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Now the most shameful of the customs of the Babylonians is as follows: every woman of the country must sit down in the precincts of Aphrodite once in her life and have commerce with a man who is a stranger
--in the sacred enclosure of Aphrodite sit great numbers of women with a wreath of cord about their heads; some come and others go; and there are passages in straight lines going between the women in every direction, through which the strangers pass by and make their choice.
Here when a woman takes her seat she does not depart again to her house until one of the strangers has thrown a silver coin into her lap and has had commerce with her outside the temple, and after throwing it he must say these words only: "I demand thee in the name of the goddess Mylitta": now Mylitta is the name given by the Assyrians to Aphrodite
the silver coin may be of any value; whatever it is she will not refuse it, for that is not lawful for her, seeing that this coin is made sacred by the act
and she follows the man who has first thrown and does not reject any: and after that she departs to her house, having acquitted herself of her duty to the goddess, nor will you be able thenceforth to give any gift so great as to win her. So then as many as have attained to beauty and stature are speedily released, but those of them who are unshapely remain there much time, not being able to fulfil the law; for some of them remain even as much as three or four years: and in some parts of Cyprus too there is a custom similar to this.
and many women who do not deign to mingle with the rest, because they are made arrogant by wealth, drive to the temple with pairs of horses in covered carriages, and so take their place, and a large number of attendants follow after them
originally posted by: Utnapisjtim
Did Babylonian regulations really demand that all women at some time in life should work as street hookers? John the Scribe's "Babylon, Mother of Harlots" comes to mind. Anyway…
Looks like Herodotus has been to one of them clubs and instead of the thinking the obvious, that it's a sex club and organised sex-trade, he understands it as something profound and religious, quite funny. The name of the goddess he ascribes the Assyrians is unknown to me, and I couldn't find any references to her in my books, so for now, I guess Herodotus' explanation that this 'Mylitta' is to be understood as Aphrodite, Greek goddess of love, is good I suppose. Aphrodite was known to the Hebrews as Ishtar or Astarte, goddess of love, sex and fertility, but also a goddess of war.
I find it amusing that Herodot seems to have gained deep insights into these ehrm, mysteries, and he seems to have been a diligent in his research to uncover all the details, complete with secret cloathing, code phrase and...
I don't quite know what to make of all of this, but I found the quoted text rather amusing, and thought I'd share. I also find the link between Gr. Aphrodite (Bab. Inanna, Heb. Ishtar) and religiously motivated prostitution intriguing. All over the ancient Middle East there seem to have been organised prostitution connected to certain temples and gods. Some of this is reflected by the Old Testament, and in Hosea, God actually orders the prophet to buy two prostitutes and have children with them. Guess things were different back then. Any thoughts?
originally posted by: Krazysh0t
originally posted by: Utnapisjtim
Did Babylonian regulations really demand that all women at some time in life should work as street hookers? John the Scribe's "Babylon, Mother of Harlots" comes to mind. Anyway…
Calling them street hookers is a little low. This is clearly describing a whore house, albeit a holy whore house. While still prostitution, it is really a step up from street whoring.
Looks like Herodotus has been to one of them clubs and instead of the thinking the obvious, that it's a sex club and organised sex-trade, he understands it as something profound and religious, quite funny. The name of the goddess he ascribes the Assyrians is unknown to me, and I couldn't find any references to her in my books, so for now, I guess Herodotus' explanation that this 'Mylitta' is to be understood as Aphrodite, Greek goddess of love, is good I suppose. Aphrodite was known to the Hebrews as Ishtar or Astarte, goddess of love, sex and fertility, but also a goddess of war.
I find it amusing that Herodot seems to have gained deep insights into these ehrm, mysteries, and he seems to have been a diligent in his research to uncover all the details, complete with secret cloathing, code phrase and...
Yeah, I'm sure it took MUCH... erm... "studying" on his part.
I don't quite know what to make of all of this, but I found the quoted text rather amusing, and thought I'd share. I also find the link between Gr. Aphrodite (Bab. Inanna, Heb. Ishtar) and religiously motivated prostitution intriguing. All over the ancient Middle East there seem to have been organised prostitution connected to certain temples and gods. Some of this is reflected by the Old Testament, and in Hosea, God actually orders the prophet to buy two prostitutes and have children with them. Guess things were different back then. Any thoughts?
Translation from that passage:
She accepts the first man who claims her without rejecting anyone, then accepts the money he handed her without question, and then when she is done having sex, her duty to the goddess is done and she can go back home. Also you aren't allowed to give her any gifts to win her heart (this is all STRICTLY platonic apparently). Then he goes on to say that all the hot girls cycle through this phase quickly while the ugly ones stay behind unable to fulfill their duty to the goddess, staying as long as three or four years.
By the way to your point that things were different back then. Prostitution has only been illegal for about 100 years or so. Other than that, it's been a 100% legal and accepted profession for women. To be honest, it should be legal again, but that isn't the point of the thread. S&F
originally posted by: Utnapisjtim
Well, the picking up part happened inside the temple complex, but the hrm, commerce itself, was done outside, in the street while people watched, err I mean worshipped.
Hmm. It's an interesting subject, but I get the feeling he is not being completely sincere somehow.
In Norway prostitution was legal until a few years back when the new sex-trade laws were made effective. Now it is still legal to sell sex (i.e. work as a prostitute) but it is illegal to pay for sex, and the fines are sky-high. Procuring or pimping has been illegal since quite some time though. That this is all messed up is an understatement. Prostitution is called the oldest trade in the world. And it is outlawed. Ironic.
originally posted by: Krazysh0t
originally posted by: Utnapisjtim
Well, the picking up part happened inside the temple complex, but the hrm, commerce itself, was done outside, in the street while people watched, err I mean worshipped.
I don't see it specifically saying that the act takes place on the street (though I wouldn't rule it out), just that it happened to be outside the temple. For all we know, they went to a room somewhere else or there was a designated area to do the nasty.
Hmm. It's an interesting subject, but I get the feeling he is not being completely sincere somehow.
Lol, What gave you that idea? The fact that he goes into considerable detail about how this all takes place? I'm surprised he didn't describe the clothes they are wearing as well. He would be a better man than I if he could do all that studying without getting some first hand experience. I'm sure he participated, in fact, you'd have to present evidence that he DIDN'T participate for me to believe otherwise.
In Norway prostitution was legal until a few years back when the new sex-trade laws were made effective. Now it is still legal to sell sex (i.e. work as a prostitute) but it is illegal to pay for sex, and the fines are sky-high. Procuring or pimping has been illegal since quite some time though. That this is all messed up is an understatement. Prostitution is called the oldest trade in the world. And it is outlawed. Ironic.
We can thank the Abrahamic religions for that "blessing"...
originally posted by: St Udio
Sacred prostitution
it seems that modern ISIS & Its Islamic Legal Authorities are building upon that ancient Sex & sex-slaves as a intregal aspect of Islam...
the article is on Yahoo News (if you can get Yahoo site to stabilize, I have real problems with the Yahoo page crashing today (oct 14th noon eastern time)
and on the top of the last tower there is a large cell, and in the cell a large couch is laid, well covered, and by it is placed a golden table: and there is no image there set up nor does any human being spend the night there except only one woman of the natives of the place, whomsoever the god shall choose from all the woman, as say the Chaldeans who are the priests of this god.
originally posted by: Utnapisjtim
Yes, I suppose you are right. But on page 152 (fig. 124) in 'Gods, Demons and Symbols of Ancient Mesopotamia' ISBN 978-0-292-70794-8 -- you can see "...from the Middle Assyrian temple of Ishtar at Assur. A lead figurine in the form of a scene of sexual intercourse, apparently taking place on an altar." They weren't shy back then, so public Ishtar bang... worship in the streets may have been commonplace for all we know.
But back to Herodotus and his claims, there seem to be doubts of his report's validity.
I don't know, I just find it a bit funny that he seems very interested in these "most shameful of the customs of the Babylonians" as he puts it. I suspect that he is putting more weight on the religious part of this custom, and downplaying the obvious, almost seeing the sex part as something arbitrary to this highly religious aspects of it all... get it?
I wouldn't blame anyone actually. It's the way the world has turned out. Never has there been more sex-trade, and never have the laws against it been as strict. So yes, all iron in clay.
originally posted by: Ridhya
a reply to: Utnapisjtim
Yep heaven and earth, a.k.a. the mother and father gods, the creators of mankind, the divine duality.
Also: institutionalised way to pick the hottest girl around and have sex with her, even though you're an old wrinkly priest.
originally posted by: Pinke
Many historians believe that Herodotus never actually visited Babylon, [...] Let me know if you find anything out more solid on this, because as far as I know we still haven't found any evidence for it.
I say Hail to Inanna, First daughter of the Moon!
The male prostitutes comb their hair before you.
They decorate the napes of their necks with coloured scarfs,
They drape the cloak of the gods about your shoulders.
The righteous man and woman walk before you.
They hold the soothing harp by their sides.
They grasp the spear in their hands.