Federal Court blocks Texas Voter ID law: Calling it a "Poll Tax"

a reply to: charles1952

So your saying there is no proof..then why believe?

So are you saying when a Republican wins a seat or presidency...illegal voting miraculously disappears?

I do not say illegal voting does not take place..I will that is it so small that it does not have any effect on outcomes.

As a HIspanic Texan, I've been voting since I was 18, with and ID/DL, and have never had a problem doing so. The issues you state, I've never seen in my life, living in Texas, although I'm assuming you've experienced all of these claims firsthand.

As for making sure one is a citizen, that you claim has been done when they register, I have to say that you are wrong. My SO just registered recently, and I have in front of me a copy of the voter registration card from the post office. You fill it out, and mail it in. You don't even have to have a DL or SSN to do so. Where's the proof in that? It is very simple to fraudulently register to vote, therefore requiring an ID to actually go the the polls and do so, puts an undue burden only on those that are illegally voting and cry "racism" at the thought that they actually provide legitimate proof of their identity.

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic
Texas has a long and strong reputation for disenfranchising its minority voters:

Since 1895, Texas has done all they can to limit the electorate to wealthier, white people. After Reconstruction, they had All-White Primary Elections, then said that the political parties could choose the voters, thus disenfranchising minorities. They had Literacy and “Secret Ballot” Restrictions until 1970. They had actual Poll Taxes until 1966, disenfranchising minorities once again. So, they tried having people re-register every time they voted and purging the entire electorate. This went on until 1982. Then they tried disenfranchising the youth with a law saying it was necessary to own land to vote until 1979. They have been reducing early voting hours, changing voting laws without clearance, rejecting registrations (without notifying the voter), limiting the number of new registrations and gerrymandering their districts along racial lines up to THIS YEAR! ALL OF THESE moves designed to limit minority voters have been struck down by courts. Yet Texas still pushes for their goal: to limit poor, non-white and young voters from voting. It's always been their purpose and has had the desired outcome until the Feds came in and made them stop.

This history describes not only a penchant for discrimination in Texas with respect to voting, but it exhibits a recalcitrance that has persisted over generations despite the repeated intervention of the federal government and its courts on behalf of minority citizens.

In each instance, the Texas Legislature relied on the justification that its discriminatory measures were necessary to combat voter fraud. In some instances, there were admissions that the legislature did not want minorities voting.
...
This history of discrimination has permeated all aspects of life in Texas. Dr. Burton detailed the racial disparities in education, employment, housing, and transportation, which are the natural result of long and systematic racial discrimination. As a result, Hispanics and African-Americans make up a disproportionate number of people living in poverty, and thus have little real choice when it comes to spending money on anything that is not a necessity.

Minorities continue to have to overcome fear and intimidation when they vote. Reverend Johnson testified that there are still Anglos at the polls who demand that minority voters identify themselves, telling them that if they have ever gone to jail, they will go to prison if they vote. Additionally, there are poll watchers who dress in law enforcement-style clothing for an intimidating effect

THAT'S why this voter ID law was blocked. There's noting wrong with making sure a person is a citizen, but they have already done that by registering. Forcing people to prove identification at the polls, when they have already proven who they are to register, places undue burden on citizens.

Texas Decision

a reply to: charles1952

Here's some interesting info on that Kennedy/Chicago election fraud....

...the U.S. Attorney in Chicago at the time, Daniel Webb, estimated that at least 100,000 fraudulent votes (10 percent of all votes in the city) had been cast. Sixty-five individuals were indicted for federal election crimes, and all but two (one found incompetent to stand trial and another who died) were convicted.

This case of voter fraud is worth studying today be­cause it illustrates the techniques that political machines and organized political groups use to steal elections. Even in the present day, this threat is not hypothetical ......

Where There's Smoke, There's Fire: 100,000 Stolen Votes in Chicago

History repeats itself time after time.

originally posted by: Onslaught2996

I do not say illegal voting does not take place..I will that is it so small that it does not have any effect on outcomes.

So if it is just a small amount of criminal activity, then no laws or corrections need to be taken?

a reply to: Onslaught2996

You may very be right that only a small number of votes are involved. Of course, we have no way of knowing how many. Franken, in Minnesota won by 306 votes, but only after boxes of ballots were found in the trunk of someone's car. Kennedy won by 113,000 votes, that's over the entire country, of course.

Besides, once we tell the voters that people may be cancelling their vote with illegal ballots, they'll get even more frustrated, angry and cynical.

Let's look at this from an entirely different angle. The people don't trust a government which they believe is covering things up, doing shady political maneuvers, lying, and almost any other corrupt thing you can think of. It would seem to make sense to make a change so that the government could honestly say, "Here, in this small area, we have taken a step against corruption, deceit, and fraud. Don't give up all hope yet, Americans."

a reply to: beezzer

Did not say that..but it is not on the scale the right would have us to believe.

It should be punished and such..but the right needs to stop lying about how big the issue actually is.

So illegal immigrants come every year and supposedly vote democrat..was illegal immigration down when a republican president in office..or were those just flukes?

for reference only.

When You Need ID to Vote (in Chicago)

[ I noticed they no longer accept certified death certificates as valid I.D. ]

originally posted by: Onslaught2996
a reply to: beezzer

Did not say that..but it is not on the scale the right would have us to believe.

So I ask, what is the scale (in your opinion)?

It should be punished and such..but the right needs to stop lying about how big the issue actually is.

So what? A slap on the wrist? Ignore the illegalities? Don't make any laws to prevent it?

So illegal immigrants come every year and supposedly vote democrat..was illegal immigration down when a republican president in office..or were those just flukes?

I think much depends on the actual people running for office!

a reply to: Onslaught2996

Did not say that..but it is not on the scale the right would have us to believe.

It should be punished and such..but the right needs to stop lying about how big the issue actually is.

I dislike the word lying, especially when used about people we know little about. Here, your use is illogical. How do you know the Right is lying? What figure are they using, and what figure do you KNOW is right? See? Can we drop the lying business?

"It should be punished and such . . ." Have you got something against crime prevention? Voter fraud is difficult to prove in a court, so are other political crimes. Why don't we just prevent some of the occurrences? Or, do you only want to punish the few who are stupid enough to get caught?

a reply to: xuenchen

Still playing the false narrative that democrats only get in because of illegal voting...but here is the truth..spoken by some republicans.

Republicans Admit Voter-ID Laws Are Aimed at Democratic Voters

Pennsylvania House Majority Leader Mike Turzai told a gathering of Republicans that their voter identification law would “allow Governor Romney to win the state of Pennsylvania.” That summer, at an event hosted by the Heritage Foundation, former Wall Street Journal columnist John Fund conceded that Democrats had a point about the GOP’s focus on voter ID, as opposed to those measures—such as absentee balloting—that are vulnerable to tampering. “I think it is a fair argument of some liberals that there are some people who emphasize the voter ID part more than the absentee ballot part because supposedly Republicans like absentee ballots more and they don’t want to restrict that,” he said.

former Florida GOP chairman Jim Greer told The Palm Beach Post that the explicit goal of the state’s voter-ID law was Democratic suppression. “The Republican Party, the strategists, the consultants, they firmly believe that early voting is bad for Republican Party candidates,” Greer told the Post. “It’s done for one reason and one reason only ... ‘We’ve got to cut down on early voting because early voting is not good for us,’” he said. Indeed, the Florida Republican Party imposed a host of policies, from longer ballots to fewer precincts in minority areas, meant to discourage voting. And it worked. According to one study, as many as 49,000 people were discouraged from voting in November 2012 as a result of long lines and other obstacles.

Also notice how you leave out how the right also committs voter fraud.

Wisconsin Republican Donor Gets Caught Voting Chicago-Style For Gov. Scott Walker

Caught on Tape: Wisconsin Republican Committing Vote Fraud in Assembly

GOP Donor Caught Voting 5 Times In Gov. Scott Walker's Recall Election

Apparently it's only an issue when the left is accused of doing it.

a reply to: Onslaught2996

Fine, thanks for showing that it happens. Let's stamp it out, as far as we can. Voter ID, crack down on absentee voting, anything else you can think of, add that in.

This is not about one party stealing power, it's about creating a trustworthy system. Let's eliminate as many possibles holes and weaknesses as we can, regardless of who it benefits. With me?

originally posted by: charles1952
a reply to: Onslaught2996

Did not say that..but it is not on the scale the right would have us to believe.

It should be punished and such..but the right needs to stop lying about how big the issue actually is.

I dislike the word lying, especially when used about people we know little about. Here, your use is illogical. How do you know the Right is lying? What figure are they using, and what figure do you KNOW is right? See? Can we drop the lying business?

"It should be punished and such . . ." Have you got something against crime prevention? Voter fraud is difficult to prove in a court, so are other political crimes. Why don't we just prevent some of the occurrences? Or, do you only want to punish the few who are stupid enough to get caught?

Well what figures are you using to show it is a rampant issue?

What part about is should be punished was not understood? Maybe I will make it more clearer...punish the illegal voters.

Unless the right has actual figures..it is a lie that they just made up. Show us how rampant it is and then that democrats succeed because of this overwhelming abuse of illegal voting or are you just parroting something you heard?

a reply to: Onslaught2996

You honestly believe that voter ID laws will only benefit republicans?

What laws would have to be put into place to stop republicans from cheating?

a reply to: Onslaught2996

How do you catch illegal voters?

One way might be to make it more difficult to vote illegally. . . naaah.

a reply to: Onslaught2996

Actually, I was showing you that even in Chicago an I.D. is necessary sometimes.

Chicago votes extremely high Democrat all the time.

You didn't read the page.



[ The museums even have some ancient ballots in sealed cases that show checkmarks for Republicans !!!

People look and point at them in awe ]

originally posted by: beezzer
a reply to: Onslaught2996

You honestly believe that voter ID laws will only benefit republicans?

What laws would have to be put into place to stop republicans from cheating?

I don't believe it will but apparently some republicans do. I think the laws should be enforced.

I just don't like the false narrative that only dems do it and that is such an overwhelmingly huge problem that democrats benefit from it, which explains how they get in office.

So I ask again..does the rampant illegal voting miraculously disappear when a right candidate gets in office or it happens on such a small scale..it doesn't effect any outcomes?

By the way..just because I say small scale..does not mean to forget about it or to not enforce it.

Just stop lying about how big of a problem it actually is.

a reply to: Onslaught2996

The reason why so many believe that it benefits the left is due to the fact that the left defends the illegality!

It's the republicans who are trying to enact laws that would make it harder to vote illegally.

Yes, republicans cheat.
Yes, democrats cheat.

But it's only republicans that want to STOP THE CHEATING!

originally posted by: Onslaught2996

By the way..just because I say small scale..does not mean to forget about it or to not enforce it.

Oh, so it IS a problem.

Just stop lying about how big of a problem it actually is.

Oh, so it isn't a big problem.

(I'm confused)

a reply to: Onslaught2996

Dear Onslaught2996,

Well, you were the one saying the right was lying. Shouldn't you be the one to explain how you know?

BUT, OK, YOU WIN. It's a tiny little problem that both parties benefit from (I'm only speaking for myself). So now you and I are fully agreed.

Why in the world should we prevent the states from trying to solve this tiny, non-partisan problem? Fraud exists, let's let the states take steps to fix it.

What could possibly be wrong? ID cards at $10 dollars or less. The really poor can apply for an exemption from the fee. Everybody has to show they're a citizen to get the card. You need the card or some equally good ID to vote. What's the problem?

With respect,
Charles1952

"Nelva Gonzales Ramos" ... Gee, looks like someone should have recused themselves from the case. I thought judges were supposed to be impartial...looks like she has a "perro" this race.

ID is to verify the person is actually able to vote and has not voted before.