Ebola Airborne? The Truth.

The scientific definition for "airborne transmission" is very specific: "Airborne spread among humans implies inhalation of an infectious dose of virus from a suspended cloud of small dried droplets."

In contrast, Ebola and flu spread in the air via moist -not dried- particles, but definitely have the ability to spread via aerosol transmission - the moist droplets just do not hang out in the air for very long and aerosol transmission is not efficient. However, Ebola does have the ability to infect lung cells.

Researchers from the University of Manitoba in Winnipeg showed that airborne Ebola in piglets infected macaque monkeys, leaving evidence of infection in the monkeys' lungs. Worrisome because macaques and humans are genetically close.

Marburg and Ebola viruses as aerosol threats.

....(Marburg and Ebola viruses) are highly infectious as respirable particles under laboratory conditions. For these and other reasons, filoviruses are classified as category A biological weapons.

Lethal experimental infections of rhesus monkeys by aerosolized Ebola virus.

....Demonstration of fatal aerosol transmission of this virus in monkeys reinforces the importance of taking appropriate precautions to prevent its potential aerosol transmission to humans.

Could Ebola now be airborne? New research shows lethal virus can be spread from pigs to monkeys without contact

....It was previously thought the untreatable virus, which causes massive internal bleeding and multiple organ failure, could only be transmitted through contact with infected blood.

But now Canadian researchers have carried out experiments showing how monkeys can catch the deadly disease from infected pigs without coming into direct contact.

...The virus is known to be transmitted through direct contact with the blood or secretions of an infected person, or objects that have been contaminated with infected secretions.

...Experts say this extreme virulence is its weak spot. The virus can be contained because it kills its victims faster than it can spread to new ones. However, if the disease is now airborne it could make containment more difficult.

....Researchers at the University of Manitoba in Winnipeg deliberately infected six piglets with the ebola virus and put them in pens where macaque monkeys were housed in wire cages.

Within eight days all four monkeys caught the virus through indirect contact, according to the study published in the journal Scientific Reports.

...large droplets of moisture containing the virus were being exhaled with the piglets' breath.

'They can stay in the air, but not long, they don't go far,' he told the broadcaster. 'But they can be absorbed in the airway and this is how the infection starts, and this is what we think, because we saw a lot of evidence in the lungs of the non-human primates that the virus got in that way.'

Further work is needed but the findings are worrying as macaques are close genetic relatives to humans, said the researchers.

CDC

... influenza patients produce aerosol particles containing measurable amounts of influenza virus while coughing. Further, 65% of the viral RNA was contained within particles in the respirable size fraction. Our study was also able to demonstrate that at least some influenza patients expelled airborne particles containing viable virus.

ooops

a reply to: soficrow
Very interesting reading, Sofi. Thanks.
I wondered what you thought about the clean up of Louise's Dallas apartment. Some of the photos showed what looked like a mist wafting from the open door.

a reply to: soficrow

The reality is..... That in Monrovia, Liberia (One of the great epic slums in the world) there would be near 250k infected right now if airborne. Lets explain Monrovia:
1) no running water.
2) people pee on buildings, crap in the sea, wash in the sea
3) Average persons for 400 sqft 4.
4) Two running toilets in the whole slum that cost money to use.


Infection facts last I looked? about 400.





Fear mongering at its best.


cheers




edit- btw the slum in monrovia is called west point. couldn't recall it

a reply to: ArmyOfNobunaga
In an "epic slum," would you trust the stats?

originally posted by: ArmyOfNobunaga
a reply to: soficrow

The reality is..... That in Monrovia, Liberia (One of the great epic slums in the world) there would be near 250k infected right now if airborne. Lets explain Monrovia:
1) no running water.
2) people pee on buildings, crap in the sea, wash in the sea
3) Average persons for 400 sqft 4.
4) Two running toilets in the whole slum that cost money to use.


Infection facts last I looked? about 400.





Fear mongering at its best.


cheers

Thank you!!!

Finally.....it has been so long since somebody talked sense.

originally posted by: drwill
a reply to: ArmyOfNobunaga
In an "epic slum," would you trust the stats?

Yes... Enough reporters there trying to make a name for themselves. If we had a 100k outbreak like there would be if it was airborne for the last 2 months... we would know.

Try to stay level headed people. Even on this site... truth, fact and reason should trump BS.



hell people... use reason. Liberia who I am sure is milking this for as much aid money as possible atm would be shouting from the rooftops if they had more than the 5-6k infected.

a reply to: ArmyOfNobunaga

There is historical evidence that it can be transmitted without direct contact.

All I can say is I am blown away by the incompetence of the CDC WHO and the Airline industry for allowing this to become what it is so far..

originally posted by: guitarplayer
a reply to: ArmyOfNobunaga

There is historical evidence that it can be transmitted without direct contact.

Ive read the study....

... the actual study. My MS in the field helps me understand the papers.

The fact is even the researchers attribute the infection from animal to animal as a clinical mistake.


truth


trumps



doomporn

a reply to: ArmyOfNobunaga

I'm curious, how would you react if you were 2 or 2 and a half feet away from someone that has ebola and that person sneezes in your face and you have no face mask on? And not just Ebola, I've had that happen to me in the supermarket several times. Would it upset you at all? You haven't had actual contact but you felt the moisture. So it could be said there was no contact but is that really true?

And then not only your face is misted but some also lands on a apple in the produce dept. or on a coffee table. How long will it be infectious if eaten or if touched and then an eye is rubbed for example?

STM

originally posted by: ArmyOfNobunaga

originally posted by: drwill
a reply to: ArmyOfNobunaga
In an "epic slum," would you trust the stats?

Yes... Enough reporters there trying to make a name for themselves. If we had a 100k outbreak like there would be if it was airborne for the last 2 months... we would know.

Try to stay level headed people. Even on this site... truth, fact and reason should trump BS.



hell people... use reason. Liberia who I am sure is milking this for as much aid money as possible atm would be shouting from the rooftops if they had more than the 5-6k infected.

you are right why would we bother in engaging in critical thinking when we can just take your word for it

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: ArmyOfNobunaga

originally posted by: drwill
a reply to: ArmyOfNobunaga
In an "epic slum," would you trust the stats?

Yes... Enough reporters there trying to make a name for themselves. If we had a 100k outbreak like there would be if it was airborne for the last 2 months... we would know.

Try to stay level headed people. Even on this site... truth, fact and reason should trump BS.



hell people... use reason. Liberia who I am sure is milking this for as much aid money as possible atm would be shouting from the rooftops if they had more than the 5-6k infected.

you are right why would we bother in engaging in critical thinking when we can just take your word for it

You meant to type "Let us have our doom porn without facts"


You can... I don't care really.

It's all in the wording. It doesn't stay suspended in the air like flu virus' but it most certainly can be aerosol, by sneezing or coughing onto another's mucus membranes. Eyes, nose, mouth. Therefore it's airborne!

originally posted by: ArmyOfNobunaga


... the actual study. My MS in the field helps me understand the papers.

and Iv'e got a Phd. In BS detection......see how that works?

originally posted by: ArmyOfNobunaga

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: ArmyOfNobunaga

originally posted by: drwill
a reply to: ArmyOfNobunaga
In an "epic slum," would you trust the stats?

Yes... Enough reporters there trying to make a name for themselves. If we had a 100k outbreak like there would be if it was airborne for the last 2 months... we would know.

Try to stay level headed people. Even on this site... truth, fact and reason should trump BS.



hell people... use reason. Liberia who I am sure is milking this for as much aid money as possible atm would be shouting from the rooftops if they had more than the 5-6k infected.

you are right why would we bother in engaging in critical thinking when we can just take your word for it

You meant to type "Let us have our doom porn without facts"


You can... I don't care really.

well these "facts" that you speak of...how exactly do you know that you are not being told what you want to hear ?...i have little faith in the modern media

originally posted by: ArmyOfNobunaga
a reply to: soficrow
The reality is..... That in Monrovia, Liberia (One of the great epic slums in the world) there would be near 250k infected right now if airborne. Lets explain Monrovia:
1) no running water.
2) people pee on buildings, crap in the sea, wash in the sea
3) Average persons for 400 sqft 4.
4) Two running toilets in the whole slum that cost money to use.
Infection facts last I looked? about 400.
Fear mongering at its best.

cheers

edit- btw the slum in monrovia is called west point. couldn't recall it

Even if it wasn't airborne, under those squalid conditions, there should be a heck of a lot more Ebola cases.

Ridiculous... if this were airborne, the entire world would be currently suffering from a horrible pandemic that would be claiming millions of lives. Fearmongering won't make this any better.

There is no way this is airborne in the standard vernacular of viruses. If someone sneezes in your face.. that doesn't mean it's airborne.

a reply to: ArmyOfNobunaga

...Fear mongering at its best.

My sources are impeccable. Moreover, I stipulate that "the scientific definition for "airborne transmission" is very specific" - and show that Ebola does NOT meet that definition. If it did, obviously the infection rate would be higher and the spread much greater - that is not in question.

However, Ebola's mutation to airborne would NOT involve a "dramatic change" in its mode of transmission - just a bit of minor tweaking. Ebola already infects mucous membranes, including the respiratory tract and lungs, so the number and kind of mutations required for airborne transmission likely are minimal. [What happens when viable dried virus on a surface is disturbed and released into the air? For example.]

So the take-home message is the epidemic needs to stopped asap in West Africa before it mutates into a properly airborne form. ....A plea for timely action is not fear mongering.


RE: Infection rates in Monrovia/Liberia.

No evidence suggests categorical airborne transmission, but the figures are not reliable.

International SOS
8 October

…..There are several reports that all Ebola media coverage at health facilities will be restricted, to protect the privacy of patients and healthcare workers and ensure safety of staff and journalists. The Liberian Ministry of Health and Social Welfare and Ministry of Information have reportedly established a new Ebola media policy. Healthcare workers will not be allowed to give any information and no interviews will be conducted without advance approval from the Ministry of Information.

WHO: Ebola Response Roadmap Situation Report
8 October 2014

....The past week has seen a continuation of recent trends: the situation in Guinea, Liberia, and Sierra Leone continues to deteriorate, with widespread and persistent transmission of EVD. Problems with data gathering in Liberia continue. It should be emphasized that the reported fall in the number of new cases in Liberia over the past three weeks is unlikely to be genuine. Rather, it reflects a deterioration in the ability of overwhelmed responders to record accurate epidemiological data. It is clear from field reports and first responders that EVD cases are being under-reported from several key locations, and laboratory data that have not yet been integrated into official estimates indicate an increase in the number of new cases in Liberia. There is no evidence that the EVD epidemic in West Africa is being brought under control, though there is evidence of a decline in incidence in the districts of Lofa in Liberia, and Kailahun and Kenema in Sierra Leone.