

"When the SMS platform was initially installed at CBD in the 1940s, it was used as a mechanically operated deck with a heavy machine gun director and a machine gun mount installed. Gun crews and director operators could be trained on the platform under conditions that approximated the movements of a vessel at sea.

"Once it is complete, the platform will be used as a ship motion platform, providing researchers with a simulation of the motion that occurs on a ship at sea. The platform offers potential uses for researchers working in the areas of radar, tactical electronic warfare, communications, optical sciences, and remote sensing."

originally posted by: MKMoniker
www.businessinsider.com...

HOW THE NAVY'S NEW ANTI-SUBMARINE AIRCRAFT SEES UNDER THE WAVES
"The P-8 Poseidon, the most advanced search aircraft in the world, has been a part of the US Navy for just a year now. This infographic lays out the converted Boeing 737's capabilities in detecting enemy submarines, surface ships, and other aircraft.

"Large metal objects like submarines create variances in the Earth's magnetic field, which the Poseidon P-8 is tuned into, thanks to a tailpiece called the Magnet Anomaly Detector (MAD).

"Alternatively, the plane can drop sonobuoys (that's sonar buoys) from on high, allowing the crew inside to measure the sound propagation that surrounds these underwater units, just as a submarine or warship typically would. The P-8 can send out more than 100 of these yard-long sonobuoys in a single flight.

(Magnetic anomalies have been linked to everything from vortices, to ancient settlements built on top of these anomalies.)

LOL. I like how the article makes this all seem like amazing and new technology. Magnetic Anomaly Detection and sonobuoys have been around a long time. Here's a picture of a P3C Orion. The "stinger" on the back is the MAD boom.

a reply to: MKMoniker

Man years as opposed to calendar years. 24 man hours means it will take 24 hours of actual work, as opposed to 24 hours. So three shifts. One man year is one year shift wise as opposed to one physical year.

I thought this was old Cold War technology that we've had for decades? Sub-hunting planes using ultra low frequencies with huge long boom-like antenna?

a reply to: MystikMushroom

Not long no. It picks up magnetic fields. I think you're thinking of the trailing wire antenna for ELF communications.

a reply to: Zaphod58

Right...okay I got them confused!

I still thought we had sub-hunting planes a long time ago though. . . I thought those P8's have been used for a few decades?

a reply to: MystikMushroom

No the P-8 is the replacement for the P-3. That's the one we've had for decades.

a reply to: Zaphod58

"Man years as opposed to calendar years. 24 man hours means it will take 24 hours of actual work, as opposed to 24 hours. So three shifts. One man year is one year shift wise as opposed to one physical year."

Thank You! I have never seen "man-years" referenced before. I also didn't know that research laboratories worked three shifts per 24 hours. Must be something crucial to a military objective, or a cutting edge weapon or piece of equipment that is desperately needed in a niche operation.

a reply to: MKMoniker

Three 8 hour shifts. Sometimes they work more than 8 per shift but the man hour model is based on 8 hour shifts IIRC. You can also have two or three working together which reduces the "real" time it takes.