David Cameron - No to English Parliament

a reply to: flammadraco

Douglas is right, The Queen and every Prime Minister from Heath onwards are traitors. They have all been complicit in the illegal and treasonous transfer of sovereignty to a foreign government / body - the EU.

a reply to: Freeborn

Diddlysquat to do with the Queen, she has no powers in the UK over laws or sovereignty

Summoning/Proroguing Parliament - The Queen has the power to prorogue (suspend) and to summon (call back) Parliament – prorogation typically happens at the end of a parliamentary session and the summoning occurs shortly after, when The Queen attends the State Opening of Parliament.

Royal Assent - It is The Queen’s right and responsibility to grant assent to bills from Parliament, signing them into law. Whilst in theory she could decide to refuse assent, the last Monarch to do this was Queen Anne in 1708.

Secondary Legislation - The Queen can create Orders-in-Council and Letters Patent which regulate parts to do with the Crown, such as precedence, titles. Orders in Council are often used by Ministers nowadays to bring Acts of Parliament into law.

Appoint/Remove Ministers - Her Majesty also has the power to appoint and remove Ministers of the Crown.

Appointing the Prime Minister - The Queen is responsible for appointing the Prime Minister after a general election or a resignation, in a General Election The Queen will appoint the candidate who is likely to have the most support of the House of Commons. In the event of a resignation, The Queen listens to advice on who should be appointed as their successor.

Declaration of War - The Sovereign retains the power to declare war against other nations, though in practice this is done through the Prime Minister and Parliament of the day.

Freedom From Prosecution - Under British law, The Queen is above the law and cannot be prosecuted – she is also free from civil action.

The Queens Powers

Plus Douglas5 and your definition of treason is a tad off;

treason
ˈtriːz(ə)n/Submit
noun
the crime of betraying one's country, especially by attempting to kill or overthrow the sovereign or government.
"they were convicted of treason"
synonyms: treachery, lese-majesty; More
antonyms: allegiance, loyalty
the action of betraying someone or something.
plural noun: treasons
"doubt is the ultimate treason against faith"
synonyms: treachery, lese-majesty; More
historical
the crime of murdering someone to whom the murderer owed allegiance, such as a master or husband.
noun: petty treason; plural noun: petty treasons

originally posted by: flammadraco
a reply to: douglas5

and no need for the you look like you're avatar jibes why not go to glp or lop for that kind of talk

Every time I see you in a thread I cringe with the uneducated drivel that comes out of your gob, Its embarrassing that our education system failed you so miserably. Instead of spending today on ATS trying to come back at me with some line, why not spend the day learning about Cromwell and the houses of Parliament and then next time there is a thread about this subject, at least you'll know what your talking about.

?????????

In addition, in swearing to uphold our “laws and customs”, she swore in effect to uphold such constitutional laws as are embodied within the Bill of Rights, an Act of Parliament of 16thDecember 1689.

The Bill of Rights declares that “No foreign prince, person, prelate, state, or potentate hath, or ought to have, any jurisdiction, power, superiority, pre-eminence, or authority, ecclesiastical or spiritual, within this realm”.

It is clear then that in granting the Royal assent to the treaties our governments have signed with the EU - which is in effect a foreign power - the QueenIn 2008, a writ was served upon the Queen by 25 barons, in accordance with the terms of Magna Carta.

Here are the relevant extracts from Magna Carta 1215: Articles 52 and 61

Twenty Five Barons…

* (52) To any man whom we have deprived or dispossessed of lands, castles, liberties, or rights, without the lawful judgement of his equals, we will at once restore these. In cases of dispute the matter shall be resolved by the judgement of the twenty-five barons referred to below in the clause for securing the peace. In cases, however, where a man was deprived or dispossessed of something without the lawful judgement has broken her Coronation Oath.

a reply to: douglas5
Wow a link to the bnp web site. That really helps support any argument.

a reply to: ScepticScot

Yea, come on doogle, you could have at least got a better source. Putting a source from bnp was a bad move.

a reply to: flammadraco

By granting Royal Assent she is complicit in the act of transferring sovereignty to a foreign power which by legal definition is treasonous.

I am fully aware that if the monarch was to refuse Royal Assent it would result in a constitutional crisis not seen in this country since The Abdication.

I agree, The Queen should be completely impartial and have no power whatsoever over political matters.
Parliament should be the ultimate authority - but the UK Parliament, and other related Assemblies, and not a European body whose interests and dictates often run contrary to our national interests.

The continued denial of granting the electorate a referendum on continued membership of the EU is becoming increasingly divisive and highlights how out of touch with the electorate our politicians are and how out of date and unrepresentative the current electoral, parliamentary party political system is.

We need radical reform of our electoral and legislative procedures as a matter of the utmost urgency if this country is to free itself from the severe malaise it is currently in.

The leaders of the major political party's have treat the Scottish people with contempt during the debate prior to tomorrows independence referendum.
It seems obvious that they have learnt nothing and are continuing to treat the people of rUK, and England in particular in this instance, with exactly the same level of dismissive contempt.

Regardless of tomorrows outcome now is the time to seize the moment and demand change.

Sadly I fear it'll all fall on deaf ear's and something will conveniently come along that will shift the publics gaze away from such matters and we'll continue with the same old same old amoral and corrupt status quo.

Apologies for going off on a bit of a tangent and the rant like nature of this post but I genuinely fear for the future of this nation and despair in the knowledge of how much better it could and should be.

originally posted by: ScepticScot
a reply to: douglas5
Wow a link to the bnp web site. That really helps support any argument.

What link are you referring to? I cannot see a BNP link.

a reply to: Freeborn

I agree with every single point you made including the reason why the Queen would not use her powers as sovereign.


However this deserves it's own thread so I shall not detail this one anymore.

a reply to: DAZ21

O Doogle, you never used the BNP as your source did you and then advertise the fact here?

I refer to my previous post to you.

Just asking a question because I can't find any answers online....

Why is this world news? I see a lot of it everywhere.... What is the significance of anything on this subject except to the people in the UK and Scotland..

What changes other than internal healthcare/ economics? Just asking cause I honestly do not know and am genuinely interested to know...a reply to: flammadraco

a reply to: wyrmboy12

Not sure where you reside but lets assume the US. It would be the same as Texas allowing its citizens to have a referendum to leave the USA and become an independent country. Something I believe is already in the pipe line for a few states in America, however I think its called "secession" in the US but its the same thing.

If Texas did offer this to its populace hypothetically, then it would also make World News.

Yes Im a yank....and yes Texas has been petitioning to secede for awhile...May go somewhere,. may not ...you never can tell these days...I don't think it would garner much attention though...People here care more about what the Kardashians, their local NFL football team, and their favorite TV shows....However; thanks for the info....

a reply to: flammadraco
Since been removed. Was a link at bottom of post.

Edit: Think you have seen the next post and realised it had been removed.
V poor form to link to bnp then edit out , slight dizzy feeling that we may actually agree on something.

originally posted by: flammadraco
a reply to: andy06shake

Can you give an example what the current Government has done to Scotland that has not been done to Northern Ireland, Wales or England?

Remember had the previous two Scottish Prime Ministers we had for 12 years not run the country into the ground then you would not have austerity in the UK at the moment such as the bed room tax.

you cant blame their nationality as the reason the country was run to ruin
just because they are scottish does not mean thats the reason Britain is #ed its party politics and party manifesto
the leaders are just the front men and lets face it they were voted for in a majority in the rest of the UK

your chopping and changing your tune every new thread you create flammadraco
you made your bed you slept in it just like the rest of us had to

I'll be honest, being a nationalist for the most part, this has allowed me to experience how nationalism blinds rational thought. I will always be a nationalist, to a certain point, the threat by many in this country who wish to simply take over Britain with their own culture and identity is real, in my professional opinion and I probably have vastly more professional experience in the goings on in this country than many. However, I have never allowed nationalist sentiment to cloud fact, Hell, my nationalist sentiment comes from fact. What I have seen in Scotland, is a total disregard for the facts, a skew in reality and nationalist almost extremism running in to overdrive. The same people who denounce UKIP, embrace Scottish nationalism lol. It’s a joke, but a joke with catastrophic consequences.

Scotland is heavily subsidised by Westminster, Britain will be 8-9 billion better off, this is how it is. All that free University, free prescriptions and all the rest of it, yeah, kiss all that goodbye with independence. Public spending will plummet and taxation will rocket, the figures don’t lie, Independent Scotland is unsustainable and that is the real reason the EU mob are against it and hesitant to say whether or not Scotland would get membership to the corrupt EU if they were independent. Makes me laugh, they want Independence, but want to then join the EU, the most authoritarian corrupt entity outside of prison.

Yes I know Scotland is rich in resource, so is Venezuela, so are many cess pit third world states, it matters little.

However, Scotland will not the only one to be hit by this. The UK is finished if this happens, regions will look for independence, the north, Cornwall, Bradford will declare itself an Islamic state. Investment in the UK will leave in a mass exodus and the GBP will plunge. Oh that’s not all, Sectarian division will erupt in to violence, Unionists will sought to rejoin the UK – or whats left of it.

Now none of this will happen overnight, but it will within a short space of time, from latest reports I’d say within 5-10 years.

I wish nothing but the best for Scotland, but just 8% of the population is holding the rest of us to ransom. The same 8% whom are heavily subsidised and get far more than anyone else. If it is Yes, we are in trouble...If it is No, there will be trouble because what has been promised to Scotland at a time when England is falling apart and public spending reduced to F*all, will not be tolerated. Either way, I don’t think anything will ever be the same again in the UK and that’s not a good thing.

a reply to: ScepticScot

LOL, I even gave you a star.

I'm all for you guys to decide your own destiny, just didn't like some parts of the YES campaigns rhetoric towards the English as that in turn now has pived the English off against the Scots and all because some uneducated numptys don't have a clue about what they are talking about.

The aim of this thread was not against the Scots, it was against the three main party leaders making promises to you guys in the event of a NO vote that would have been unfair to the rest of the countries in the union, especially Wales who would loose some £300 million per annum to pay for these promises that had been made.

We have some good debate on ATS, but we have also had some militant opinion by both sides of the debate and that it what lowered the tone.

a reply to: wyrmboy12

I'd also like to add, that no one yet knows of the economical consequences splitting up the union might have. The fact that we live in a world of global economy where if one country enters a recession others may follow, means that even in the US if things do go bad here, it will likely have an effect on you.

But then a lot of people seem to be down playing that scenario. So yes I worry about the consequences of Scottish independence, though I hope they do go and that I'm wrong and everything ends up rainbows and lollipops. Although we don't live in a perfect world and things usually don't go as smoothly as we hope them to.

originally posted by: sapien82

your chopping and changing your tune every new thread you create flammadraco
you made your bed you slept in it just like the rest of us had to

I agree, I have changed my mind several times during this very heated debate, a majority of members have been very civil in this debate and looking at each others opinions and facts, but then you get your more vocal members who are just repeating what has been spoon fed to them without any other facts. When these individuals have been furnished with facts they then state the YES campaigns mantra "Scare mongering" or "Media Biases", Media Propaganda etc.

So far on ATS this week, we have had a member accusing Westminster of plotting to set of a "Dirty Bomb" and actually created a thread on this subject alone. I've lived in Scotland and in a rough part of the country so I know what mentality some YES campaign voters are. The problem is they seem to think that if a YES vote wins they will become rich with the oil revenue. Even if Scotland had enough oil to support your economy for the next 100 years, the every day Joe in the street will not personally see this money. At best some of these folk on Benefits, will keep the status quo, and will probably not have to pay the bedroom tax, and yet they are the most vocal and militant part of the YES campaign.

To be honest, I did want Scotland to stay as part of the Union but after seeing all the anti English sentiment on here and Facebook, Yes I changed my mind. Two weeks ago 70% of the English wanted the Scots to vote NO, I'm sure after seeing all this rhetoric that figure no longer stands. I had someone on Facebook last night accuse the English for introducing the Smoking Ban in Scotland before England. It was diddlysquat to do with the English and was introduced by Scottish MSPs. This was the main reason she wanted to vote YES, on something as simple as this and yet her facts were completely wrong.

It's like a marriage, if one partner keeps on saying how bad their partner is all the time and how much better they would be without them, then the other partner is hardly going to say "O Baby, please don't go", I'm going to open the door and help them pack.

a reply to: flammadraco

This sums it up completely, the facts are lost to blind emotion and almost hatred for us English and by others abroad, lost to blind hatred for the UK. In such conditions, rationale is lost, but it could be costly. It seems to me that many in Scotland are totally ignorant of how their country is run and simply blame Westminster for everything and anything. This ignorance could end up destroying them.

Alex Salmond wants to be the man that history writes of leading Scotland to freedom again, but he could be remembered as the guy who divided up a nation and then watched it burn.

Hands down best response I have seen so far.

2nd line.