U.S. Air Force F-15C crashes in Virginia

If the F-15's get grounded, will they be retired early? What, if anything do we have that can fill that role currently?

a reply to: MystikMushroom

They'll certainly lose some, like they did last time. Currently the only option is to buy new airframes from Boeing, or buy new airframes from Boeing. Unless they want to replace them with F-16s, in which case they buy new airframes from Lockheed Martin.

a reply to: Zaphod58
The Eagle cruises at around 550 kts and if it broke up at that speed that's enough energy to knock you out immediately. Wasn't there an E model that crashed off of the Virginia coast where the pilot ejected at something like 700 kts straight down? The pilot spent two years in the hospital. This is the fastest surviving ejection that I'm aware...his back seater died in the process.

I've read that the Russians have developed an ejection seat that is approved for 600 plus knots. I think that the canopy is not separated on ejection but falls down in front of the pilot during the first part of the ejection sequence. It is jettisoned when speed permits.

The most critical thing that the military needs to teach is to eject while you are still in the safe ejection envelop. Pilots tend to stay too long trying to save the airplane. There's video of an A6 pilot ejecting horizontal to the water after a bad cat shot. I don't know if his parachute actually deployed but he survived.

a reply to: buddah6

Well, I can sort of understand the instinct to want to "save the plane" ... but if it was me, "ALL THE NOPES IM OUT!"

This is probably why I'd be crappy fighter pilot... "MM, you didn't need to eject -- the plane could have been saved. You just wasted millions of dollars AGAIN".

a reply to: buddah6

He was at 760 knots IIRC when they punched out. It crushed the WSO's chest when he hit the air stream, but the pilot survived somehow.

This pilot was reportedly highly experienced, so he would have known when to get out. This was something that hit too fast for him to react to. He noticed the initial problem and declared an IFE, and then it hit too fast for him to get out. The IFE call probably came at the very start of the problem, and it just didn't stop as he expected it to.

The pilot was identified this afternoon as Lt. Col. Morris Moose Fontenot Jr. He was a dedicated combat pilot, and instructor pilot, and the 104th Fighter Wing Inspector General. He graduated the Air Force Academy in 1996, and during his Active Duty career he served in several theaters including the Middle East, and earned the Meritorious Service medal. He had 17 years flying the F-15.

a reply to: MystikMushroom
You know, it's a mind-set that is beaten into all pilot from day #1. I just hope this guy didn't suffer too much.

This really is a sad development, my condolences to the family and his fellow pilots.

a reply to: Zaphod58

They are all heroes to me!

a reply to: buddah6

With that level of experience, I don't think he made the mistake of staying with it when it wasn't savable. You eventually reach a point where you realize that you can save some, and you can't save others. Even if you try to save it, you recognize that there's a point where you just can't. With 17 years in the cockpit, he would be better suited than most to recognize that point.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: buddah6

With that level of experience, I don't think he made the mistake of staying with it when it wasn't savable. You eventually reach a point where you realize that you can save some, and you can't save others. Even if you try to save it, you recognize that there's a point where you just can't. With 17 years in the cockpit, he would be better suited than most to recognize that point.

I agree with you that experience is key in IFE and this is why I think this accident was an instant catastrophic failure.

why the pilot dont eject if he is at high altitude ? or was the speed to high for ejection ?

i remember an F15 pilot at night suddenly lost instruments and forced to eject at high speed and he got severely wounded because of that..

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: lambchop

This is what happens when you force a machine to operate far longer than it was intended to.

Not really: If an aircraft is maintained properly it can be flown almost forever. We have re-skinned fuselages , re-built center sections, and control surfaces on a multitude of aircraft built in the 30s and 40s which are still flying today.. The aircraft I used to do airshows in was built in the late 40s and after re-build went from an 85 H.P. engine to a 225 H.P. and a hard life of weekend airshow Acro.. Again the key word is well maintained..

originally posted by: buntalanlucu
why the pilot dont eject if he is at high altitude ? or was the speed to high for ejection ?

i remember an F15 pilot at night suddenly lost instruments and forced to eject at high speed and he got severely wounded because of that..

This is the reason that I said that was an instant catastrophic failure. Either he was trapped and couldn't eject or he was incapacitated in some way..

a reply to: 727Sky

That's absolutely correct! There's a B 17 touring the country and it must be 70 years old. Some say that these old warbird's are in better shape than when they were on active duty.

When I was younger, I tried to fly as many warbirds as I could. It was a pretty impressive list and I'm still here...

originally posted by: buddah6
a reply to: 727Sky

That's absolutely correct! There's a B 17 touring the country and it must be 70 years old. Some say that these old warbird's are in better shape than when they were on active duty.

When I was younger, I tried to fly as many warbirds as I could. It was a pretty impressive list and I'm still here...

Yep ! people think aircraft are like cars but even at that I have seen some 1920 and 1930 type cars restored to better than new condition.. There are several B-17s still flying along with P-51s and other war birds.. Lucky you that you got to fly some.. We had a Spanish BF-109 in the paint shop at Hooks airport a few years ago which had been totally restored and a couple of months later a Spitfire.. I think the Brits hand drilled all the original holes in the airframe (?) nothing was easy during a re-skin of the Spitfire. Lone Star flight museum had a flyable P-38, Hellcat, and even a static display B-58 Hustler just to name a few aircraft that they flew during airshows. Great days and great aircraft.

www.foxnews.com...
www.huffingtonpost.com...
heres two right in the town I live in happened in the last year.
what goes up must come down

one was a drone the other a f 22 the drone died
the raptor pilot lived

a reply to: 727Sky

My wife bought me a right seat ride in a B17 for my birthday many moons ago. I was flying DHC-7s at the time as my civilian job and it was an interesting contrast to a 4 radial engine airplane.

You mentioned the Spanish Bf 109 rebuild. I also bought a ride in a Spanish He 111 when it was touring the US.

originally posted by: midnightstar
www.foxnews.com...
www.huffingtonpost.com...
heres two right in the town I live in happened in the last year.
what goes up must come down

Military flying is or never has been perfectly safe compared to civilian flying. This is probably due to the military trying to eak out every ounce of performance it can from it's airplanes.

Drones like the QF 4 are already worn out and really not safe for human flight. The last bit of use for these old birds are as high performance targets for F22s.