President Obama Says U.S. Constitution Guarantees Same-Sex Couples the Right to Marry

originally posted by: Agit8dChop
I dont understand why marriage means so much to homosexual people.

Marriage is a church concept. The Church is a man made group of people who have their own way of doing things. They dont want to recognize homosexuality, they dont believe in it...

Ask that question in reverse.. Why does it matter so much to straight people who a person falls in love with and marries?


Secondly the push on gay marriage is not based on the religious doctrines. There push is against the government who passed laws saying they cant get married.

Religions can come to their own terms on how to deal with this issue.
The government on the other hand is legislating a religious viewpoint, which is against the constitution.

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

Ah I see what you are saying now. Got it. Thanks.

originally posted by: Sabiduria

I forgot same-sex couples don't have sex after they get married, that's only for heterosexual couples.

Now, don't go getting your panties in a wad over it. Apparently I'm quite a bit older than you. I remember when Sodomy was illegal and the only accepted form of consummating a marriage was the old school penis and vagina method... even among hetero married couples. I also remember when adults had to have blood tests to make sure they were compatible. But then, I also remember the days when a divorce was extremely difficult to obtain. I was not implying that homosexuals don't share their love.

My question is, why are we even fighting about this?

I figured we'd moved on from the "hate on them thar gays" thing as a nation a while ago.

Why is this still relevant? Just let 'em be miserable in marriage like the rest of us dirty breeders, I say.

originally posted by: Agit8dChop
I dont understand why marriage means so much to homosexual people.

Marriage is a church concept. The Church is a man made group of people who have their own way of doing things. They dont want to recognize homosexuality, they dont believe in it...

So why do homosexual people... want so badly to be a part of their ''church'' tradition that doesn't even accept them?

It's not just a church thing.

Imagine the person you have loved for 20 years gets sick and only family are allowed in... legally you are not family and not allowed in.
Their things disbursed to the closest family member... not you.
No shares of their retirement, social security, etc. Because despite being together forever, you are a nobody to them according to the law.

That is not fair.

Im as hetero as can be, but this is a messed up world we live in, and if are lucky enough to find someone to spend it with who loves you back... you should be afforded the same legal respects as anyone else.

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun
Just let 'em be miserable in marriage like the rest of us dirty breeders, I say.

You know, I see this a lot and I feel SO sorry for people who are miserable in their marriage! I can't imagine staying in a marriage where I was miserable. I ADORE my marriage! It makes me extremely happy every day!

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

I'll qualify that by saying I WAS miserable in marriage.

I'm not miserable anymore, but I'm also not married anymore either. Soooo win/win?

originally posted by: mrsdudara

originally posted by: Sabiduria

I forgot same-sex couples don't have sex after they get married, that's only for heterosexual couples.

Now, don't go getting your panties in a wad over it. Apparently I'm quite a bit older than you. I remember when Sodomy was illegal and the only accepted form of consummating a marriage was the old school penis and vagina method... even among hetero married couples. I also remember when adults had to have blood tests to make sure they were compatible. But then, I also remember the days when a divorce was extremely difficult to obtain. I was not implying that homosexuals don't share their love.

A) Sodomy means rape first, anal sex second.

B) My Grandma remembers having an African American slave, times have changed. Sex isn't just about a penis and a vagina anymore and hasn't been that way since the late 50's early 60's.

C) Adults had to have blood tests to make sure they were compatible before they got married? Never heard of that. Was it done only in the U.S?


P.s. I do apologize if I was being cranky, this subject is personal to me. I am bisexual and all I want is to be treated like every other human being and have the same equal rights as heterosexuals. If I was to leave my current fiance for a female partner, that I would still be able to have everything the same as if I were with a male.

Bisexuality is the ability to reach down someone's pants and be satisfied with whatever you find. :p

a reply to: ScientificRailgun

Nope, there are still tons of haters out there. It's the same with racism, one would like to think that as a nation, the U.S has moved passed that but it still exists today.

Mericans don't like anyone who is different than them. Especially if religion is involved

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

From US Constitution, 14th Amendment

We are all citizens of the United States and the various states.

Whether you choose to use the adjectives male, female, gay, straight, trans*, white, black, Scot-Irish, African American, religious, non-religious, rich, poor, Republican, Democrat, etc. etc. the phrase that always follows and is key to understanding what I think the President meant is American citizen.

I don't have a single right because I am a gay, white, Scot-Irish, non-religious, male ... but because all that is followed up by:

American citizen.

... and therefore no state can 1) abridge my privileges or immunities or 2)deprive me of life, liberty or happiness except by due process of law, and that law must 3)insure that all citizens have equal protection under the laws.

It is a bit late in coming in our history that neither my sex nor my orientation should deny me the equal right to marry whom I choose who choses to marry me ... but better late than never.

This is a tough one, as since Obama and his crew never have had a good grasp on what the constitution really means. They ignore it so much they cant possibly tell us what it truly means...

But I have to say this, I personally dont believe in gay marriage ....BUT... I dont think the government should be able to tell you if you can or cant marry somebody

a reply to: Sabiduria

From what I remember, there are blood types that will not be able to procreate. If a baby forms, it will be a miscarriage every time. The law was dropped not too many years before I was married. You couldn't get a marriage certificate without it.

As for sodomy, yes I know that is a rape term, but also an anal sex term. Law is/was not specific then.

I also know that before, oral or anal was not enough to seal the deal. The couple could annul the marriage walking away like it never happened.

As for being cranky.
That's ok. I get cranky about stuff I'm passionate about too. Part of being human I suppose.

a reply to: Wiz4769

Mr. Obama graduated magna cum laude from Harvard Law School.

Odds are, just off hand, I'd guess that fact alone puts him far ahead of about 99% of the American population in terms of legal understandings.

Circumstantial evidence, I know, but somewhat better than what you've presented.

So, the laws of a majority of US states, Supreme Court decisions, the Constitution and specifically the 14th Amendment have no bearing at all on the issue of marriage equality?

a reply to: Wiz4769

Why don't you believe in gay marriage?
Why should it matter if two consulting ladies/men love each other and want to spend the rest of their lives together?

There is an easy fix to the gay question -

Straight couples should stop having gay kids.

/end sarcasm

Yes this is how ridiculous this issue has become.

a reply to: mrsdudara

That's interesting about the blood thing. I wonder if that gets checked when couples are having problems conceiving?

I'm glad you know it is a rape term, most people don't want to think of it that way anymore because it's no longer in the dictionary. Yet they try to say that when the bible was talking about sodomy, it was anal sex when in the bible it's definition is rape.

That's crazy how you could walk away from a marriage with no issues because the marriage wasn't consummated. I guess they had to change that when they realized that most people were having sex before they were married.

a reply to: Sabiduria

If gay marriage is guaranteed under the equal protection clause then anything I do should be legal under the pursuit of happiness clause as long as I do not harm someone else.

"Gay" marriage is not guaranteed anywhere.

States offer marriage contracts.

A marriage contract involves two adult citizens who wish to enter into the agreement.

Contracts cannot be made available based on the sex, or in most states now, sexual orientation, of the parties to the contract.

The Fourteenth's guarantee of Equal Protection of the laws does not mean "one can do anything to be happy," but that each citizen is subject to and receives the benefits of the laws ... equally.

It's really not that complicated.

originally posted by: guitarplayer
a reply to: Sabiduria

If gay marriage is guaranteed under the equal protection clause then anything I do should be legal under the pursuit of happiness clause as long as I do not harm someone else.

AND...it should be, if it does not involve minors nor the harm of any non-consenting adult!

Where is the problem with basic logic?

Edit to Add: I am fairly certain that the "Pursuit of Happiness" clause that you speak of is in the Declaration of Independence; not the official United States Constitution.

2 different documents....2 different times....2 different worlds

Quit looking for non-official documents to back your biogtry...look at the facts! Fact is: Gays have just as much right to marry as straghties. the 14th amendment says so....at least in the eyes of ALL things government related.

originally posted by: LeatherNLace

originally posted by: guitarplayer
a reply to: Sabiduria

If gay marriage is guaranteed under the equal protection clause then anything I do should be legal under the pursuit of happiness clause as long as I do not harm someone else.

AND...it should be, if it does not involve minors nor the harm of any non-consenting adult!

Where is the problem with basic logic?

Edit to Add: I am fairly certain that the "Pursuit of Happiness" clause that you speak of is in the Declaration of Independence; not the official United States Constitution.

2 different documents....2 different times....2 different worlds

Quit looking for non-official documents to back your biogtry...look at the facts! Fact is: Gays have just as much right to marry as straghties. the 14th amendment says so....at least in the eyes of ALL things government related.

Why the bigot remark? I could care less what people do in the privacy of their own homes. Yes I know the declaration of independence is separate from the constitution, didn’t Lincoln use the declaration for the basis that all me are created equal for his emancipation proclamation?