Ukraine "hits Russian Armoured Column" amid aid impasse

Ukraine says it has partially destroyed an armoured column crossing from Russia, as a controversial Russian aid convoy still waits at the border.

Nato said the column was a military "incursion", prompting the UK to summon Russia's envoy to explain.

Russia's defence ministry denied any such column had entered Ukraine.

Meanwhile Ukrainian border guards have arrived to inspect Russia's aid convoy, which was sent to help eastern Ukraine cities held by pro-Russian rebels.

The alleged incursion by Russian military vehicles into Ukraine was witnessed on Thursday by two UK newspaper reporters.

The BBC's Daniel Sandford in Moscow says the crossing was a reminder of the extent to which the Kremlin has been backing the rebellion in

Ukraine "hits Russian Armoured Column" amid aid impasse

Unconfirmed reports that the Ukraine has destroyed at least part of a "Russian Armoured Column" crossing the border near Donetsk.

There is no confirmation yet nor details whether these were actual Russians or Russian backed seperatists, but the UK has summoned the Russian ambassador to explain.

EDIT: Self-removed as it would appear the Mod's got to the above poster first.

a reply to: stumason

As always, Mr. Confusion back for a lesson. Are you saying that the armored column entering Ukraine is unconfirmed? Or that Ukrainian forces destroyed some of the vehicles is unconfirmed?

It seems, from your article, that there is no question of the existence of the armored column going into Ukraine, but am I misunderstanding you?

originally posted by: charles1952
a reply to: stumason

As always, Mr. Confusion back for a lesson. Are you saying that the armored column entering Ukraine is unconfirmed? Or that Ukrainian forces destroyed some of the vehicles is unconfirmed?

It seems, from your article, that there is no question of the existence of the armored column going into Ukraine, but am I misunderstanding you?

Wind your neck in, fella. Mr Confusion?

This it isn't my article. I would have thought the BBC banner at the top of the page and the reporters name on the article itself was a bit of a giveaway!

Care to comment on the topic, rather than go for the tired and predictable ad hominem?

a reply to: stumason

Dear stumason,

What confusion we have here. You've been around for a decade and you don't know that I'm Mr. Confusion? So, I'll change my post to this:

As always, Mr. Confusion back for a lesson. Are you saying that the armored column entering Ukraine is unconfirmed? Or that Ukrainian forces destroyed some of the vehicles is unconfirmed?

It seems, from the article you posted, that there is no question of the existence of the armored column going into Ukraine, but am I misunderstanding the article you posted?

It was an honest question because I wasn't sure I had the full meaning of the words.

With respect,
Charles1952

a reply to: charles1952

And, once again, I am not saying anything, but merely posting a news article.

That much is evident from my OP:

Unconfirmed reports that the Ukraine has destroyed at least part of a "Russian Armoured Column" crossing the border near Donetsk.

There is no confirmation yet nor details whether these were actual Russians or Russian backed separatists, but the UK has summoned the Russian ambassador to explain.

I really don't understand where the confusion is - pun intended.

a reply to: stumason

Then if I understand the article correctly, the article that you had nothing to do with, it is claiming that there was an armored column entering Ukraine from Russia. It has not been verified that Ukrainian forces destroyed any of the armored vehicles.

The identities of the drivers are unknown, but they were driving Russian vehicles from Russia into Ukraine.

Do I finally understand what you believe the article is trying to say?

I told you I was Mr. Confusion.

a reply to: charles1952

Indeed... That is what the article would appear to be saying.

Considering there are many who would fall into the "Pro-Russia" camp, I thought I would stress the "no confirmation" line as there is no "independent" confirmation this even took place. The only witnesses being two reporters from Western papers, apparently.

Whilst I may appear to come down on the Pro-Western side, I do like things to be confirmed as best as possible. For all we know, this could be a Kiev trick, or it could just be them hitting some separatists instead of actual Russian Army. The BBC article does stress that point as well.

a reply to: charles1952

I think it's quite easy to understand, even for an uneducated layman- Ukraine/Nato say there was a column of russian armored vehicles that came into the Ukraine, the Ukraine government say they destroyed part of the column, Russia denies any incursion, newspaper article stays vague, as at the moment, it is just a bunch of governments telling different stories with no substantial proof from either side, business as usual.

It has indeed been in the news that a Russian armoured column has been destroyed by Ukraine when it crossed the border.
But there has been no confirmation of it, so i doubt that this has happened.

Seeing all those empty trucks, i cannot refrain myself from thinking that military equipment has been unloaded before dawn.
This is of course speculation on my part, but heavy trucks like these, double axles, and yet the trailers are almost empty.
Russia's answer

Russia Tries To Explain Why The Aid Trucks Are Empty
"The KAMAZes were not loaded fully so that there wouldn't be excessive wear on automobiles that were not yet broken in, many of which were of 2014 make. It would mean that in case of a breakdown of the mechanics and a stop on the highway, reloading the cargo by hand to other vehicles completely filled to capacity, would be quite difficult. Moreover, a fully-loaded truck does not go fast enough uphill, so in view of the large number of vehicles, this would have had a heavy impact on the speed of the convoy's movement. And the cargo must be delivered quickly in light of the difficult humanitarian situation in the east of Ukraine."

Those truck may be coming back from the Ukraine fuller than when they arrive...possibly preparing the way out for provocateurs from mother Russia....

The exsplanation is a bit onky for the light loads....

a reply to: Syyth007

Dear Syyth007,

Nato, Ukraine, two reporters. That adds up to more evidence than usually is required on ATS. The only opposing opinion on the subject is Russia's? Do you think the two piles of evidence are roughly equal?

With respect,
Charles1952

a reply to: stirling

The exsplanation is a bit onky for the light loads....

It sure is, it would be easy to just exchange a truck, if a truck does get mechanical problems.
no need to reload the cargo by hand, a trailer will not cause any problem unless it has faulty brakes or the wheels come off which is unlikely if regularly checked.

Nato (who wants control over Ukraine) has intel about Russia breaching the boarder. Ukraine (who wants control over Ukraine) accuses Russia of crossing the boarder. 2 British journalists that were there to cover a Russian aid convoy that has not been able to cross into Ukraine, spotted this Column (the news showed stock footage of military personal carriers) crossing at another location.

Are we believing Russia is stupid now? They have managed to garnish sanctions from the west. That is cause enough to give them a little credit. Russia has denied this and I see no reason, under the circumstances , why that should not be given as much credence as Ukraine's version of the event/fabrication.

At least those journalists got a better story than watching aid supplies sit in trucks. Good for them

There is always so much propaganda being spread before it can be verified that it gets kind of tiring. You can read something and not know if it happened as they say it did. Seems like this will be going on for a few years again. It was so peaceful for a while, all we had to worry about was our government twisting the truth before. That was easy to detect, you could flip a two headed coin and always be right, our government and their agencies hardly ever tells us the complete truth.

Still waiting for Kiev's evidence and NATO that they actually destroyed the Convoy, if they did they would be in a war with Russia.

This proves that someone is dersapate to start a war against Russia and thats not Russia.

a reply to: earthling42

i cannot refrain myself from thinking that military equipment has been unloaded before dawn.

I cannot refrain myself from thinking that this is nothing more then Kiev's little desperate propaganda to pull Russia into an war.

a reply to: Agent_USA_Supporter

Ah, yes, if Canada annexes an american state, fights in another state and calls out a peoples republic of whatever in a part of that state, Amerika should not fight back, but find a peacefull and diplomatic solution, otherwise Amerika might try to lure Canada into a war if they defend themselves.

Your logic.exe seems to be contaminated.

Good news for the people in Luhansk.In Starobilsk in the northern Luhansk region, red cross has unloaded Ukrainian aid into storage.
Its trucks will start distributing tomorrow.