Time Has No Shape!

i've seen some posts on the shape of time lately, and i just wanted to tell you guys that you're wrong. Some say the shape of time is a circle, which is completely ignorant. People only come to that simple conclusion because they assume time is infinitum, which it isn't ( everything has a beginning and an end), and so they immeadiately turn to the circle to display the quality of time's "infinitum." A recent post suggested time was an ellipse, or oval, so stretched that the sideds almost touch, and that the reason for ghosts or precognation, was the result of looking at the opposing side of the ellipse from our current standpoint. this is stupid for two reasons:
1.How can the past lay on one side of the ellipse and the future on the other? If it were true we'd eventually come right back to the beginning of time.
2. if time is circular or elliptical , then what is in the area of this circle or ellipse? random space? And if we cant seem to see through to the other side of a circle, then how could we ever see to the other side of an ellipse? Just because the sides are squished together, and the gap between is smaller, does not mean that we could suddenly percieve through the space between.
since time cannot be circular, mainly because we would just keep coming back to point A over and over again, the only possible explanation is a spiral or helix, right?
Nope, not at all. Folks, im gonna tell you right now, time does not have shape. time is what creates shape. When you say time is elliptical or circular or linear, funnel shaped, spiral, etc., you are merely just comparing the entire universes movements to the previously differing spacial coordinates. When we see something moving in time we just compare the object to where it previously was. You are looking at the path of the universe through time, not the actual "shape" of it.
time does not have a shape at all, for it is a dimension itself. because, for something to exist, it must have 3 spacial coordinates (the three dimensions) AND a moment in time. If it does not have a dimension of time, then it never, or ever will have existed in reality. but
according to what pop culture teaches us, there are three dimensions:
0-a point
1-a line
2- a shape
3- a figure
it's belived we live in the third dimension. But we're actually in the fourth! because for any of these points, lines, shapes and figures to exist in reality, it needs to be in time. so now the chart goes:
0-time
1-point
2-line
3-shape
4-figure

anyways, bottomline, time has no shape, because it is a dimension itself. To say time is an ellipse, is like saying the second dimension is a cube. It just dosent make since, because your giving a dimension qualitys of a totally different dimension.

Mod Edit: Decappified title.

[edit on 8-12-2004 by dbates]

Your very close I havent replied to the other threads you mentioned because they just didnt contain any logic. Time is an arbitrary idea that is needed to solve equations. Thats it. What most people consider time, is actually speed of motion. The closest easily understandible definition of time is change.

[edit on 12/8/04 by Kidfinger]

Originally posted by Kidfinger
Your very close

I havent replied to the other threads you mentioned because they just didnt contain any logic. Time is an arbitrary idea that is needed to solve equations. Thats it. What most people consider time, is actually speed of motion. The closest easily understandible definition of time is change.

[edit on 12/8/04 by Kidfinger]

Does time exist in a void where there is absolutely no change? Like if
space were totally empty. I don't think it does.
I don't understand that "shape" thing about time either that
others talk about.

Originally posted by CountFranklin
i've seen some posts on the shape of time lately, and i just wanted to tell you guys that you're wrong. Some say the shape of time is a circle, which is completely ignorant.

First...you already have this here:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Second, why claim that everyone else is wrong or ignorant when it comes to discussing something such as "time". I think you just discounted yourself as a legitimate poster by claiming to be so much smarter than everyone else.

PS) Thread Closed

Per request of the author...

Old thread deleted and this one is re-opened.

Rude, but I would like to know how you can call others stupid because they presented a theory? whether it was fact-based or not, a person who has the ability to come to a thoughtful conclusion cannot be stupid. A lot of great inventions and ideas come from one thought/idea/formulation. A lot of times these ideas are presented without any evidence to back them up. And thus begins a chain. Whereas other people reflect upon it, develop it, then present it as fact. Of course this is just my opinion.

Secondly, I agree with you in regards to time being a dimension. One of the theories that I have heard is that time stands still and only events and circumstances change within it.
As for it having a beginning and end, i would think it was more a end for us. meaning that our time in this dimension would end. And a beginning for others, meaning that those in a dimension below us would take our place. If this makes sense. Again, just one thought or theory.



[edit on 8-12-2004 by blend56]

cool, cool, just tryin to spark inspirational discussion

Originally posted by blend56
Rude, but I would like to know how you can call others stupid because they presented a theory? whether it was fact-based or not, a person who has the ability to come to a thoughtful conclusion cannot be stupid. A lot of great inventions and ideas come from one thought/idea/formulation. A lot of times these ideas are presented without any evidence to back them up. And thus begins a chain. Whereas other people reflect upon it, develop it, then present it as fact. Of course this is just my opinion.

Secondly, I agree with you in regards to time being a dimension. One of the theories that I have heard is that time stands still and only events and circumstances change within it.
As for it having a beginning and end, i would think it was more a end for us. meaning that our time in this dimension would end. And a beginning for others, meaning that those in a dimension below us would take our place. If this makes sense. Again, just one thought or theory.

They weren't theories.

They were hypotheses at the best.

Hypotheses are usually "educated guesses". Theories are much stronger.

theories, hypothesis, doesn't matter....point is still the same. The wording may be inaccurate......but the meaning is still there.

b56

The "meaning" is corrupted because people (especially people with minimal experience in science and technology) will misinterpret those ideas as truth.

EDIT: Deny ignorance... please.

[edit on 8-12-2004 by Nox]

I misinterpreted what your post was in response to. You are absolutely correct. I inaccurately used theories instead if hypothesis in my previous post.

Thanks for correcting my error.

B56



[edit on 8-12-2004 by blend56]

Time doesn't exist - it is just an illusion created by your mind... you are here - you were born, you live, you are going to die - you relate to the time as to the space between (and it's shape can be anything you wish to be)

Drunken thoughts....

Sorry.

I guess it WOULD seem like I'm trying to put a restriction on imagination.

I'm just picky like that. I'm an assistance teacher for an undergrad class and I get extremely annoyed when people present ideas without mathematical, logical, or statistical evidence for their statements. It just sounds a lot like it was pulled out of their arses.

What am I supposed to make of what they said? "Oh it makes sense (common sense, ), I guess I should give him points. He passes the class."

That's ridiculous. It's a technical class. I guess I'm treating this SCIENCE and TECH forum the same way I treat my students.

Whatever. I'm just worried because some people have a hard time distinguishing law, axiom, and theory from "common sense".

Remember that "common sense" often contradicts itself.

But yeah, if people are careful about this, I wouldn't mind as much. I guess I should keep my nose out of any business that doesn't interest me.

Apologies!

[edit on 8-12-2004 by Nox]

As any self respecting fan of the WGLF would know, "TIME IS A CUBE WITH 4 SIDES INSTEAD OF A PYRAMID WITH A DIAMETER OF PI."

Originally posted by BillyD
As any self respecting fan of the WGLF would know, "TIME IS A CUBE WITH 4 SIDES INSTEAD OF A PYRAMID WITH A DIAMETER OF PI."

Shoot me.

Mind if you telling us what WGLF is? It sounds hilarious.

It's the West Georgia Liberation Front. They're the debate team from West Georgia State U. Their strat is a kinda post-modern satire of policy debate. Interesting if you're into that kinda thing. Check out their website if you want to see some of the wackiness....

stu.westga.edu...

maybe it was just pulled out of there arses. But if we dismiss an idea that has even a slight possibility of truth or functionality to it, then we are the stupid ones.

I understand teaching can be equally as frustrating for the teacher as well as the student. But I doubt you just give them points for "common sense".
You sound as though you are very good at what you do and I bet your students finish your class understanding exactly how to reasearch and present data.

I am just saying that there is a need for people who just create ideas and people who study and develop them. That the two compliment one another.

I'll agree with you on that.

I was just unconfortable about the way ideas were presented, and then just TOSSED.

Yes, that's exactly what happened. A lot of random ideas being presented, then no further details or explanations... not even examples of how their theories can be applied to events or situations in real life.

The ideas are just introduced, and forgotten.

What happened to building on those ideas? Offering further evidence and logic for support?

I give points for originality, but my professor wouldn't want me TAing for him ever again if I just showed him ideas with no further elaboration.

Did you find any triumphs in regards to students who you thought just "weren't going to get" and all of a sudden, turned it around? That has got to be one of the most fantastic experiences for a teacher. I know it is for me when I train a new employee. At first I think that someone is not suitable for the position, then I try to find a way to present data to him/her in a way he/she can comprehend. And when it works, the feeling is better then any drug on the market.

Do you find this true in your position?

Does time follow some sort of generaly accepted universality? Is there a mathematical forumulation for time?

Deep