Inertial impulse space drive

originally posted by: tachyonator7
Eppur si muove!

www.youtube.com...

Well I had to come back for this. You just spent how many pages with us arguing about coils and you used an elastic for your experiment??? -Facepalm-

Holy crap. Judging by the hands, Id say you are probably in high school if we are lucky.

Guess what kiddo? Different physics!

A perfectly elastic collision is defined as one in which there is no loss of kinetic energy in the collision.

hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu...

Much different than a coil trying to reach equilibrium isn't it? Yes it is. Now, here's the tricky part, reload the elastic in the bottle without moving it in the opposite direction, without your hand stopping it from moving.

oops.

Well, never mind that, is your space ship powered by rubber bands now?

rather, infini-tesimal. no wonder you are obsessed wih unicorns.

That it is still infinitely higher than the persons that think they will be cruising around space on springs?

Don't get too snarky...I am the one that figured out how to reload your springs! The unicorns are getting yoked up now.

my, what did you just say? spring is loaded relative to the ship itself, loading of the spring has no impact on it's momentum, while releasing it, indeed does.

originally posted by: stumason
a reply to: tachyonator7

No, it doesn't. The only way I could see it "working" is if the springs are pre-loaded prior to your spacecraft even launching. Once "sprung", how are you going to reload the spring without causing an opposite force against your spacecraft?

For example, in your highly technical video of a bottle in the bath, you release the spring and it goes forward. Now try pulling on that spring to reload it.... What happens to your bottle?

a reply to: Bedlam

The OP has brought much more to the table of thought provoking ideas and discussion than you have in your reply. In fact his ideas are interesting and worth investigating, because that is how science really works. You postulate an idea, and test it out. If it doesn't work then what? Stop everything and go home? No, you now have incentive and excitement to look at it in different and in ways no one has thought of yet, and that is how leaps and big discoveries can happen and do.

Your reply sounds more like, "forget it, go home, it will never work, we will not succeed" Which means you are a perfect candidate as a research scientist for the government or a university! ha-ha, successes for them is the end of funding in our current academic environment.

a reply to: tachyonator7

Go on then, show us a video of you pulling the band/spring back after the first release and we'll see what the bottle does.

originally posted by: NoCorruptionAllowed
a reply to: Bedlam

The OP has brought much more to the table of thought provoking ideas and discussion than you have in your reply. In fact his ideas are interesting and worth investigating, because that is how science really works.

How science really works involves understanding the basics of physics.

So I'd give it a + for OP's interest, but that's about it.

When the downward force of the spring attempts to move the outer tube down, it can't. It is blocked by Earth. This prevents the tube (and the top half of the spring) from experiencing any inertia and creating kinetic energy downwards (canceled out). The tube simply can't move down, so instead the spring is moved up. The upward movement of the spring (and inertia) causes no extra force to be exerted down on the ground.

once again, you don't what you are talking about. you say "When the downward force of the spring attempts to move the outer tube down,it can't. It is blocked by Earth.", but at the same time you say there is NO force acting against the earth. does it get any crazier than that? le comedy.

originally posted by: tachyonator7Again, you don't know what you are talking about. The only contradiction is the one you created in your mind because of lack of knowledge of all the energy / forces in play.

everything you say is contradictory. you lack any understanding of the forces in play, otherwise you would never say "downward force is canceled out by earth" WITHOUT excerting a force on it. i wonder how did you make it through the elementary (if you did at all).

originally posted by: tachyonator7No. When one side of a spring is released, that side contracts towards the middle of the spring. The opposite side of the spring also contracts towards the middle, however since that side is fixed in place, the middle of the spring is moved instead. So the entire spring appears to move to one side.

I can't believe you are arguing this.

Both sides of the spring contract towards the middle (equilibrium). When you do the math, and try to calculate the force required to extend or contract the spring using Hooke's law, you can simplify the equation by combining both forces into one, since both forces act together to do the same task (contract or expand). So maybe that is why you are confused.

hook's law calculates the force needed to extend or compress a spring over some distance based on it k factor. you completely misunderstood it. it doesn't say spring contracts in the middle. when one side is released, impulse towards the opposite side is dominant, that's why the tube moves in one direction. you confused the basic laws again.

You aren't even aware that there are different types of springs?

lol, did you really ask that? let me quote you again "Some springs that are at rest (equilibrium) are fully contracted and can't really be compressed, only stretched." this doesn't mean they "can't be compressed", they compress after being stretched and that is the type of spring i use in the experiment.

If you used a compression spring in your device, the spring would contract towards equilibrium, and inertia would cause it to pass equilibrium and compress. Then it would expand towards equilibrium, and inertia would cause it to pass equilibrium again. Then it would contract again... etc. It would oscillate until it reached equilibrium.

If you used an extension spring, the spring would simply contract towards equilibrium and come to a dead stop with little to no oscillation. There would be little vibration.

If you don't know these basic things.... it only highlights other things you don't know about basic mechanical engineering.

wrong, after being compressed compression spring would EXPAND towards equilibrium and would oscillate untill it reaches it.
extension spring create a resistance to a pulling force. that's the spring i use in the experiment, it doesn't come to a "dead stop", it moves in one direction. i see you lack not only basics of mechanical engineering, but of the very laws of physics.

You still don't have any clue...

infinitely more than you ever did

That only worked because the equal and opposite reaction was stopped by the clothes pin in the guys hand resting against the bottle. It was only allowed to travel forward. Just like your spring device would lift off the ground, because the ground would prevent the equal and opposite reaction from taking place, and would only allow it to move forward.

We all know your device will lift of the ground, but once in the air, it wouldn't go anywhere. It would have nothing to prevent the equal and opposite reaction.

nothing was stopped by the pin, pin was quickly removed before the spring even contracted, spring cannot contract BEFORE the pin is removed. if the spring was fired by radio control, result would be the same. you are completely wrong.

it seems you are under delusion that stretching the spring against the tube will make the tube move. LOL

originally posted by: stumason
a reply to: tachyonator7

Go on then, show us a video of you pulling the band/spring back after the first release and we'll see what the bottle does.

*** ATTENTION ALL ***

The next insult will result in a posting ban of at least 72 hours.

right, and you are the one who lacks this understanding. you proclaimed a simple natural phenomena "impossible".

originally posted by: Bedlam
How science really works involves understanding the basics of physics.

So I'd give it a + for OP's interest, but that's about it.

originally posted by: bonchoHoly crap. Judging by the hands, Id say you are probably in high school if we are lucky.

guess what "kiddo", i'm probably older then you judging by your posts.

Now, here's the tricky part, reload the elastic in the bottle without moving it in the opposite direction, without your hand stopping it from moving.

loading the spring doesn't make it move, you are talking cartoon physics.

a reply to: tachyonator7

That's because it will... In the video, you have the bottle at one end of the bath and the band attached to something, you release the peg and the bottle moves forward. Now try to stretch the band again, without holding the bottle in place with your hand or anything else and see what it does...

Oh look, it moves back...

a reply to: tachyonator7

I'm going to ditch this topic because the OP doesn't understand basic physics, and any attempt to help him understand it is met with absurd remarks, and confusion.

See ya.

originally posted by: tachyonator7
once again, you don't what you are talking about. you say "When the downward force of the spring attempts to move the outer tube down,it can't. It is blocked by Earth.", but at the same time you say there is NO force acting against the earth. does it get any crazier than that? le comedy.

One last remark...

I said no EXTRA force is applied to the ground. A force is already applied to the ground when you set the device on the ground, its called gravity, and electromagnetic interaction between the atoms of the device. Also, most of the downward force that would cancel out the upward force is the inertia from the moving tube, but the tube cant move, so no inertia. The upward movement of the spring also cancels out any downward extra force.

My attempt to help you understand with layman's terms is actually causing you to get even more confused. So I will just stop here because it's pretty obvious you will never understand.

In all honestly, this thread should have died when the OP was told that this device has been tried before. Inertia propulsion has been experimented to death, and always fails because of the laws of motion.

oh, sad excuses from someone who said, quote:

"downward force cancels out against the ground without acting against the ground".

a true pearl of ignorance from someone who lacks any comprehension of laws of physics or common sense.. it should be memorized as most contradictory statement ever made on ATS.

I'm going to ditch this topic because the OP doesn't understand basic physics, and any attempt to help him understand it is met with absurd remarks, and confusion.

See ya.

a reply to: tachyonator7

originally posted by: tachyonator7
oh, sad excuses from someone who said, quote:

"downward force cancels out against the ground without acting against the ground".

a true pearl of ignorance from someone who lacks any comprehension of laws of physics or common sense.. it should be memorized as most contradictory statement ever made on ATS.

How dare you falsely quote me. I feel insulted.

Your bold quote is not my words, but your own made up words based on your inability to read.

Please do use a real quote, and link to the post you claim I said that.

-edit- Here let me help you... here is a link to all my posts in this thread:

all my posts in this topic

Now press CTRL+F and copy and paste your made up quote: "downward force cancels out against the ground without acting against the ground".

ZERO MATCHES

Let it be known to all of ATS that, through observation, the member "tachyonator7" will erroneously read your posts and falsely quote you. How can one have a conversation with such a person?

no matter how much i simplified and broke down the explanation, this guy cannot get it that he is contradicting himself all this time. IF there is a downward force that prevents the tube from jumping once it is in the air, there is necessarily an EXTRA force (besides the resting weight) applied to the ground (downward inertia), making the tube appear heavier prior to jump. there is NO avoiding that, as the same forces are at play in both stages. since tube doesn't appear heavier, there is no downward force. but you are utterly ignorant of the laws involved and refuse to be educated out of your confusion. i feel like arguing with a brick. some people are just like that, living in their own world, riding around on unicorns with their own laws of physics.

originally posted by: WeAre0neOne last remark...

I said no EXTRA force is applied to the ground. A force is already applied to the ground when you set the device on the ground, its called gravity, and electromagnetic interaction between the atoms of the device. Also, most of the downward force that would cancel out the upward force is the inertia from the moving tube, but the tube cant move, so no inertia. The upward movement of the spring also cancels out any downward extra force.

originally posted by: tachyonator7
IF there is a downward force that prevents the tube from jumping once it is in the air, there is necessarily an EXTRA force (besides the resting weight) applied to the ground (downward inertia), making the tube appear heavier prior to jump. there is NO avoiding that, as the same forces are at play in both stages.

You still don't understand... Holy @#$%!

The downward force that prevents the tube from jumping once it is already in the air is the force provided by the downward movement of the tube. That force does not exist when the device is on the ground, because the tube can not move downward, it is resting on the ground!

How do you not understand this?

You didn't simplify or break down anything. You can't simplify or break down something you don't understand.