Grammar Nazis - Get knotted! Cheap shots ahoy!!!

A common shot at people on the internet and within forums (has to be said, not so much here - which is nice) is the pointing out of people's bad grammar.

This is a cheap shot. You're basically bad mouthing a person's education and I bet that if you asked the bad-grammarian how they feel you would get one of the following answers:

1 - "I know I didn't learn the difficult/ambiguous grammar rules of the English language, I just couldn't take it in when I was at school and my parents weren't interested either. I wish I knew the grammar rules but I do try".

2 - "I don't care. I could spell everything phonetically and my point would still come across".

So do the world a favour Grammar Nazis and ask yourself a question, the answer to which lies deep inside your psyche: "Why am I so up tight about grammar? Why do I feel I should take the high ground over grammar? Why do I punish people publicly over their grammar?"

i cudunt care les how ppl get the info acros jus so long as the info keeps cummin

Quit the cheap shots - is it all you've got?

a reply to: and14263

Ar, yow'm reet enuff.

However, when someone responds to your well thought-out, considered response to their post with "Your stupid if you beleive that" then it's open season.

Uptight is one word.

This is a cheap shot. You're basically bad mouthing a person's education and I bet that if you asked the bad-grammarian how they feel you would get one of the following answers:

3 -

hey you know, credit where credit is due, people here are pretty tolerant to that, i am bilingual, and make typos, or sometimes go straight up dyslexic because my brain switches between english and italian words without giving me a heads up (oyu, ocme hwere ar my greatest hists ) often i manage to correct them, but sometimes you are in a rush and funny stuff gets posted, and not once someone has corrected me, i'm glad that as a community we are above the rest at least in that regard!

originally posted by: and14263
A common shot at people on the internet and within forums (has to be said, not so much here - which is nice) is the pointing out of people's bad grammar.

This is a cheap shot. You're basically bad mouthing a person's education and I bet that if you asked the bad-grammarian how they feel you would get one of the following answers:

So do the world a favour Grammar Nazis and ask yourself a question, the answer to which lies deep inside your psyche: "Why am I so up tight about grammar? Why do I feel I should take the high ground over grammar? Why do I punish people publicly over their grammar?"

i cudunt care les how ppl get the info acros jus so long as the info keeps cummin

Quit the cheap shots - is it all you've got?

Actually I care about grammar because it was how I was raised. I was taught that good grammar is important. I was taught that good spelling is important. I was taught that the written word is the highest form of communication, and it should be respected.

If I ever have children I will stress this upon them as well. Grammar is important. Spelling is important.

a reply to: and14263

I never correct other member's grammar here on ATS, because I know we have a very diverse international community.

But it does drive me bonkers the way some people who should definitely know better butcher their posts. I never graduated high school, yet somehow manage to use proper spelling and grammar.

Anything worth doing, should be worth doing right.

a reply to: kelbtalfenek

Why is it IMPORTANT? Why should it be RESPECTED?

Grammar and language evolves - if you want to show respect then you have 2 options.

1 - Go back to the oldest record of our language and grammar, the PURE stuff even before Chaucer and use this - keep its integrity. I guess you are aiming to keep the integrity?

2 - Look at how language and grammar has changed and realise that instilling uptight grammar Nazi views is halting the natural evolution of language and grammar. Who says what we use now is better or worse than the completely different English used 200 years ago or the English that will be being used in 500 years.

Maybe teach your kids how to use their brain and adapt rather than instilling unchangeable rules?

(I sound like I'm beasting a bit - it's not a beast directly at you - sorry for the CAPS I just couldn't be bothered to press the italics button)

Try to focus on content, not characters or their defects. If you need to resort to giving english grammar lessons, you lose the argument. I prefer to read body english.

By the way, I butcher the english language all the time and nobody tasks me for it.

But thats because I'm a Goddamn long hair bare foot hippie protestor. People don't demand much from me, thank god.

a reply to: and14263

Although I value data in pretty much any readable form, and agree with you for the most part, I cannot imagine that you are unaware that some communication, by the very nature of the information being imparted, must be accurate in order to achieve the desired end result.

The fact is, that although sharing data is always welcome, to communicate some concepts and facts requires a strong grasp of the English language. For example, when speaking about the wider implications of the results of experiments which have been run at the Large Hadron Collider, one cannot use lazy or improper grammar, because if one DOES use such casual forms of communication, detail vital to understanding, will certainly be lost.

Furthermore, sometimes when someone is trying to communicate a metaphysical concept, one which defies easy description, it is doubly important to refine ones use of language, simply because even with the widest breadth of linguistic capacity, these concepts can be very difficult to communicate effectively. Therefore, trying to communicate them using broken grammar will be even more ineffective, and render the entire process pointless.

In addition to these things, there are some people who seem to post drivel, using poor grammar to mask the fact that they actually have nothing useful to contribute, and that is perhaps the most aggravating thing of all. What is perhaps somewhat worse, is that these people often react poorly to being asked to clarify their position, and claim that those detracting from their non-point of view, simply have not got the wisdom to decrypt their meaning from the almost random assemblage of vocabulary they have used. This is the highest form of stupidity, since it is not for someone who cannot communicate effectively, to pull others up on their ability to derive meaning from the utterly meaningless.

Certainly, there are subjects which do not require precise communication skills in order to effectively engage in debate or discussion surrounding them. However, where ever a nuanced discussion is necessary, there will be a necessity for all participants in a discussion to have a high standard of linguistic capability. The more difficult and complex a subject or discussion, the more necessary that capability becomes, which is why we rarely look to babbling six month old infants, to explain the deeper reaches of the cosmos to us!

Does this have anything to do with the methods of spelling being taught in schools? Aren't the kids just "spelling it like it sounds" to each individual's discretion, of course...

English as a second language aside, the message loses something ... for example, the words "your" and "you're" have two completely different meanings. "Their", "there" and "they're" - same thing.

If you're trying to get your point across, personal phonetics and bad grammar simply distract from your message.
The written word contains power - mis-use of it just lowers the credibility, to some.

So the so-called "grammar nazis" you speak of - so everyone is supposed to lower their levels, instead of raising them.
Interesting, for sure.

a reply to: TrueBrit

I completely understand where you are coming from - and from how you put it I can agree with what you say. I do feel however that the context of information will allow me to understand the point that is being put across. I'm talking about the wheres/were's and too/to sort of things, mis-placed apostrophes etc Anything more than that would be a more heinous mistake than grammar. I don't feel spelling/grammar impacts much on the information exchange. But you are correct, it certainly could have an effect on how the meaning of the information is interpreted/perceived.

And as for the babble that gets posted on here sometimes (and other places)... I wonder if it's me being too tired to read properly but when you go back over the post there often is just nonsensical strings of words. Although these people are often within a state of psychosis or breakdown which compels the babbling.

originally posted by: ItsEvolutionBaby
Does this have anything to do with the methods of spelling being taught in schools? Aren't the kids just "spelling it like it sounds" to each individual's discretion, of course...

English as a second language aside, the message loses something ... for example, the words "your" and "you're" have two completely different meanings. "Their", "there" and "they're" - same thing.

If you're trying to get your point across, personal phonetics and bad grammar simply distract from your message.
The written word contains power - mis-use of it just lowers the credibility, to some.

So the so-called "grammar nazis" you speak of - so everyone is supposed to lower their levels, instead of raising them.
Interesting, for sure.

Don't lower your levels, just accept others for who they are.

Yeah right. Let's just allow everyone to write as they please, who gives a flying frack for something as trivial as grammar and spelling.

I bet that's what the tower of babel guys did as well.

Someone who can not figure out the difference between "Should have" and "Should of" or "Their" and "They're" should simply refrain from posting on internet forums.

a reply to: and14263

I pride myself on my grammar, But I won't correct others. The English language is convoluted and people are prone to make mistakes from time to time.

What does irk me is when people use the word 'surreal' to describe every odd encounter. "I met this lady who was born in the same hospital as I was, It was so surreal."

No it wasn't. The works of Salvador Dali are surreal, Lucid dreams are surreal, coincidences are not surreal.

originally posted by: H1ght3chHippie
Yeah right. Let's just allow everyone to write as they please, who gives a flying frack for something as trivial as grammar and spelling.

I bet that's what the tower of babel guys did as well.

Someone who can not figure out the difference between "Should have" and "Should of" or "Their" and "They're" should simply refrain from posting on internet forums.

That's very elitist. Someone who hasn't an education as privileged as yours should not go to the same places and have the same input on topics as you?

This is exactly the sort of narrow minded thought that leads to segregation. Usually a class based segregation. Stop looking down your nose. If you can't figure out what someone means when they get the 'shoulds' wrong then it's your mind which should be called into question.

English is my second language, yet I am very particular about spelling and grammar. Most mistakes I tolerate, after all, someone could be dyslexic or genuinely not have the capacity to learn the spelling of all words.
However there are some mistakes that 'grind my gears', for example when a native speaker can't discern between 'Their' and 'There' for example, they will have to accept that I will think the following about them:

That they are just lazy and ignorant, because frankly these two words can be learned so quickly, that even a moron would understand, so whatever they write about will have less of an impact on me.
If I don't know the spelling of a word or I mix words up, I quickly go online and check it out, it is interesting to learn new things.

Everyone who does want to spell as they wish, have the right to but they have to accept that
- I may not have a clue what you are on about because wrong spelling can change the meaning of a sentence.
-That you just don't care enough to take five minutes to read up on the difference and learn it, which makes me wonder how much you have researched the point you are trying to make in a post.

a reply to: and14263

I haven't had an elitist education, and English is not even my native language.

My point is this: As soon as you deviate from a set of strict grammar rules, you make what you write open to interpretation, thus leading the whole point of written communication ad absurdum. The rules have a simple purpose, and that is making sure everybody understands what someone writes in the way it was meant.

If you put these rules away, someone could write something and ten people understand it in ten different ways. In the long run, chaos would be the ultimate consequence. There are some prime examples for this on these very forums.

a reply to: H1ght3chHippie

As I said to the long haired rocker who drinks vodka and coke (TrueBrit) - I understand what you are saying, I appreciate the point you make and I agree that meaning can potentially be skewed. However - I think this is a stubborn standpoint used by the grammar police because I have never not been able to use my own powers of deduction to understand what somebody is writing about. I actually looked online for some examples - they're all things we can discern the correct meaning from ourselves.

Grammar aside - there are lots of posts on here where the grammar is perfect but people argue over semantics. So the grammar rules are adhered to but misunderstanding still comes from the ambiguity of the meaning of words we use.

I honestly think you have a point but I also think most people are not very nice when they bash people for their bad grammar.

I fully believe we all have the correct amount of nous about us to discern what someone means even if they use bad grammar.

a reply to: and14263

I think its the sign of a person with nothing left to say. Its so dumb.

I do like good grammar. I think its a quality of common consideration. Also being that we have incredible technology now a days, we can spell everything correctly and not even know what ever language very well at all. Its really dumb either way.

"Oh you will scold me for not using spell check", or "oh you will praise me for using spell check". LOL

Have a good one.