La Raza Promotes Washington Post Guide On Where People Can Vote Without An ID

a reply to: SlapMonkey

like the 15th, for example--that specifically state that:

This amendment wasn't even passed until the late 1800's and it's purpose was to tell states that they cannot take away the voting rights of black people. So until it was passed, where did we get our right to vote from? I can't see anything else in the document that states we have the right. Perhaps it was simply implied that it was a right as a function of our government?

Interesting note: Even after blacks were given the right to vote, the haters imposed literacy tests and poll taxes to stop them from voting....poll taxes-ID requirements? Hmmmm.

Existence at the level "they" claim is irrelevant--it exists, plain and simple. Numerous news organization and investigative reporters have uncovered a LOT of non-citizen voting problems. The fact that the DOJ opts to ignore this and not prosecute is not a bullet point you should use to pretend it doesn't happen on a relatively large scale.

Fraud does exist, just not at the level you believe. Studies conducted state that what little fraud does occur does not happen by mass, in-person voting. It's done by poll workers and machines.

Even under Bush's DOJ between 2002 and 2005, only 38 cases of fraud were ever brought up and a third of them were dropped.

When you ignore said "real facts and evidence" and argue that it isn't happening, nothing can change your opinion. Either you are choosing to ignore it or properly research it. In any event, you're using an arbitrary "not-at-the-level-they-claim" argument to pretend that the problem isn't a major issue.

Once again, I've never claimed it's not happening. I'm saying it's rare. You are claiming it's a major issue WITHOUT any real facts or evidence. Show me the real facts and evidence to support your claim...and spare me the YT videos. I was able to give a source written by an actual Lawyer that specializes in this field to show this issue is rare. Can you find something comparable?

I absolutely believe that voter fraud, no matter how small or large or common or uncommon is still a problem that needs attention. You don't wait for the few small holes letting water into your boat to become a giant hole breach before you start fixing the issue, so why ignore 'smaller' voter fraud problems until they become big ones? Your logic escapes the intelligent person.

This is the same argument used by the anti-2nd amendment crowd that tries to put more restrictions on our right to bear arms. They claim that gun violence is such a huge problem, when it's statistically a small problem. If we were to be consistent in your way of thinking, should we apply that to guns as well? See where I'm going with this?

You're advocating for the same sort of restrictions to be placed on our "right" to vote.

Second, you're right, I don't like Obama and I haven't ever since I voted for him in '08 and he turned out to be the exact opposite of everything that he claimed to be

You fell for his propaganda. Just like you're falling for the propaganda the Republicans are pushing to take us back to the days where we had poll taxes and literacy tests to stop blacks from voting.

you're using partisan politics to claim that you're fighting dissenters to your opinion that you claim base their arguments on partisan politics.

I'm exposing partisan politics in order to put a squash to the disinformation. Since I am not allied to either party, although I'm still a registered Republican, I don't have to follow their marching orders. Right now the marching orders of the Republican/conservatives/wannabe libertarians is to push this ID garbage.

People are fed the false idea that this is a real problem and they are whipped in to an outrage...just so that the people up top can find another way to take us back to the 1800's.

You say this is a huge problem.....prove it. Otherwise you are only advocating more government interference and control over our democratic process, and that is bad for the republic.

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: raymundoko

Several media reports have been used as evidence in this discussion.

Asking when the media can be trusted IS relevant whether you think so or not.

/shrug

It has been caught in vids where the illegals are caught and try to act innocent. It is right there for you to see for yourself.

originally posted by: raymundoko
a reply to: Gryphon66

The thin skin isn't from me. What was the point of your comment if not to belittle? Your comment was completely pointless and simply a way to make the report seem unimportant. That is the definition of belittle...

More Illegal voting:

Source

There is an important section that must be read from your source:

Maryland state law makes it easier for non-citizens, both those present legally and those in the country against the law, to vote. Maryland issues drivers licenses to legal and illegal aliens. Driver’s licenses in turn make it easier under the Motor Voter law to register to vote. Maryland also offers copious taxpayer-funded social programs to non-citizens in the state

So what is an ID requirement going to do if they are already giving ID's to illegals?

a reply to: Night Star

My point is this. It's a really simple point.

It is not unusual for many folks of many different political persuasions, to question the validity of what the media, any media, represents as the truth.

I was wondering why no one had questions about the media's agenda in regard to this subject as well.

Unless, you're stating that we can always believe everything we see on TV and on YouTube?

a reply to: sheepslayer247

I'm surprised that anyone would think that it is rare. Real facts or evidence? Did you not see the vid I posted? These people were caught on film! How much evidence do you need? The youtube vid was of what was on a t.v. news station.

People are fed the false idea that this is a real problem and they are whipped in to an outrage...just so that the people up top can find another way to take us back to the 1800's.

If fraud and deceit isn't a problem for you, that's kind of sad.

a reply to: Gryphon66

Unless, you're stating that we can always believe everything we see on TV and on YouTube?

Obviously no, I don't believe everything. I DO believe illegals are voting. I have known many throughout my long years of working beside them. Some ARE voting. We all know, or should know by now that they have stolen identities and fraudulent documents and the means to vote.

a reply to: sheepslayer247

Shame on Maryland for allowing such things. What ever happened to integrity and honor? Do these things no longer matter?

a reply to: Night Star

Good enough. Thanks for responding.

I wonder though, did the video and the news report challenge or confirm what you already "know to be true."

Did you think critically about the video, or the news report, or did you just say "of course" and move on?

Personally, I don't have any doubt that the occasional illegal is voting.

Just as I don't have any doubt of the rare instance of in person voter fraud.

New voter ID is not the solution to either problem, and certainly, the response in terms of new laws (government interference) and expenses (fiscal responsibility) cause me to be very leery of the true intent behind, as Governor Christie called it, Republican control of the election process.

Best,

But as far as giving illegals drivers licenses, the logic in many states is this:

It is safer to have all drivers on the road licensed and insured.

The IDs, under Federal law, clearly indicate the individual's status.

They are not allowed to board planes, etc.

/shrug States' Rights I guess.

a reply to: Gryphon66

I am sorry, I missed that part of your question. I was checked in at the poll with my Name and Address. I brought my ID because I was told I would need it because it was my first time voting in Cali, but the person at the polling station never asked for my ID.

a reply to: sheepslayer247

Because that ID says they aren't a cit...

Google an image of a DL for a non-cit. It says right on it "Not valid for federal purposes" indicating the person is not a US Cit. Colorado got in trouble a while back because they accidentally gave out a few hundred normal licenses to Illegal immigrants, and Cali did the first time around which got the law repealed.

Edit:

Source



Also, your poll tax reference is flawed, because a Federal State ID (NOT A DRIVERS LICENSE) is free for low income earners and can be obtained at the DMV with the right paperwork. For those who don't qualify it is between 3 and 20 bucks depending on the state.

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Night Star

Good enough. Thanks for responding.

I wonder though, did the video and the news report challenge or confirm what you already "know to be true."

Did you think critically about the video, or the news report, or did you just say "of course" and move on?

Personally, I don't have any doubt that the occasional illegal is voting.

Just as I don't have any doubt of the rare instance of in person voter fraud.

New voter ID is not the solution to either problem, and certainly, the response in terms of new laws (government interference) and expenses (fiscal responsibility) cause me to be very leery of the true intent behind, as Governor Christie called it, Republican control of the election process.

Best,

The illegals spoke in the video and there was proof of their wrong doing.
I feel that votes are rigged anyway. I have no faith in our political system. Everything and everyone seems to be corrupt.

a reply to: raymundoko

Thanks for answering.

Sounds like you got helped by an incompetent poll worker that didn't follow procedure.

a reply to: Night Star

I can appreciate your concerns, but, if it's "all rigged" how do we start to understand where to focus our frustration?

I mean, it could just as easily be true, given the corruption of everyone and everything associated with voting, that the "voter ID" issue or the "illegals voting" issue or any other issue is are merely false controversies generated by these hidden elite powers you speak of ... yes?

If I felt as you do, I'd probably just do what I could to eliminate politics from my life, including talking about it on the internet, LOL.

Best, thanks for your answers,

a reply to: Gryphon66

I would agree they were incompetent. Hence why they seemed to blatantly let non-citizens who couldn't even speak the language vote.

P.S. You HAVE to be able to speak English as it is a requirement of the Naturalization test. So don't pull (not saying you, but others have pulled it in other threads) the "They could have been citizens and you're being a bigot"...because that shows a gross misunderstanding of how to become a Citizen of the USA.

Sure, some Latino children who are Citizens by default do not speak ANY English until they enter school, but by the time they are of voting age you can bet your but they know how to speak English.

a reply to: raymundoko

But you said yourself, that California requires ID the first time a voter votes. They told you that they would check it. I also understand that CA requires the voter (after their first vote with an ID) must state their name and address and sign the poll book. (Affidavit method). Then the poll worker announces the name and address again, and verifies that the voter is on the registration list and that the information provided is correct.

That particular poll worker didn't follow procedure, and that's a problem that should be addressed.

Now, to take your personal experience (not saying that you are, but some certainly have) and amplify it a million-fold to suggest that hordes of illegals are voting everywhere, sponsored by Democrats, that all Democrats are dirty, lying cheats ... is the problem.

The only thing "rampant" in this issue is the Republican desire to control elections, in my opinion. By any means necessary.

a reply to: Gryphon66

Read the wording of the law, I posted it earlier. It says "May require", leaving it ambiguous at best.

a reply to: raymundoko

For me it is all about fraud actually. Until you've voted in So Cal and seen a truckload or van full of illegal immigrants with voting names like "Robert Cavenaugh" jump into a voting booth you won't know what I'm talking about...I've personally witnessed that every single election that I lived there. I've even said something about it and their response is "his name is on the registry"... One time I even got Mad and demanded he show his ID and the poll worker said " you don't have to show your ID" I called the police but they showed up far too late.

So you heard truckloads of brown people give white names? You stood there and listened? Wait... you stood outside and watched them pour out of vehicles, followed them in, listened to their names... then took it upon yourself to demand their rights be violated, loudly, and weren't tossed out yourself?

lol

I can't believe that anyone thinks illegals would risk their 'cover' to vote when millions of legal Americans can't be bothered.

a reply to: Gryphon66

If I felt as you do, I'd probably just do what I could to eliminate politics from my life, including talking about it on the internet, LOL.

OMG, that made me laugh! Thanks for the chuckle!

originally posted by: Night Star
a reply to: sheepslayer247

I'm surprised that anyone would think that it is rare. Real facts or evidence? Did you not see the vid I posted? These people were caught on film! How much evidence do you need? The youtube vid was of what was on a t.v. news station.

People are fed the false idea that this is a real problem and they are whipped in to an outrage...just so that the people up top can find another way to take us back to the 1800's.

If fraud and deceit isn't a problem for you, that's kind of sad.

I'm surprised that anyone would think this is common without facts or evidence to back up such a belief. A YT video is not evidence of fraud on a scale large enough to justify more government intervention and requirements on the voters. Your video only proves that it does happen. But I have provided an even better study that shows voter fraud is as likely to happen as getting hit by lightening.

Considering how rare it has PROVEN to be, are we going to push for more government in our lives all because we have been brainwashed in to believing them damn illegals are trying to steal our elections?

Please.....this entire conversation is absurd and I have still yet to see anyone provide evidence to back up their claims of massive fraud. The only thing I have seen is emotional cries by the outraged loons that have fallen for the propaganda.