Cannabis The Carbon Footprint Towards Climate Change

originally posted by: HandyDandy

originally posted by: MarlinGrace
So let me help you, this is from the study:

"Um...., what about alcohol? Yeah, why don’t you pick on alcohol?!
Great question. The energy use required to produce one marijuana cigarette is equivalent to that of about 18 pints of beer. Much more effort has been placed on improving efficiency in alcohol-production facilities than in Cannabis-production facilities."

Alcohol production has had 80 years to do it.

Marijuana has had 10 months in Colorado and about 6 months in Washington.

Now, go eat some crayon.

Let me put it another way.

Cannabis uses CO2 to grow.

Alcohol releases CO2 during it's production.

I'd like to bet that any amount of CO2 released to grow a plant from the energy sources are being eaten up by that same plant at a 1:1 ratio.

a reply to: MarlinGrace

From the OP source.

Large-scale industrialized and highly energy-intensive indoor cultivation of Cannabis is driven by criminalization, pursuit of security, and the desire for greater process control and yields. The practice occurs across the United States and in many other countries.

This study does not pass judgement on the merits of Cannabis cultivation or make recommendations for how to reduce this energy use, but observes that many reversible inefficiencies are embedded in current practices.

Most media reports have sensationalized the numbers without putting them in perspective or looking at solutions. If the media applied the same concern to greenhouse-gas emissions for all human activities as they have to the release of this report we would be well on our way towards addressing the climate change problem.

Greenhouse horticulture - Cannabis production requires 13-times as much energy per square foot as greenhouse horticulture in Belgium.

- Belgium......where it is dark a lot of the time during winter months.

Alcohol - The energy used to produce one "joint" would also produce 18 pints of beer.

- How much CO2 emissions did that joint eat up while it was growing?

Automobiles are responsible for about about 33% of U.S. greenhouse-gas emissions, which is 100-times as much as indoor Cannabis production (0.3%).

- So we should be getting rid of cars.

Is Cannabis production intrinsically polluting?

No. Like virtually any other energy-using activity (driving, preparing food, making aluminum, heating a home) energy is commonly wasted and used inefficiently. And, as observed in virtually every energy use domain, there are enormous prospects for improving efficiency and using low- or no-carbon energy sources. Outdoor production involves particularly low energy inputs, although when mismanaged, the practice imposes other environmental impacts.

I'll leave it at that.

Conclusion: You people are making a mountain out of a mole hill.

originally posted by: HandyDandy
a reply to: MarlinGrace

Large-scale industrialized and highly energy-intensive indoor cultivation of Cannabis is driven by criminalization, pursuit of security, and the desire for greater process control and yields. The practice occurs across the United States and in many other countries.

I think the part following your emphasis is equally worth mentioning.

Security.

In Northern California, where the "emerald triangle" is, a lot of farmers have the protection of dense forest and acres of land. Guns and weapons, anywhere in the vicinity of a cannabis grow, are a dangerous proposition, so most farmers have really nasty dogs that will seriously eat you if you are found on the property. Guns and cannabis starts to look like trafficking, rather than growing something that you just love to grow knowing it might be helping someone. (I'm not saying all farmers are motivated that way, but you'd be surprised) Some of the folks I've met, just give it away to the very sick at either no cost, or very little compared to the dispensaries.

They all take security very seriously. That is also a large reason for indoor grows too, they control the environment and the security, but you get what you pay for. Most are paying for the costs of the power and security to manage it, which is offset to the consumer. This is your carbon footprint, and I agree with the OP, that the more of these start popping up, the higher the energy consumption.

Necessity is the mother of invention... so eventually, if the costs of power continue to rise, so will the costs off-set to the consumer, who will like tobacco, eventually stop buying it due to that cost. That will force these "businesses" to find more cost-effective ways to grow, which as any farmer has learned, is easier to do outdoors or even in a greenhouse, without paying for the cost of light and heat.

It's impossible to control nature, and even with indoor grows, you are limited to what you are controlling (air temps, co2, light, air flow, etc). Even then, it only takes one aphid to catch a ride with you, a few powdery mildew spores or a moth that is lucky enough to fly in unnoticed, and your entire crop is done because they are used to "controlling" things and don't know how to respond when that control is lost because of nature.

Instead, I say harness nature's awesome power and learn to work cooperatively with it, and it will reward you in kind.

~Namaste

Anybody think to "vet" the source? Sounds like a load of bull to me.

a reply to: SonOfTheLawOfOne

I also agree with the OP that the more there are grow ops the more energy would be needed. That is just a no-brainer.

But according to the study, there are ways to reduce this footprint. Outdoors is one of them.

But...no one wants to talk about the 100 times more carbon footprint that our automobiles put out right? And that is just at the end product when in use. How much carbon footprint was given off during the production? All those petroleum products, I'd estimate at 10,000 times more.

What would happen if automobiles start using hemp products instead of petroleum products?

I just think that this study is very short sighted and only focuses on the growing operation and not the side effects.

1. It doesn't include the uptake of the CO2 by the plant itself.

2. It doesn't address anything about the lower footprint when hemp replaces modern industries.

originally posted by: tombaccei
Anybody think to "vet" the source? Sounds like a load of bull to me.

I say vet everything you find on the net, not just this studies author, all of it. Nothing can be trusted anymore. The best we can do is read the article, check out the author, see what has been written before and go from there. All of these I did but with the caveat that it was supplied from his site.

Please do vet it..

originally posted by: HandyDandy
a reply to: SonOfTheLawOfOne

2. It doesn't address anything about the lower footprint when hemp replaces modern industries.

Of course it doesn't, thats not what the study is about, it doesn't address washing crayon marks off of your clothes either.

The isn't about the uptake of C02 by the plant it's about the energy required to grow medicinal marijuana not HEMP!

The study isn't about hemp. The study isn't about hemp. The study isn't about hemp. The study isn't about hemp.

It does focus on the side effects of the growing operation it's called C02 production.

I would say your estimate of 10,000 times more is low, but the study isn't about CO2 from cars it's about medicinal marijuana.

For the last time it's about "The carbon footprint of indoor cannabis production." It isn't about baseball gloves, pirates treasure, airplane wings, sushi, hot chicks, rolling papers, concert tickets, willy wonka, crayons, cars, beer, or hemp.

You do appear to be living proof why you shouldn't smoke the stuff unless you need it medically.

originally posted by: MarlinGrace
For the last time it's about "The carbon footprint of indoor cannabis production." It isn't about baseball gloves, pirates treasure, airplane wings, sushi, hot chicks, rolling papers, concert tickets, willy wonka, crayons, cars, beer, or hemp.

For the last time. It is misleading. The author even says so.

You do appear to be living proof why you shouldn't smoke the stuff unless you need it medically.

A veiled insult is still an insult. Alerted.

originally posted by: MarlinGrace

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed
a reply to: MarlinGrace

This is the problem my friend you sight an article written on the website "Nemeton : The Shamen and 1990s UK Cyberculture" where he discusses among other things the energy value of HEMP

then please have a look at these...
www.hort.purdue.edu...
www.equalrights4all.org...
www1.american.edu...
www.hemphasis.net...
www.hemphasis.net...

and there is no reason that medical MJ cannot be grown outdoors...it just takes longer and of course we live in a profit driven society so i am not surprised that it is grown indoors...

Ok for the last time comparing Hemp to Medicinal Marijuana is like comparing horse sh*t rolled in tea leaves to a fine cigar.

you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.....MJ grown outdoors is much more suitable for medical purposes than MJ grown indoors.....for starter outdoor growing does not require all the harsh chemicals....and medicinal types come from the strains they use not from where it is grown

The Indica strain is a relaxant, typically used to relieve the symptoms of multiple sclerosis, muscle spasms, tremors, mobility issues, and pain management. The Sativa strain is more of a stimulant, more appropriate for appetite stimulation, migraines, pain, nausea, and commonly used by HIV/AIDS and cancer patients and takes forever to mature. So really go for hybrids and get the best of both worlds.

www.wikihow.com...

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: MarlinGrace

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed
a reply to: MarlinGrace

This is the problem my friend you sight an article written on the website "Nemeton : The Shamen and 1990s UK Cyberculture" where he discusses among other things the energy value of HEMP

then please have a look at these...
www.hort.purdue.edu...
www.equalrights4all.org...
www1.american.edu...
www.hemphasis.net...
www.hemphasis.net...

and there is no reason that medical MJ cannot be grown outdoors...it just takes longer and of course we live in a profit driven society so i am not surprised that it is grown indoors...

Ok for the last time comparing Hemp to Medicinal Marijuana is like comparing horse sh*t rolled in tea leaves to a fine cigar.

you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.....MJ grown outdoors is much more suitable for medical purposes than MJ grown indoors.....for starter outdoor growing does not require all the harsh chemicals....and medicinal types come from the strains they use not from where it is grown

The Indica strain is a relaxant, typically used to relieve the symptoms of multiple sclerosis, muscle spasms, tremors, mobility issues, and pain management. The Sativa strain is more of a stimulant, more appropriate for appetite stimulation, migraines, pain, nausea, and commonly used by HIV/AIDS and cancer patients and takes forever to mature. So really go for hybrids and get the best of both worlds.

www.wikihow.com...

You don't seem to get it either.. Hemp and Medicinal Marijuana are different.

Hemp & Marijuana Myths and Realities

originally posted by: MarlinGrace
You don't seem to get it either.. Hemp and Medicinal Marijuana are different.

Hemp & Marijuana Myths and Realities

And you aren't getting that medical marijuana can be grown outdoors.

What was the point of your thread to begin with? To show us how indoor gardening uses energy? Well no duh sherlock.......

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: MarlinGrace

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed
a reply to: MarlinGrace

This is the problem my friend you sight an article written on the website "Nemeton : The Shamen and 1990s UK Cyberculture" where he discusses among other things the energy value of HEMP

then please have a look at these...
www.hort.purdue.edu...
www.equalrights4all.org...
www1.american.edu...
www.hemphasis.net...
www.hemphasis.net...

and there is no reason that medical MJ cannot be grown outdoors...it just takes longer and of course we live in a profit driven society so i am not surprised that it is grown indoors...

Ok for the last time comparing Hemp to Medicinal Marijuana is like comparing horse sh*t rolled in tea leaves to a fine cigar.

you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.....MJ grown outdoors is much more suitable for medical purposes than MJ grown indoors.....for starter outdoor growing does not require all the harsh chemicals....and medicinal types come from the strains they use not from where it is grown

The Indica strain is a relaxant, typically used to relieve the symptoms of multiple sclerosis, muscle spasms, tremors, mobility issues, and pain management. The Sativa strain is more of a stimulant, more appropriate for appetite stimulation, migraines, pain, nausea, and commonly used by HIV/AIDS and cancer patients and takes forever to mature. So really go for hybrids and get the best of both worlds.

www.wikihow.com...

I put up a study by a PHD, members of this forum have acknowledged their experience in growing medical Marijuana and the quality it produces compared to outdoor. Read the thread, read the study, blow it off, believe it I don't care. But the thread and the study is about the the carbon footprint of indoor grown medicinal marijuana. THATS IT.

originally posted by: MarlinGrace

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: MarlinGrace

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed
a reply to: MarlinGrace

This is the problem my friend you sight an article written on the website "Nemeton : The Shamen and 1990s UK Cyberculture" where he discusses among other things the energy value of HEMP

it is the same plant...you understand ...there are different strains of said plant..."cannabis sativa"

then please have a look at these...
www.hort.purdue.edu...
www.equalrights4all.org...
www1.american.edu...
www.hemphasis.net...
www.hemphasis.net...

and there is no reason that medical MJ cannot be grown outdoors...it just takes longer and of course we live in a profit driven society so i am not surprised that it is grown indoors...

Ok for the last time comparing Hemp to Medicinal Marijuana is like comparing horse sh*t rolled in tea leaves to a fine cigar.

you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.....MJ grown outdoors is much more suitable for medical purposes than MJ grown indoors.....for starter outdoor growing does not require all the harsh chemicals....and medicinal types come from the strains they use not from where it is grown

The Indica strain is a relaxant, typically used to relieve the symptoms of multiple sclerosis, muscle spasms, tremors, mobility issues, and pain management. The Sativa strain is more of a stimulant, more appropriate for appetite stimulation, migraines, pain, nausea, and commonly used by HIV/AIDS and cancer patients and takes forever to mature. So really go for hybrids and get the best of both worlds.

www.wikihow.com...

You don't seem to get it either.. Hemp and Medicinal Marijuana are different.

Hemp & Marijuana Myths and Realities

it is the same plant...you understand ...there are different strains of said plant..."cannabis sativa"...hemp is a loose term describing a strain that has lower THC..hemp and marijuana are the same thing...

Hemp (from Old English hænep) is a commonly used term for high-growing varieties of the Cannabis plant and its products, which include fiber, oil, and seed. Hemp is refined into products such as hemp seed foods, hemp oil, wax, resin, rope, cloth, pulp, paper, and fuel. Other variants of the herb Cannabis sativa are widely used as a drug, commonly known as marijuana. These variants are typically low-growing and have higher content of tetrahydrocannabinol (THC). The legality of Cannabis varies widely from country to country, and from state to state in the United States. In many countries regulatory limits for concentrations of psychoactive drug compounds, particularly THC, in hemp require the use of strains of the plant which are bred for low content

en.wikipedia.org...

What is the difference between hemp and marijuana? The short answer: semantics. The long answer: the difference is a largely misunderstood distinction that now has two correct answers, a legal one and a scientific one. And like all things proven by scientists, it is somehow up for public and political debate. Thanks to nearly 80 years of federal cannabis prohibition, public knowledge on the topic is limited to rumors and misinterpretations perpetuated online—everything from “hemp plants are male and marijuana plants are female” to “one is a drug and the other is not.” The legal definitions also have muddied the water as legislators have passed laws at both the federal and state levels defining hemp in the pursuit of both fiber and medicine.

Hemp refers to strains of Cannabis sativa that have been bred specifically for fiber used for clothing and construction, oils and topical ointments, nutritional benefits and a wide and growing variety of other purposes that don’t involve intoxication. Marijuana is a slang term used to describe strains of Cannabis sativa specifically bred for the potent resinous glands (trichomes) that grow on the flowers and some leaves (buds). While there is some dispute over the origins of the term “marijuana,” it was introduced into popular use by Hearst-era newspapers as a way to instill fear of pot-smoking Mexicans. Wording aside, both hemp and marijuana are, in fact, the same thing. Although both “hemp” and “marijuana” as we know them are from the same genus, Cannabis, they are also part of the same species, Cannabis sativa. The scientific difference between what we refer to as hemp and marijuana comes from the purpose the strain was bred for.

www.cannabisculture.com...

have a read through that it may clear up some of your misconceptions...hemp and marijuana are the same thing

originally posted by: MarlinGrace
But the thread and the study is about the the carbon footprint of indoor grown medicinal marijuana. THATS IT.

You want to make us believe this but the author even compares this footprint to other products. So, your posturing that we can ONLY talk about the footprint by indoor grown medical marijuana is preposterous. Read your own damn study.

originally posted by: HandyDandy

originally posted by: MarlinGrace
For the last time it's about "The carbon footprint of indoor cannabis production." It isn't about baseball gloves, pirates treasure, airplane wings, sushi, hot chicks, rolling papers, concert tickets, willy wonka, crayons, cars, beer, or hemp.

For the last time. It is misleading. The author even says so.

You do appear to be living proof why you shouldn't smoke the stuff unless you need it medically.

A veiled insult is still an insult. Alerted.

There was nothing vailed about it I intended to insult you, for the entire thread you have referred to hemp and it benefits in every aspect. Despite the myriad of times I tried to tell you what the study was about, and hemp is different than medicinal marijuana. If you can't understand that then there is nothing else for me to say. Can you see the monitor through the smoke?

originally posted by: MarlinGrace

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: MarlinGrace

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed
a reply to: MarlinGrace

This is the problem my friend you sight an article written on the website "Nemeton : The Shamen and 1990s UK Cyberculture" where he discusses among other things the energy value of HEMP

then please have a look at these...
www.hort.purdue.edu...
www.equalrights4all.org...
www1.american.edu...
www.hemphasis.net...
www.hemphasis.net...

and there is no reason that medical MJ cannot be grown outdoors...it just takes longer and of course we live in a profit driven society so i am not surprised that it is grown indoors...

Ok for the last time comparing Hemp to Medicinal Marijuana is like comparing horse sh*t rolled in tea leaves to a fine cigar.

you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.....MJ grown outdoors is much more suitable for medical purposes than MJ grown indoors.....for starter outdoor growing does not require all the harsh chemicals....and medicinal types come from the strains they use not from where it is grown

The Indica strain is a relaxant, typically used to relieve the symptoms of multiple sclerosis, muscle spasms, tremors, mobility issues, and pain management. The Sativa strain is more of a stimulant, more appropriate for appetite stimulation, migraines, pain, nausea, and commonly used by HIV/AIDS and cancer patients and takes forever to mature. So really go for hybrids and get the best of both worlds.

www.wikihow.com...

I put up a study by a PHD, members of this forum have acknowledged their experience in growing medical Marijuana and the quality it produces compared to outdoor. Read the thread, read the study, blow it off, believe it I don't care. But the thread and the study is about the the carbon footprint of indoor grown medicinal marijuana. THATS IT.

i am a horticulturist and have studied plants for the last 20 years ...i dont care what you have read ...you can produce a high quality from outdoor growing with the right knowledge....

your OP states that growing MJ has a large carbon footprint...it does not have to be that way...it is grown indoors for the profit margin...as i have tried to point out growing MJ has massive benefits for the environment and you tell me hemp and MJ are not the same....as i stated before you have no concept of what you are talking about ..i realize it is confusing it is designed that way

originally posted by: MarlinGrace
for the entire thread you have referred to hemp and it benefits in every aspect.

I mentioned hemp in ONE of my posts. Nice try at lying.

and hemp is different than medicinal marijuana.

No it is not. It is the SAME damn plant. Just different races (strains).

If you can't understand that then there is nothing else for me to say.

You have been proven wrong time and time again. Yet you continue.

Can you see the monitor through the smoke?

Can you see yours through all the BS you are spouting off?

originally posted by: MarlinGrace
There was nothing vailed about it I intended to insult you,

And yet, you are the one who can't even spell correctly.

Vailed means to don ones hat in respect.

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: MarlinGrace

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: MarlinGrace

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed
a reply to: MarlinGrace

This is the problem my friend you sight an article written on the website "Nemeton : The Shamen and 1990s UK Cyberculture" where he discusses among other things the energy value of HEMP

it is the same plant...you understand ...there are different strains of said plant..."cannabis sativa"

then please have a look at these...
www.hort.purdue.edu...
www.equalrights4all.org...
www1.american.edu...
www.hemphasis.net...
www.hemphasis.net...

and there is no reason that medical MJ cannot be grown outdoors...it just takes longer and of course we live in a profit driven society so i am not surprised that it is grown indoors...

Ok for the last time comparing Hemp to Medicinal Marijuana is like comparing horse sh*t rolled in tea leaves to a fine cigar.

you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.....MJ grown outdoors is much more suitable for medical purposes than MJ grown indoors.....for starter outdoor growing does not require all the harsh chemicals....and medicinal types come from the strains they use not from where it is grown

The Indica strain is a relaxant, typically used to relieve the symptoms of multiple sclerosis, muscle spasms, tremors, mobility issues, and pain management. The Sativa strain is more of a stimulant, more appropriate for appetite stimulation, migraines, pain, nausea, and commonly used by HIV/AIDS and cancer patients and takes forever to mature. So really go for hybrids and get the best of both worlds.

www.wikihow.com...

You don't seem to get it either.. Hemp and Medicinal Marijuana are different.

Hemp & Marijuana Myths and Realities

it is the same plant...you understand ...there are different strains of said plant..."cannabis sativa"...hemp is a loose term describing a strain that has lower THC..hemp and marijuana are the same thing...

Hemp (from Old English hænep) is a commonly used term for high-growing varieties of the Cannabis plant and its products, which include fiber, oil, and seed. Hemp is refined into products such as hemp seed foods, hemp oil, wax, resin, rope, cloth, pulp, paper, and fuel. Other variants of the herb Cannabis sativa are widely used as a drug, commonly known as marijuana. These variants are typically low-growing and have higher content of tetrahydrocannabinol (THC). The legality of Cannabis varies widely from country to country, and from state to state in the United States. In many countries regulatory limits for concentrations of psychoactive drug compounds, particularly THC, in hemp require the use of strains of the plant which are bred for low content

en.wikipedia.org...

What is the difference between hemp and marijuana? The short answer: semantics. The long answer: the difference is a largely misunderstood distinction that now has two correct answers, a legal one and a scientific one. And like all things proven by scientists, it is somehow up for public and political debate. Thanks to nearly 80 years of federal cannabis prohibition, public knowledge on the topic is limited to rumors and misinterpretations perpetuated online—everything from “hemp plants are male and marijuana plants are female” to “one is a drug and the other is not.” The legal definitions also have muddied the water as legislators have passed laws at both the federal and state levels defining hemp in the pursuit of both fiber and medicine.

Hemp refers to strains of Cannabis sativa that have been bred specifically for fiber used for clothing and construction, oils and topical ointments, nutritional benefits and a wide and growing variety of other purposes that don’t involve intoxication. Marijuana is a slang term used to describe strains of Cannabis sativa specifically bred for the potent resinous glands (trichomes) that grow on the flowers and some leaves (buds). While there is some dispute over the origins of the term “marijuana,” it was introduced into popular use by Hearst-era newspapers as a way to instill fear of pot-smoking Mexicans. Wording aside, both hemp and marijuana are, in fact, the same thing. Although both “hemp” and “marijuana” as we know them are from the same genus, Cannabis, they are also part of the same species, Cannabis sativa. The scientific difference between what we refer to as hemp and marijuana comes from the purpose the strain was bred for.

www.cannabisculture.com...

have a read through that it may clear up some of your misconceptions...hemp and marijuana are the same thing

" Myth: Smoking industrial hemp gets a person high.
Reality: The THC levels in industrial hemp are so low that no one could get high from smoking it.
Moreover, hemp contains a relatively high percentage of another cannabinoid, CBD, that actually
blocks the marijuana high. Hemp, it turns out, is not only not marijuana; it could be called
“antimarijuana.”

From the PHD that wrote the report for the link I gave you. Page 3 hope it clears it up for you it did for me. You could argue this phd or the other is a knucklehead and be on topic, but comparing the two is not accurate in it's production indoors or out compared to medicinal Cannabis. I appreciate you honest and decent reply. There is so much misleading info out there it is very difficult to remain accurate.

marlin from your own source :

The key Cannabis species problem derives from the fact that there is no convenient species barrier between the varying types that would allow us to draw a clear line between them. In taxonomy, often the delineating line between species is that they cannot cross-breed. But disparate types of Cannabis can indeed produce fertile offspring, not sexually dysfunctional “mules.” Consequently, a debate has raged within botanical circles as to how many species the genus contains. At this time botanists generally recognize a unique family of plants they call “Cannabaceae,” under which are classified the genus Cannabis and its closest botanical relative, Humulus , which contains the beer flavoring, hops. 9 The prevailing opinion currently recognizes three species : C. sativa , C. indica , and C. ruderalis . 10 “Industrial” types fall exclusively within C. sativa , although all Cannabis plants contain stem fiber and can have multiple uses in primitive societies where they are indigenous. Recent analytical advances are leading many scientists to believe that a more accurate and satisfying way to differentiate the different forms of Cannabis would be by their biochemical composition. Cannabis is the only plant genus in which can be found the unique class of molecules known as cannabinoids. Cannabis produces two major cannabinoids— THC (delta-9 tetrahydrocannabinol) and CBD (cannabidiol), and several other minor cannabinoid compounds