Is the Aurora spy plane retired or was it just a myth?

a reply to: Zaphod58

They're only 15ft different in length though. I don't doubt what you're saying though, I mean the data is there and it shows only one boom. I guess what most people refer to as the double boom is actually down to atmospheric reflections like the authors conclude.

a reply to: gfad

Look at the shape of the two. The SR-71 is essentially as flat as can be, and knifes through the air. The Shuttle was a brick that bulled its way through.

originally posted by: gfad
a reply to: Zaphod58

... atmospheric reflections like the authors conclude.

Now, imagine if you were above that atmospheric layer. Where would a sonic boom reflect to then? Wouldn't it bounce off that boundary layer and reflect upwards? That would be a great way to silence them, now wouldn't it? A fast platform, flying above those layers would never be heard....at least not at the surface.

originally posted by: Krakatoa

originally posted by: gfad
a reply to: Zaphod58

... atmospheric reflections like the authors conclude.

Now, imagine if you were above that atmospheric layer. Where would a sonic boom reflect to then? Wouldn't it bounce off that boundary layer and reflect upwards? That would be a great way to silence them, now wouldn't it? A fast platform, flying above those layers would never be heard....at least not at the surface.

No. Anything within Earth's Atomsphere can be heard. It may not be able to be heard by a Human, though, it could be detected by a different type of sensor.

I

originally posted by: themadgenius

originally posted by: Krakatoa

originally posted by: gfad
a reply to: Zaphod58

... atmospheric reflections like the authors conclude.

Now, imagine if you were above that atmospheric layer. Where would a sonic boom reflect to then? Wouldn't it bounce off that boundary layer and reflect upwards? That would be a great way to silence them, now wouldn't it? A fast platform, flying above those layers would never be heard....at least not at the surface.

No. Anything within Earth's Atomsphere can be heard. It may not be able to be heard by a Human, though, it could be detected by a different type of sensor.

I

Agreed, but, "heard" is (in this context of discussion) meant to be the human ear. Anything can be detected electronically. However, I'll bet that 99.99999999% of "regular folk" don;t have the knowledge or $$ to own or operate the type of electronic "ears" needed. And, you need to know when to listen as well....which is in her favor I'm sure you'd agree.

Even if it's detected electronically, you can't pinpoint it, as shown in several studies in California, trying to pin down the skyquakes. So even if you DO detect it, and recognize it immediately as being an airborne source, which is extremely hard to do accurately, you aren't going to be able to tell exactly where it is.

originally posted by: Krakatoa

Now, imagine if you were above that atmospheric layer. Where would a sonic boom reflect to then? Wouldn't it bounce off that boundary layer and reflect upwards? That would be a great way to silence them, now wouldn't it? A fast platform, flying above those layers would never be heard....at least not at the surface.

I'd have to look at the paper again but I don't think that's how Snells law works in this case. The changes in atmospheric density don't work like a mirror. My understanding is that the sonic boom is reflected because it reaches an altitude where the speed of sound is equal to the speed of the boom. But for the same reason to break the sound barrier at higher altitude requires higher velocity so the sonic boom will still propagate to the ground. I'm assuming the air density reduces monotonically.

Also to say 99.99% of people don't have the ability to detect sonic booms is crazy if that 0.01% of people happen to be the ones you're hiding it from

The "skyquakes" could be heard/felt in the LA area depending on where the landing site was, and the approach to such..I can only hope that one day that project will be declassified, given the herculean effort by all involved to overcome enormous technological challenges in a limited time frame to field a program that was so hugely successful, it directly led to a follow-on that is still bringing an unmatched niche capability 20 years later...

There are clues and certain info regarding this out there in vague forms if you do some digging..I'd be delighted to share more, but as others have pointed out, Orange jumpsuits aren't my thing either..I will say though, that it is in no way whatsoever related to what is being called the Green Flame..

a reply to: EBJet

I think I know what you might be hinting at. I remember in the 90's, living in Los Angeles, I would often be sitting in the jacuzzi at my parents old home and staring up at the sky and stars cause it's relaxing and frequently would watch a star like object very very high up travel from horizon to horizon very quickly. Looked like it was heading outbound to the west from the general direction of edwards. At first I though neat a satellite but then one time I saw it do a bunch of barely perceptible S turns. Another time I saw it change direction and bank 90 degrees and start heading south east as if diverted from wherever it had to land to a new more south location. Most of the time when I saw it going out bound a few hours later ,yes still in the jacuzzi, and I'd see it retrace it's path and come back in bound.

And get this. Always on the same night. I want to say it was on a wednesday but I don't remember specifically and it was a long time ago. Usually outbound around 8:45 or 9ish. inbound around 10:30-11:30ish. Although the time span between out and in bound could have been shorter of longer give or take a hour or so.

It looked like a whitish star like light. around the magnitude of the more dim stars. Solid and consistent the whole time and not flickering or winking in and out. Moved aster than a satellite would cross from horizon to horizon. Plus it's hard to see satellites in the middle of LA's smog covered skies although I've seen them on occasion if it's clear enough.

I always figured they had created something very high altitude, higher than the green lady, that would head out west over the pacific make a giant loop somewhere over asia and then land again at the same base it came from. Maybe a craft designed to monitor nuclear threats, fly over the hot spots and scan everything it can. Maybe it was a SSTO type of craft delivering stuff into low earth orbit? I really don't know. But it was cool, whatever it was.

My take is that the skyquakes are not the green machine. She is sneakier than that. But I do believe she could rattle a few window frames if she wanted to, you know to say "hi" or something. But that's not her job. Although I wonder about the green light show. I think they are doing that on purpose when she away from home to scare the bejezzus out of a few foreign troublemakers. Since I don't believe she needs to do that the entire flight. But can on command. It's her way of saying "hi jerks...i seeeee what you're up to, knock it off." or "look what we got nah nah na-nah nah!!!"

a reply to: BASSPLYR

I think they are doing that on purpose when she away from home to scare the bejezzus out of a few foreign troublemakers. Since I don't believe she needs to do that the entire flight. But can on command. It's her way of saying "hi jerks...i seeeee what you're up to, knock it off." or "look what we got nah nah na-nah nah!!!"

a reply to: CiTrus90

I wonder if the pilots play that song when they are out there doing their thing. Would be awesome. Maybe broadcast it to the enemy when they do a over flight.

originally posted by: EBJet

There are clues and certain info regarding this out there in vague forms if you do some digging..I'd be delighted to share more, but as others have pointed out, Orange jumpsuits aren't my thing either..I will say though, that it is in no way whatsoever related to what is being called the Green Flame..

Is this the higher flying "yellow" light that (I am pretty sure) Zaph was talking about in one of the many recent mind blowing threads?

a reply to: keeley

No, it is not...Something entirely different, as well as different to what BASSPLYR saw whilst lounging in his folks' jacuzzi..

Could the sky quake have been a meteorite blowing up over the ocean?

Like the russian one that blew up over the city?

originally posted by: EBJet
a reply to: keeley

No, it is not...Something entirely different, as well as different to what BASSPLYR saw whilst lounging in his folks' jacuzzi..

Ok...so lets see if I have been keeping track of what has been discussed around here in the past few months
-the green lady
-the yellow high flying one
- Sr-72
-A...0's Phantasm

Am I missing anything?
Do we add this plane to the list above, or is it already there?
Where does the one that Bassplyr saw fit into the list?

One thing confuses me about the super loud sonic boom... I thought quiet boom technology was maturing, but it was based on the shape of the fuselage. Here, either something either "turned off" whatever it does that quiets the boom, or this was one of the first times it flew fast enough to make such a racket.

originally posted by: boomer135

This is somewhat true. Only difference is Manas had a supply of JP-7 not alot of people knew about and yes we refueled an aircraft that used JP-7. But we didn't land at another base to refuel on the ground and take off again to refuel said aircraft.



We loved flying T models just for the extra spotlight on the tail that shined down. but when my time was coming to an end in the Air Force they started getting rid of them for some reason.

First, you tease!

Having a small supply of JP-7 at Manas does explain all the fuel panel lockouts we would find in random places. Though I think the fuel supply dried up or was not used in 2007 onwards. I dont remember on any of my deployments a lockout panel being used or a "special fueling". Maybe they switched to the deid? I never had the pleasure of spending time there.

OH, and those extra blubs in the tail... not fun to change.

originally posted by: Pyle

originally posted by: boomer135

This is somewhat true. Only difference is Manas had a supply of JP-7 not alot of people knew about and yes we refueled an aircraft that used JP-7. But we didn't land at another base to refuel on the ground and take off again to refuel said aircraft.



We loved flying T models just for the extra spotlight on the tail that shined down. but when my time was coming to an end in the Air Force they started getting rid of them for some reason.

First, you tease!

Having a small supply of JP-7 at Manas does explain all the fuel panel lockouts we would find in random places. Though I think the fuel supply dried up or was not used in 2007 onwards. I dont remember on any of my deployments a lockout panel being used or a "special fueling". Maybe they switched to the deid? I never had the pleasure of spending time there.

OH, and those extra blubs in the tail... not fun to change.

Yeah we never messed with all that stuff at manas. We went to our jet and it was already fueled up for our mission.

Oh and my last deployment to manas was 2005 as the chief boom operator there. First and only time I flew commercial to anywhere. Took like two days to get there on the evergreen 747. Lol

a reply to: keeley

Speaking specifically to what caused the "skyquakes" in the early-mid 90's, I would say yes, add that one to the list, because it (and what it eventually developed into) is a different animal altogether.

originally posted by: EBJet

It wasn't over LA per se, but a bit to the North...Way too high and fast to see, and it would not be leaving any sort of contrail, no matter what altitude..

Was it a glide vehicle (at least the returning part that flew over LA)?

originally posted by: EBJet
a reply to: keeley

Speaking specifically to what caused the "skyquakes" in the early-mid 90's, I would say yes, add that one to the list, because it (and what it eventually developed into) is a different animal altogether.

Thanks for replying to my posts...

What do you mean by "a different animal" do you mean stuff like shape, construction, propulsion system, etc. or what its operational role would be, like recon, bomber, etc?